I'm having a problem with players abusing the following two tactics:
1. Mind Blank + Gr. Invisibility: Seem to work together. Can't seem to do anything about it (specifically states wish/miracle) does not reveal. I had an NPC cleric use the 25,000gp diamond dust kicker to ask for a targeted dispel on everything in the room to justify dispelling it, but I have no idea what else to do about it.
2. I have a cleric who has somehow built his feats to a point where instead of channeling like a normal cleric, he channel smites with his weapon. His channel ability dazes the enemy with a pretty disturbingly high Will save. He can do this many, many times a day, all while hitting for 3d6 + 1.5x str bonus. Seems there is *nothing* that is immune to daze.
Any suggestions?
I dont see the dazing part of channel smite. As far as mind blank+ invis. Start using glitterdust?
Indeed Glitterdust and/or listen checks. Invisible doesn't mean they stop making noise.
Channel smite adds channel damage to attacks. So maybe hes channeling for 1d6 and is greatswording. for a total of 3d6 with 1.5str
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#1. Completely within the rules. Does not fool blindsense, tremorsense, etc., and faerie fire is a good spell to reveal invisible targets if one knows the square the enemy is in.
#2. Are you using the Variant Rules for clerics? Assuming you are, it appears your player cleric is using the Rulership Variant Feat in order to use a "harm" channel (requiring neutral or evil alignment) to daze living enemies one round. He can do this as many times as he has a channel. The effect deals 1/2 of the channel damage and, if the Will save vs. channeling is failed, are dazed 1 round as well. This will not work against undead, constructs, or anything that is otherwise immune to negative energy.
Once this variant is chosen, the player cannot use the original rules for channeling, though they can apply feats that modify channeling.
If it all checks out on paper, then this does apply. On a personal level, I do hope the player is choosing Rulership and the variant for a roleplaying reason and not because it gives a great combat bonus. But I digress...
1) Blindsense/Blindsight/Termorsense/Lifesense. Also glitterdust/faerie fire on any of the above or with a good preception roll.
2) I'm not sure how he is dazing. Channel smite and greater channel smite only add damage even if varient channeling is used. More information is required but my spider sense is telling me it's probably not legal - at least it doesn't seem that way to me.
Does the cleric channel negative energy? Make sure that a positive channeling cleric isn't hitting living enemies with channel smite.
You empower your weapon with the might of your deity, which you discharge as you strike your foes.
Prerequisites: Channel energy class feature, Channel Smite, base attack bonus +8.
Benefit: Before making any melee attacks on your turn, you can use a swift action to expend one daily use of your channel energy class feature. The dice from your channel energy feature form a pool of damage dice you can access to further damage creatures normally harmed by the energy you are channeling—undead for positive energy, living creatures for negative energy. Prior to making each melee attack, allocate dice from the pool to be used as extra damage dice if you hit. Your target can make a Will save, as normal, to halve this extra damage. This extra damage is not multiplied when you score a critical hit. If you miss, the extra damage dice remain in your pool, but any dice left unexpended at the end of your turn are wasted.
Alternatively, start using a lot of AOE traps. As long as they hit the trigger, it doesn't matter that no one can see them :).
1. Might take a bit of bestiary diving, but higher level Undead Anatomy or Monstrous Physique spells would allow your BBEG to take the form of an undead or monstrous humanoid with Blindsense or Tremorsense. There should be some creature to polymorph into which will not interfere with spellcasting and have the relevant abilities somewhere. After that its a quickened glitterdust and back to ass kicking.
Or, if you don't have any BBEG's handy, summon monster 3 will get a dire bat to spot them for glitterdusting, if you've got a level 5 or so caster to spare. Or any bat familiars, or other blindsense/lifesense/tremorsense undeads raised.
2. As for channeled smites and melee dazing, I'm not familiar with the feats he's using to get that, but personally I'd say let him. Build less encounters with single enemies and keep em a bit more spread out and call it a day.
Daze can get REALLY bad if it's made AOE by way of Dazing spell metamagic, but on melee attacks it's not something to worry over.
Sorry about the late reply.
The cleric is doing this through variant channeling. Rulership. It seems pretty broken to me as almost nothing has 'daze' immunity.
Does this count as negative energy though??
Also, he is just getting an enlarge to turn his greatsword from 2d6 to 3d6
Also, how would an NPC go about acquiring blindsense/tremorsense/lifesense etc.. without it coming from divination, which is what Mind Blank is truly trumping.
Summon monster, undead anatomy, or monstrous physique will work for spells. A custom magic item could work too, like a helm of dragon senses with form of the dragon as the relevant spell. Or boots of the blind bandit for tremorsense.
The alternative solution: enemies use resistance to (favourite element) and just nuke the entire room. Who cares they can't see the enemy, they are bound to be in the general vicinity :).
^ This stuff relevant. I might just end up banning the rulership channeling variant. Seems a little unbalanced to me compared to the majority of the other channeling variants.
Mind Blank does not protect from Invisibility Purge
Sorry about the late reply.
The cleric is doing this through variant channeling. Rulership. It seems pretty broken to me as almost nothing has 'daze' immunity.
Does this count as negative energy though??
Also, he is just getting an enlarge to turn his greatsword from 2d6 to 3d6
Rules time!
Does the cleric channel positive energy or negative energy? This question is key!
A variant channeling either modifies positive channeled energy when used to heal or modifies negative energy when used to harm.
VARIENT CHANNELING DOES NOT AFFECT POSITIVE ENERGY WHEN USED TO HARM OR NEGATIVE ENERGY USED TO HEAL. Sorry for the caps, but this point is often missed.
There are four ways to channel energy -
Positive (Heal Living)
Positive (Harm Undead)
Negative (Heal Undead)
Negative (Harm Living)
Varient channeling only works on two of these four. Positive (Harm Undead) and Negative (Heal Undead) are not affected by it.
Rulership: Heal—Creatures gain a channel bonus on Diplomacy checks and to the DC of their language-dependent and charm effects until the end of your next turn. Harm—Creatures are dazed for 1 round.
If your cleric is good or has a good god they will never ever get the daze effect. If they are are evil then they will never get the diplomacy effect. A neutral cleric worshiping a neutral god could potentially do both with the Versitile Channeler feat.
Personally I'd also rule that if Channel Smite is used with varient channeling only damage is caused, not any additional effects.
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Summon monster, undead anatomy, or monstrous physique will work for spells. A custom magic item could work too, like a helm of dragon senses with form of the dragon as the relevant spell. Or boots of the blind bandit for tremorsense.
I'm not finding these boots. Where are they from? I have a caster who could really use some enhanced sences.
Also a couple of different ways to get senses on a human(ish) PC/NPC without shifting/summoning - Dragon Disiple (blindsense), Oracle with Life Mystery (lifesense), Synthesist Summoner (Scent/Blindsense/Blindsight)
Also animal companions/eidilons are good to have around too. Many animals have scent and eidilons can even get blindsight. If you have an animal with scent make sure it knows the track trick.
Echolocation also gives Blindsight and is available to a bunch of casters.
Summon monster, undead anatomy, or monstrous physique will work for spells. A custom magic item could work too, like a helm of dragon senses with form of the dragon as the relevant spell. Or boots of the blind bandit for tremorsense.I'm not finding these boots. Where are they from? I have a caster who could really use some enhanced sences.
Sorry, both were custom magic items. I should have specified.
I'm not really sure on how to price it, except that it should be expensive. That kind of thing usually takes me a couple hours of rule book and calculator work to figure out.There is an item called tremor boots in ultimate equipment, but
1) They only give tremorsense of 20 feet.
2) They are based on the see invisibility spell and have a divination aura
In my opinion, they would not work against mindblank.
There's also a hand of stone in ultimate equipment, but it is again based on a divination spell, and requires a standard action to activate.
...Actually, now that I have a chance to look through it, there is an eye slot item in ultimate magic called eyes of the dragon which is pretty much exactly what I had in mind. Transmutation aura and based on a polymorph spell so it should work against mindblank. Gives blindsense 60 feet and 120 feet of darkvision.
110k GP.
For the rulership, he's definitely channeling negative energy to harm living. I remember him specifically saying it was the harm effect.
As for the Mind blank discussion. Invisibility purge sounds fantastic, but most of these other things listed only have ranges of 30-40 ft. so the sneaky caster can go MB Gr.Invis and just stay 60 feet away and blast blast blast. (Or save or die)
For the rulership, he's definitely channeling negative energy to harm living. I remember him specifically saying it was the harm effect.
As for the Mind blank discussion. Invisibility purge sounds fantastic, but most of these other things listed only have ranges of 30-40 ft. so the sneaky caster can go MB Gr.Invis and just stay 60 feet away and blast blast blast. (Or save or die)
Is he a neutral or evil cleric? What is his diety?
As for the Mind blank discussion. Invisibility purge sounds fantastic, but most of these other things listed only have ranges of 30-40 ft. so the sneaky caster can go MB Gr.Invis and just stay 60 feet away and blast blast blast. (Or save or die)
At high enough levels to worry about mind blank you should be able to summon quite a few dire bats (fly speed 40, blindsense 40) with summon monster 5 (1d4+1 bats.) If you send them out to patrol the combat area they will find the enemy casters very swiftly. You can haste them as well. You can also hasten earth elementals and use their tremorsense if the party isn't bothering to fly. Have them attack the invisible enemies and have your caster hit that area with invisibility purge or glitterdust.
Hell, cast summon minor monster and watch them groan in despair as their invincible strategy is beaten by a first level spell summoning 1d3 regular bats.
Sleetstorms suggestion of the echolocation spell is pretty fantastic. I had not seen that spell before.
Follower of Gorum. CN god.
N aligned I think.