actually, question: why are you calling it flurry of misses? it's literally TWF as a full BAB class (provided you aren't the hated enemy of paizo and *gasp* dipping)
I got the name flurry of misses from these boards, but my character can get 5 attacks per round (with KI point) and not hit at all. This can happen more than once in a combat session.
Arsinoitherium <3
I know it has been said that MY monk can't multiclass into anything and do very good, is there any class he could go into and do relatively good?
It may be just me, but it sounds like the majority (or 50%) of the thread's consensus is saying I should through in the towel with this character.
I don't think I can do a rebuild or even a partial rebuild
I have heard a few replacement characters.
I may have missed the ones that say something about Multiclassing.
I think at least one person has said something to the affect of 'nope yer SOL', but I am in a game that is supposed to go to 20th level and that may end this time next year, so SOL isn't what I am looking for.
I know I am basically doing an about face from the OP, but I am trying to look for all the possible options.
thanks
Well, seems the easiest route would probably be to take Fighter as a multiclass and do either Unarmed Fighter to punch things, or just scrap punching altogether and take regular Fighter with his weapon focus or whatever in the Monk Weapons category and work off that.
actually, question: why are you calling it flurry of misses? it's literally TWF as a full BAB class (provided you aren't the hated enemy of paizo and *gasp* dipping)
It's TWF on a full-BAB class that is the MADdest class in the game, pays way more for enhancements to hit and damage and gains them more slowly, doesn't get bonuses to hit or damage from the class itself beyond the TWF feat substitutes (whereas fighters get Weapon Training, barbarians get Str bonus from Rage, etc), can't take other feats in the TWF tree because it doesn't have the prereqs, gains Improved TWF and Greater TWF when a 3/4 BAB class does instead of when a full-BAB class does, and stops being a full-BAB class on any turn that it isn't full-attacking.
Among other issues.
I know it has been said that MY monk can't multiclass into anything and do very good, is there any class he could go into and do relatively good?
It may be just me, but it sounds like the majority (or 50%) of the thread's consensus is saying I should through in the towel with this character.
I don't think I can do a rebuild or even a partial rebuild
I have heard a few replacement characters.I may have missed the ones that say something about Multiclassing.
I think at least one person has said something to the affect of 'nope yer SOL', but I am in a game that is supposed to go to 20th level and that may end this time next year, so SOL isn't what I am looking for.
I know I am basically doing an about face from the OP, but I am trying to look for all the possible options.
thanks
I suggested multiclassing, maybe you missed that? :-)
I think you can somewhat salvage it...
When I play monks, I take a 4 level dip then go elsewhere. More specifically:
L1 Unarmed Fighter (Fighter Archetype)
(1) Armor Proficiency: Light only
(1) Weapon Proficiency: All Monk Weapons, including exotic monk weapons
(1) Improved Unarmed Strike Feat
(1) One bonus style feat ~ not Elemental Fist, not any style feats that give bonuses to Elemental Fist, and not any feats down the Style feat chains - very different from Master of Many Forms.
(a) Dragon Style (best choice) - +2 saves vs. Sleep, Paralysis, and Stun. Ignore Difficult Terrain when running, charging, and withdrawing. Add Strength and a half to the first unarmed strike each round.
L2 Unarmed Fighter (Fighter Archetype)
(2) Bonus Feat: Crane Style (must take Dodge as a feat prior to getting L2 Unarmed Fighter): -2 penalty on attack rolls while fighting defensively (as opposed to -4). While fighting defensively or full defensive, gain an additional +1 dodge to AC.
(2) Harsh Training: +1 saves against exhaustion, fatigue, stagger, and temporary ability drain. This ability replaces Bravery.
L3 Master of Many Styles (Monk Archetype)
*Take after Ultimate Fighter
(1) Bonus Feat: "At 1st level, 2nd level, and every four levels thereafter, a master of many styles may select a bonus style feat or Elemental Fist feat (APG 158). He does not have to meet the prerequisites of that feat, except the Elemental Fist feat. Alternatively, a master of many stles may choose a feat in that style's feat path (such as Earth Child Topple [sucks]) as one of these bonus feats if he already has the appropriate style feat (such as Earth Child Style [sucks]). The master of many styles does not need to meet any other prerequisite of the feat in the style's feat path. This ability replaces the monk's standard bonus feat."
Best Feat = Crane Wing: "Once per round while using Crane Style, when you have at least one hand free and are either fighting defensively or using the total defense action, you can deflect one melee weapon attack that would normally hit you. You expend no action to deflect the attack, but you must be aware of it and not flat-footed. An attack so deflected deals no damage to you."
(1) Fuse Style: swift action - first form, 2nd swift action - second form. This ability replaces monk's flurry of blows.
(1) Stunning Fist bonus feat
(1) Improved Unarmed Strike bonus feat
(1) Unarmed Damage: d6, considered light weapons, and can deal lethal damage
L4 Master of Many Styles (Monk Archetype)
(2) Bonus Feat: Best Feat = Crane Riposte: "You take only a –1 penalty on attack rolls for fighting defensively. Whenever you use Crane Wing to deflect an opponent’s attack, you can make an attack of opportunity against that opponent after the attack is deflected."
(2) Evasion
After this, I believe Barbarian is the best class to go into. Lots of people like Monkey Style. I like Crane/Dragon the best myself and used these as examples for this post.
*I would definitely get a masterwork/magical Nine-Section Whip (you can still punch with a weapon in your hand) and the Monk Robes.
you have to change alignment or be "tricky" to be able to get barbarian levels.
I think there was one exception. Please give me some time to look for it.
Martial Artist, but it's not compatible with MoMS I don't think.
I suggested multiclassing, maybe you missed that? :-)
I think you can somewhat salvage it...
Sorry, I was trying to be general in my post. I like the idea of the Oracle/Fighter dips, and it doesn't change a thing on my character sheet, but my attack bonus goes up by just 2 and damage by 3. Channel smite is a good thing as I can see there is Greater Channel Smite too (eventually)
What about a Magus Monk or is that going overboard. No one has suggested such a thing so I am guessing it isn't a good idea.
(after looking through all the books) I looked at the fighter for multiclass, though not the Archetypes. I am beginning to see the only way to fix this character is to move stuff around.
Swap your wisdom and strength scores, drop charisma by 2 and put it in wisdom. Swap out Mobility,Dijinni Style and deflect arrows. Replace it with fiery fists, fists of iron and vexing flanker. Flank whenever possible, even if it means not attacking at all in the first round.
Not flurrying: +16/+11, 2d6+5
When flurrying: +17/+17/+12/+12, 4d6+5
At level 12, take water splitting stone. Increases your unarmed damage by 4 whenever DR would apply.
Where do I find these feats? I'm playing a monk but I've never heard of these.
They're not on the SRD I can see that much, though Water Splitting Stone is a Brother of the Seal class feature.
Where do I find these feats? I'm playing a monk but I've never heard of these.Swap your wisdom and strength scores, drop charisma by 2 and put it in wisdom. Swap out Mobility,Dijinni Style and deflect arrows. Replace it with fiery fists, fists of iron and vexing flanker. Flank whenever possible, even if it means not attacking at all in the first round.
Not flurrying: +16/+11, 2d6+5
When flurrying: +17/+17/+12/+12, 4d6+5
At level 12, take water splitting stone. Increases your unarmed damage by 4 whenever DR would apply.
Vexing flanker (players handbook 2, pg 85)
fiery fists (players handbook 2, pg 79)
fists of iron (complete warrior, page 99)
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Where do I find these feats? I'm playing a monk but I've never heard of these.Swap your wisdom and strength scores, drop charisma by 2 and put it in wisdom. Swap out Mobility,Dijinni Style and deflect arrows. Replace it with fiery fists, fists of iron and vexing flanker. Flank whenever possible, even if it means not attacking at all in the first round.
Not flurrying: +16/+11, 2d6+5
When flurrying: +17/+17/+12/+12, 4d6+5
At level 12, take water splitting stone. Increases your unarmed damage by 4 whenever DR would apply.
Vexing flanker (players handbook 2, pg 85)
fiery fists (players handbook 2, pg 79)
fists of iron (complete warrior, page 99)
So, 3.5 stuff?
Magus can't use his abilities with unarmed strikes.
I suggested multiclassing, maybe you missed that? :-)
I think you can somewhat salvage it...Sorry, I was trying to be general in my post. I like the idea of the Oracle/Fighter dips, and it doesn't change a thing on my character sheet, but my attack bonus goes up by just 2 and damage by 3. Channel smite is a good thing as I can see there is Greater Channel Smite too (eventually)
What about a Magus Monk or is that going overboard. No one has suggested such a thing so I am guessing it isn't a good idea.
(after looking through all the books) I looked at the fighter for multiclass, though not the Archetypes. I am beginning to see the only way to fix this character is to move stuff around.
wait what?
i know you can deliver held touch spells for free during an unarmed strike or natural attack (if you're proficient in them), but is there some clause preventing spellstrike from working with fists?
I suggested multiclassing, maybe you missed that? :-)
I think you can somewhat salvage it...Sorry, I was trying to be general in my post. I like the idea of the Oracle/Fighter dips, and it doesn't change a thing on my character sheet, but my attack bonus goes up by just 2 and damage by 3. Channel smite is a good thing as I can see there is Greater Channel Smite too (eventually)
...
(after looking through all the books) I looked at the fighter for multiclass, though not the Archetypes. I am beginning to see the only way to fix this character is to move stuff around.
Ah, OK.
You do not necessarily change your build, it is just more difficult.
If you take fighter, consider weapon master for quick access to weapon training. Combined with gloves of dueling and specializing in unarmed strikes, 3 levels of fighter net you +3/+3 to attack/damage on top of the +3 attack due to BAB.
Feats you could take power attack with your bonus feat, maybe weapon specialization at level 4... :-)
Magus can't use his abilities with unarmed strikes.
I suggested multiclassing, maybe you missed that? :-)
I think you can somewhat salvage it...What about a Magus Monk or is that going overboard. No one has suggested such a thing so I am guessing it isn't a good idea.
I know I have been referring to Unarmed Strike for the entire thread, but it has been suggested by you that high base attack damage was a trap. If the Monk uses Monk uses a Kama with Magus. He could use that with the Magus for attacks.
Read spellstrike. Clearly states you have to wield a weapon in the other hand.
But as a Monk your other hand IS a weapon. That seems like quite an arbitrary restriction since insofar as I can tell it doesn't grant any real advantage besides MAYBE using Deflect Arrows with Spellstrike.
I agree, but thats what it says on spellstrike.Read spellstrike. Clearly states you have to wield a weapon in the other hand.But as a Monk your other hand IS a weapon. That seems like quite an arbitrary restriction since insofar as I can tell it doesn't grant any real advantage besides MAYBE using Deflect Arrows with Spellstrike.
i thought it was stated that monk's fists count as both natural and manufactured weapons for stuff.
i thought it was stated that monk's fists count as both natural and manufactured weapons for stuff.I agree, but thats what it says on spellstrike.Read spellstrike. Clearly states you have to wield a weapon in the other hand.But as a Monk your other hand IS a weapon. That seems like quite an arbitrary restriction since insofar as I can tell it doesn't grant any real advantage besides MAYBE using Deflect Arrows with Spellstrike.
They do, thus they should work.