Kobolds and multiweapon fighting

[JJNinja]

Hi! i'm building a kobold png and i liked very much the idea of the tail attachments, i'm building a rogue so i planned to use two shortswords and a razored tail attachment, whwn i came up to the multi weapon fighting feat i saw it states you need to have 3 or more hands, i would like to know if it's intended that a creature with an additional limb (the tail in this case) that can be used to do a manufactured weapon attack can't get access to the multiweapon fighting chain or it's simply bad wording...
Also i would like to be sure tail attachments attacks count as weapon attacks.
Thanks

[Grick]

JJNinja wrote:

Hi! i'm building a kobold png and i liked very much the idea of the tail attachments, i'm building a rogue so i planned to use two shortswords and a razored tail attachment, whwn i came up to the multi weapon fighting feat i saw it states you need to have 3 or more hands, i would like to know if it's intended that a creature with an additional limb (the tail in this case) that can be used to do a manufactured weapon attack can't get access to the multiweapon fighting chain or it's simply bad wording...

Also i would like to be sure tail attachments attacks count as weapon attacks.

I assume that since the tail attachment will "augment" your natural attack (the tail slap granted by Tail Terror) it remains a natural attack. It's a light weapon for things like special materials, hardness, HP, etc.

Natural Attacks don't take Two-Weapon Fighting penalties, so multiweapon fighting doesn't help any.

The kobold section of the ARG isn't written very well, so the intent could really go either way.

[Michael Sayre]

Grick, I had had a similar understanding to yours, wherein the tail attack was treated as a natural attack (augmented by the tail blade) and fell under the natural attack rules.

[JJNinja]

It's not clear as it specifically state that they are light weapons, an other similar situations do not help (as a catfolk clawblade is a weapon, but a ratfolk tailblade is a natural attack), i think RAI it should work (as a tail with a blade on it it's not much different from a weapon held in hand), but since i'm building this for a contest i need to use RAW.

[JJNinja]

Also I noticed that kobold tail attachments form a fighter weapon specialization group, if the attack is still a natural attack, why making a new group, it would be in the natural attacks group

[Icyshadow]

JJNinja wrote:

Also I noticed that kobold tail attachments form a fighter weapon specialization group, if the attack is still a natural attack, why making a new group, it would be in the natural attacks group

Because the devs are silly* and made more than just that little mistake in regards to the ARG.

* = Then again, they're only human. Mistakes happen, even in regards to the best of us. Just houserule it or something.

[blackbloodtroll]

I was under the impression that they alter the tail attack in the same way the Claw Blades alter a Catfolk's claw attacks.

Effectively turning them into manufactured weapon attacks.

[JJNinja]

So they are weapon attacks.
Now in your opinion which is the most likeable option:
1) Multi weapon fighting requirements are badly worded and should be rewritten this way:

RAI wrote:

Prerequisites: 3 or more limbs able to wield a weapon

2)My PNG Can't access MWF, in this case my attack routine how should look like? (assuming i'm a lvl 10 rogue using two short swords and a tail attachment)

+5/+5/+5/+2/+2
or
+5/+5/+2/+2/+2
or
+5/+5/-1/+2/+2
?

[blackbloodtroll]

No, it's three or more hands.

A Kobold could wield a two-handed weapon and a Kobold Tail attachment, to get more out of two-weapon fighting.

A Kobold cannot Multi-weapon fight.

[JJNinja]

In the case I posted which is my attack routine?

[Skylancer4]

JJNinja wrote:

In the case I posted which is my attack routine?

I don't believe any of the ones you posted would be correct.

The tail attack becomes a light martial weapon, which means it is no longer a 'natural' weapon. You basically have the option of using it on any of the of the attacks you would normally make during a TWF routine. You don't get an extra attack from the tail anymore (like you would if it were a natural weapon). It would take the place of one of the short swords in the routine.

[JJNinja]

Ok thanks for making it clear