Tiefling Sorcerer (The Silvertongued Build)

[DaedalusV]

I've used search on the forums and found a couple of threads with similar design choices. Here's the build:

Tiefling (alternate racial traits: Rakshasa)

Switch out rakshasa skilled feat with BEguiling Liar (+4 bluff)

Switch out Fiendish Sorcery for Prehensile Tail (flavour, closer to Rakshasa look)

Take the Sorcerer Class

Choose Rakshasa bloodline

make sure you have 20 in charisma (or just 19 with the 20 on lvl 4)

Now according to my calculations this will give you:

1 (rank) +3 (class skill) +4 (racial) + 5(bloodline power) + 5 (charisma stat bonus) = +18 on 8 bluff checks per day (+13 on the rest)

Getting a high bluff like the above is done with no feats dedicated to it.

you could take deceitful and skill focus (bluff) for +5 (+10 with 10 ranks)

Anyways. Is a Rakshasa blooded Tiefling Sorcerer with the Rakshasa bloodline within the allowed ruleset? As in, is the above method for rolling it within RAW/Legit or do I need to take the Fiendish Heritage Feat to get the Rakshasa template instead of the standard Tiefling (which would further give me a trait from 3 d100 rolls)

If it's allowable w/o fiendish heritage I'd choose Armour profiency light + arcane armour training (@ lvl 4) and rock a Mithril Shirt like a baws with no spell failure risk OR devote the 2 feats to further put my bluff checks into overdrive..

I see lots of quite potent char concepts in this forum, but most I see are oriented towards combat encounters more than avoiding combat. The Silvertongued build is my first attempt (in Pathfinder) to maximize a social skill check over BAB/spell DCs/AC etc etc.

Any good class/race choices out there for Diplomacy? and Intimidate?

[Anonymous Visitor 163 576]

It's fun, I like it.

You might be able to push a little more with Cross-blooded. I'd grab something to push up enchantment DC's, or to widen what you can get away with with more abilities.

The intimidate build is going to be a half-orc inquisitor, you can do a search for that.

The diplomacy build used to be a half-elf bard in 3.5, I'm not sure what the best choice is now, but half-elf bard would still do well enough as is.

[Sitri]

This is almost the build of my primary character. While the tail is nice, I would strongly recommend against dumping fiendish sorcery. If you take one of those two blood lines, I think for if you take a feat which could also get you rakshasa blood line, it is almost like a plus four on your main stat.

You do not need fiendish heritage to take alternate heritage, it is listed in additional resources as legal, the big list of a hundred alternate trait s is not legal.

I feel like I lose the AC game even when I am buffed, you may later regret armor training. BAB scales much faster than your AC will. Flight, invisible, blink, and the like are nice alternatives to AC for a sorcerer.

Sorry no links. Posting on a mobile device.

[DaedalusV]

rkraus2 wrote:

It's fun, I like it.

You might be able to push a little more with Cross-blooded. I'd grab something to push up enchantment DC's, or to widen what you can get away with with more abilities.

The intimidate build is going to be a half-orc inquisitor, you can do a search for that.

The diplomacy build used to be a half-elf bard in 3.5, I'm not sure what the best choice is now, but half-elf bard would still do well enough as is.

I'm not really seeing the advantage of Crossblooded in this build, I get access to spells later than I already do as a sorcerer for the advantage of choosing and picking powers/feats etc from two bloodlines..

The Rakshasa Sorcerer Bloodline has all the things I would think I would want from powers, spells and feats... The lvl 1 power is a main component in the build. The Tiefling racial choices were made to further bring the char concept in line with a PC caster with very strong ties to the Rakshasa race. Going for 2 bloodlines would be a bit munchkin'ish.

tyvm tho. I'll be looking into the orc intimidator and some kind of diplomacy wielder :P

[DaedalusV]

Sitri wrote:

This is almost the build of my primary character. While the tail is nice, I would strongly recommend against dumping fiendish sorcery. If you take one of those two blood lines, I think for if you take a feat which could also get you rakshasa blood line, it is almost like a plus four on your main stat.

You do not need fiendish heritage to take alternate heritage, it is listed in additional resources as legal, the big list of a hundred alternate trait s is not legal.

I feel like I lose the AC game even when I am buffed, you may later regret armor training. BAB scales much faster than your AC will. Flight, invisible, blink, and the like are nice alternatives to AC for a sorcerer.

Sorry no links. Posting on a mobile device.

Very true points. Going for the tail is purely for flavour (Handy Haversack + tail should give me the ability to procure any lightweight item stored there with the tail while keeping hands free for other stuff. Plus there's a couple of feats worth looking at that might make that tail a great gimmick both in-combat and out of combat.)

Fiendish sorcery pidgeonholes me into choosing one of two bloodlines, I wanted to avoid those purely because I've seen too many tiefling sorcs utilizing those two bloodlines. Oh and AFAIK +2 to sorcerer class abilities =/= +2 on caster level of spells. It would grant me extra uses on powers, not much more than that.

The base build doesn't use feats, putting feats towards armoured casting may be the suboptimal choice. But it would fit the concept quite well (people don't expect chain shirt wearers to suddenly cast spells) Alternatively I could go for the armour training from bloodline bonus feat progression.

[Sitri]

Improved Fiendish Sorcery
Your skill with foul sorcery is even more potent than that
of others of your race.
Prerequisites: Fiendish sorcery racial trait, tiefling.
Benefit: If you are a sorcerer and possess the Rakshasa
bloodline (Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Magic 68) or Shadow
bloodline (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Player’s Guide 140), treat your Charisma score as 2 points higher for all sorcerer
class abilities.

You sound pretty sure about your decisions, but I posted this one in case you were interested.

[DaedalusV]

Sitri wrote:

Improved Fiendish Sorcery

Your skill with foul sorcery is even more potent than that
of others of your race.
Prerequisites: Fiendish sorcery racial trait, tiefling.
Benefit: If you are a sorcerer and possess the Rakshasa
bloodline (Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Magic 68) or Shadow
bloodline (Pathfinder RPG Advanced Player’s Guide 140), treat your Charisma score as 2 points higher for all sorcerer
class abilities.

You sound pretty sure about your decisions, but I posted this one in case you were interested.

TYVM, I've been reading up on Fiendish sorcery and the above mentioned feat you're suggesting. There's a couple of things I could change on the build to make it stronger/more powerful, but since I usually play pathfinder as a GM and not a player I try to balance my build choices a bit so I don't get too far into munchkin land..

Since I already removed the -2 cha penalty for being Tiefling (Rakshasa spawn) the Fiendish Sorcery/Improved Fiendish Sorcery choices become way too strong (if the forums are right on the interpretation of +2 to all sorc class abilities)

If you choose Improved Fiendish Sorcery, you'd have an effective 22 mainstat @ lvl 1 Giving you more spells/day, more bluffs/day at a higher DC... Since I wouldn't allow such shenanigans in my own games, I won't try to sneak it in when I am a player myself.