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So I'm making character I've had brewing in my mind for a game. A Grippli Cleric of Cayden Cailean. The character creation is 25 pts, 2 traits, lvl 3, starting wealth is 3140 gp. Here is what I've got:
Race: Grippli
Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 13
Int: 10
Wis: 18
Cha: 14
Traits: Jungle Guide, Fortified Drinker
Domains: Liberation, Travel
Skills: Diplomacy 3 ranks, Heal 1 rank, Knowledge Religion 1 rank, Linguistics 1 rank, Peception 1 rank, Sense Motive 1 rank
Feats: Selective Channelling, ???
So I could use some advise on a second feat as well as what other feats I should take. And equipment since I haven't played many clerics. I'm thinking of being primarily a caster with maybe a little range as well. Thanks in advance to everyone's advice.
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No, just fits the characters background having been raised in a swamp (plus geting Perception as a Class Skill). Sorry, I did pick up Glider though, not sure of giving up Camo (quite a few forests one has to travel through in a quite a few games). Don't know much about the game other than it will be episodic and will mostly be dungeon crawl/combat.
A question: what is the purpose of this cleric?
Buffer, Combat, Debuffer, Healer, Other (multiple answers work)?
- Gauss
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I'm leaning toward Buffer/Healer and taking ranged shots when not doing the others. I thought also about taking Weapon Finesse and eventually getting a Guided Rapier. Thought it might be a tad harder pull off than range. I also thought about taking a 1 level dip in Gunslinger to do range touch attacks. I'd like to hear what would be the best combat path to take.
Before counting on the Guided weapon property I would confirm it is ok with your GM since it is 3.5 material.
There really is no best combat path. However, ranged is very hard for a cleric to pull off due to the feat tree. My preference has been to take advantage of the Longspear to keep a cleric far enough out of combat to use spells when necessary while still being effective.
Healing is usually considered a substandard option since damage prevention is far more effective. You cannot keep up with the damage dished out. I no longer bother with healer builds (not to say I do not heal, just I do not build towards them).
So some comments about your specific build so far:
Unless your GM approves Guided and you want to go for Weapon Finesse consider the Agile weapon property.
If Guided is out an 18 Wisdom is not really worthwhile since you are not planning on doing much in the way of debuffing. I would consider putting some of that into constitution since you will be up close.
A 14 charisma is really only useful for healing and maybe in an anti-undead campaign. I would reduce it.
Feats:
Weapon Finesse is good.
Weapon Focus should be considered.
If your GM is allowing crafting feats I would certainly pick up Craft Wondrous Item and maybe Craft Arms and Armor. For combat heavy builds I also suggest Craft Rod (Quicken Rods to get two buff spells off in a single round).
Agile Tongue might be worth considering.
Skills: Perception is a must. Max it out. If you get that first action during the surprise round you can buff yourself or others. If you don't you are a round behind.
Unfortunately, cleric builds can be difficult. Unless you have a clear focus your feats can meander a lot. I would seriously consider a focus and build towards it.
- Gauss
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Guided is actually in one of the Splat books for Parhfinder (Pathfinder 10: A History of Ashes) but your right it's not core so I'll ask.
What about a lvl of Gunslinger? The GM has already said that it is emerging in his world.
Ideally I'd like to be Buffer/Debuffer that can do something meaningful in combat other than the above since I don't want to be twiddling my thumbs when I run out of spells. Oh, and like having the 14 in Cha since it affords me a decent bonus to social skills (which do come up even in dungeons).
Prospector,
Pathfinder 10 was 3.5 material. Check the publication date.
Regarding charisma for social skills, up to you, but you can do that via magic items. 4500gp gives you a +3 bonus to all social skills. It is my experience that charisma is usually wasted on clerics.
A dip into Gunslinger could work, personally I wouldnt do it since that would impact your spell advancement.
If you want to go debuffer then you are going necromancy (which does not mean evil).
My cleric's favorite spells are:
Shield of Faith (1st)
Divine Favor (1st)
Longstrider (1st, domain)
Pilfering Hand (2nd)
Spiritual Weapon (2nd)
Grace (2nd)
Blindness/Deafness (3rd)
Bestow Curse (3rd)
Aura of Doom (4th)
Dimension Door (4th, Domain)
Spiritual Ally (4th)
His starting wisdom was only 17 (now 20) but his DCs by 8th level for all necro spells is 17+spell level due to Spell Focus Necro and Gr. Spell Focus Necro.
My cleric rarely has to heal anyone because he prevents a lot of damage via the Bodyguard feat (combined with the Helpful trait).
When not casting spells he uses a longspear to trip the enemies or just to hurt them. You could do similarly with a rapier build (without the tripping).
- Gauss
Desna, he has the Domains Luck-Curse and Travel.
- Gauss
Rangerjeff,
Silence is a good spell, I try to always have a wand of it. :)
- Gauss
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Interesting rangerjeff. I play a lot of Society, so I'm pretty sure I want Selective Channelling as my 1st feat (don't want to heal the enemy if I can help it). Since Guided is in play definitely going with a Rapier as my primary weapon. And while I generally dislike Two Weapon Fighting, those Net feats do look interesting. Never used nets before, are they any good? Don't they have a straight & low DC to escape from?
Edit: And wouldn't I need to take Agile Maneuvers to really be able to use Combat maneuvers well?
So the rule regarding combat maneuvers is that for trip, disarm, and sunder you can use all of the applicable bonuses for your weapon. This includes wisdom if that is what you use for the weapon.
Regarding nets: Nets are a flat DC20 Escape artist check.
The net should allow you to use your dexterity for CMB checks but it is a grey area. The FAQ applies to Weapon Finesse (which does not apply to the Net) but the blog indicates that any bonuses which apply to that weapon also apply to the CMB for certain Combat Maneuvers such as Disarm, Trip, and Sunder. So you need to check with (and possibly educate) your GM. Regardless, your size is going to give you a penalty.
Regarding Selective Channeling, I am curious why the focus on healing? While it is useful from time to time it really is subpar. A properly built cleric should be able to prevent most damage. Heck, my cleric gives people around him a +4 AC bonus against 3 (soon 4) attacks per round. :)
- Gauss
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I have been in far too many fights in Society play where a series of bad roles on our side and a series of good ones on the other side had the party on our knees. No cleric can be prepared for everything. I can't tell you how many times I've seen a Channel keep a character from hitting their -Con. So I'd rather be able to heal than not. And it is only one feat to make sure I'm only healing the party.
Prospector, don't misunderstand me, Im not saying channeling cannot save the day in the right situation. Im just saying there are other choices that also save the day. :)
Personally, I prefer never letting someone hit you to begin with. Trip, accuracy reduction, and AC boosting can all help. But, it is a personal choice :)
My main cleric build trips the enemy, channels energy when he must, moves speed 50, boosts the AC of those around him by +4 in addition to any spells he pops, reduces the effectiveness of the enemy attacks to begin with. Etc etc.
A favorite trick? Ready an action to take the weapon (pilfering hand) or trip when the enemy is about to attack the ally I am guarding. Totally screws up the enemy. That is in addition to Bodyguard which grants a +4 AC boost.
In any case, regarding your build. I would go with Spell Focus Necro (and Gr. Spell Focus necro) if you really want to debuff. A lot of damage reduction comes out of that.
- Gauss
It is ok, but on a cleric SF Conj is going to be a waste. For a Sorc/Wizard it is much more valuable.
Out of curiousity, are you trying to avoid SF necro? Many people associate Necro with evil for some reason.
- Gauss
Prospector, some of the best necro spells are not evil. In fact, there are only 14 evil necro spells (out of 55) from the APG, CRB, UC, and UM combined.
Of the necro spells Bane, Doom, Blindness/Deafness, Bestow Curse, Aura of Doom, Major Curse, Harm, and Destruction are some of the best and none of them are evil. My cleric is just fine not using any of the evil necro spells. :)
Rangerjeff, a cleric cannot cast evil spells if he is good aligned or worships a good aligned god. Still, a good cleric can cast necromancy spells just fine if they are not evil (which most aren't).
- Gauss
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Clerical Advice? Always, always file alphanumerically. That way other people can figure out the system too.