Advice For A Barbarian / Magus

[Zombie Ninja]

I need some advice.

After looking though my old copy of the complete warrior, I came upon the rage mage prestige class. I have never really noticed it before, but the rage mage seems like an interesting combination of spell-caster and barbarian. I would like to make a rage mage like character for a possible pathfinder society game. Now I could just use the prestige class as is, but I thought it would be more interesting to try to emulate it under pathfinder society rules.

After formulating some ideas I decided that magus with his ability to cast spells while armored, better BAB, Hit points and his magus arcana ability made it an excellent choice for the characters spell-casting side. In order to get the rage ability I need barbarian levels as well. But that’s it; I’m indecisive on what else I need to do. I want the character to be useful in the group, and have some survivability. From the look of it this type of build can be high on damage output, but suffers with a low AC and only average hit points.

So assuming pathfinder society rules are in play, including the standard 20-point buy system for ability scores what scores should I concentrate on? Strength works ok for a magus and is an excellent choice for barbarian, but most builds I see for magus are dexterity based. Constitution is a must for rage, and intelligence for spell-casting and arcane pool. I can dump wisdom and charisma, but is that wise?

For race I like the idea of using tiefling for four reasons. First it’s allowed for pathfinder society, second tieflings can add ¼ points to their magus arcane pool, next they get a +2 to intelligence, lastly the archetype fiend flayer can take advantage of a high constitution magus by increasing his arcane pool. Is this a good choice or am I missing something?

I know pathfinder society only allows up to level 12 characters, but it’s likely my group will play the whole way up to level 20. I have no idea on how many barbarian levels I should take, obviously I’m going to lose spell casting from my magus side, but how much is too much? I though 13 levels of magus and 7 levels of barbarian seemed like a good spread since I would be getting a good deal of barbarian abilities while losing my 6th level spells, which is acceptable, am I wrong? Addressing archetypes a little further I noticed titan mauler had some interesting abilities including the ability to use a two-handed weapon in one hand. I think that means I can use a two-handed weapon while using spellstrike, is this worth it? That’s a pretty big negative penalty to BAB in order to duel wield a two-handed weapon and a spell. Also can I stack the effects of my magus’s arcane pool enhancement bonus, namely flaming and flame burst enhancement to the barbarian’s elemental rage power?

Feat wise, power attack would be useful for more damage, but at a real high cost of an even lower chance to hit. Simple taking feats based around charging is another good choice due to several rage powers and the tiefling fiendish sprinter ability. I haven’t even begun to look for useful spells.

Ease my pain, this build is interesting but complicated, which range powers, arcana’s, spells and feats should I take? I am absolutely terrible at power gaming, so any advice from people who enjoy theory crafting would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!

[galahad2112]

When I first found out about the Magus class, I was overjoyed. The first thing that I wanted do do was make a barbarian dipped Magus. I was thoroughly chastised for it, from an optimization standpoint, anyway, but the concept was undeniably fun.

One thing that I do recommend: Take the Armored Hulk Barbarian archetype. The addition of heavy armor prof. gives you the ability to wear Mithral Full Plate with no ASF at level 8, and, because you have proficiency, you don't suffer any ACP either. I just confirmed this about the ASF on the rules forum in this thread
It's not as useful for the 1-20 level character, but as noted, PFS only goes to 12, and 13th is where the Magus gets the ability to use heavy armor. You could always use the mithral full plate without having proficiency to get around the ASF issue, but you'll still take ACP, which is nasty.

Really, for the PFS levels, I would take as much Magus as possible, since caster level is harder to boost (i.e. you can't take the magical knack trait), and most of your nova damage will come from spells.

As to the stackability of the elemental rage powers with your pool enhancement, I really don't see why not. It just gives additional energy damage. However, I do not recommend going more than 2 levels of barbarian, namely because you'll never get Mighty or Greater rage anyway, and most of the rage powers that are really good are only accessible at higher level. Also, raging loses you the ability to cast, so getting more rounds of rage is really a secondary consideration.

For the race consideration, tiefling is a solid option, provided that you have a chronicle allowing them. Although, personally, I don't really care for the racial archetype. You should have enough arcane pool points to last the entire session right from level 1. The ability to create any weapon that they have proficiency with is neat, but it requires 2 points, and taking con damage, when you should already have your primary weapon readied.

Other racial considerations are Elf (just like everyone else) and Human (the other white meat). The Elf archetype Spire Defender is pretty cool, as you get a free exotic weapon proficiency and some decent bonus feats. The other nice thing about them is that, once they have armor proficiency (i.e. you have at least 1 Barbarian level), they get the same no-ASF that the regular Magus gets. A solid option for an Elf barbarian would be the Urban archetype, as you can get a dex bonus instead of strength. If you take the Dervish Dance feat, you'll be quite the melee character. Also, the Alternate favored class bonus is REALLY nice.

The Human, however, can take the Dual Talented alternate racial trait, and just have his +2 str and int, and call it a day. They also have the alternate favored class bonus as the tiefling.

a couple of potential builds:

Elf

str 10 (0)
dex 18 (10+racial)
con 10 (2)
int 18 (10+racial)
wis 10 (0)
cha 8 (-2)

Human

str 18 (10+racial)
dex 14 (5)
con 12 (2)
int 16 (5+racial)
wis 10 (0)
cha 8 (-2)

Hope this helps!

[Illeist]

@Zombie Ninja
You'll need 16 levels of Magus to get 6th levels spells, thanks to slow casting progression.

@galahad
As of Season 4, Tieflings, Aasimars, and Tengus are legal for PFS play.

[galahad2112]

@ Illeist

Just straight up, no chronicle sheets, boons, any of that stuff? Just "Hi, I'm a first level Tengu!" and that's it?

[Zombie Ninja]

@galahad

Thanks for the advice I'll do some research on Armored Hulk. I'm still considering Tiefling for race.

How about the fiendish sprinter ability as part of a charger based build?

[Illeist]

galahad2112 wrote:

@ Illeist

Just straight up, no chronicle sheets, boons, any of that stuff? Just "Hi, I'm a first level Tengu!" and that's it?

Eeyup. Check out the 4.2 Campaign Guide.

[galahad2112]

@ Illeist

Oh, that's sweet!

@ OP

Like I said, tiefling is a fine choice. The fiendish sprinter seems like a decent trait, as it's not giving up one of the selling features of the race, and trades in a pretty cool ability. I like it. Have fun!

[Zombie Ninja]

Here are my class abilities and level breakdown.

The general Idea is to use charges & bull rushes along with magical affects. Since I cannot use rage and spell cast at the same time I have a second lesser tactic of simply raging until I can start into a bull rush combo. I should be able to use moment of clarity to good effect for this combo. At least that’s the theory, like I posted earlier this week I’m not sure if this would work. Four levels of barbarian may seem to much, but I still get one sixth level spell per day, and my BAB jumps up to +16/+11/+6/+1 So I get four attacks and if I’m reading it right the rage power lesser fiend totem will give me a fifth attack at +11 at level 19. Likewise lunge and quick bull rush should make this combo effective. Spell wise I was going to take cold based offensive spells to put rime spell to good effect. Of course I’ll need dimensional door, also if I cast and later quicken a bull’s strength spell before raging it should give me a semi version of greater rage.

Race: Tiefling
Standard tiefling abilities except I’ll exchange Fiendish Sprinter for skilled. I’m still considering fiend flayer if just for the flavor.

Strength 16 (21 by level 20)
Dexterity 14
Constitution 14
Intelligence 16
Wisdom 8
Charisma 8

1st level Barbarian 1 (Armored Hulk)
Class Abilities: Indomitable Stance, Rage
Feat: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Bastard Sword)
Traits: Armor Expert & Magical Lineage:
2nd Level Magus 1
Class Abilities: Arcane pool, cantrips, spell combat
3rd Level Magus 2
Class Abilities: Spellstrike
Feat: Weapons Focus (Bastard Sword)
4th Level Magus 3
Class Abilities: Magus arcane (Arcane Accuracy)
5th Level Magus 4
Class Abilities: Spell recall
Feat: Power Attack
6th Level Magus 5
Class Abilities: Bonus feat
Bonus Feat: Intensify Spell
7th Level Barbarian 2
Class Abilities: Armored Swiftness, Rage Power (Moment of Clarity)
Feat: Rime Spell
8th Level Magus 6
Class Abilities: Magus arcana (Spell Shield)
9th Level Magus 7
Class Abilities: Knowledge pool, medium armor
Feat: Improved Bull Rush
10th Level Magus 8
Class Abilities: Improved spell combat
11th Level Magus 9
Class Abilities: Magus arcana (Empowered Magic)
Feat: Lunge
12th Level Magus 10
Class Abilities: Fighter training
13th Level Barbarian 3
Class Abilities: Resilience of Steel
Feat: Bull Rush Strike
14th Level Magus 11
Class Abilities: Bonus feat, improved spell recall
Bonus Feat: Quick Bull Rush
15th Level Magus 12
Class Abilities: Magus arcana (Prescient Attack)
Feat: Dimensional Agility
16th Level Magus 13
Class Abilities: Heavy armor
17th Level Magus 14
Class Abilities: Greater spell combat
Feat: Dimensional Assault
18th Level Magus 15
Class Abilities: Magus arcana (Quickened Magic)
19th Level Barbarian 4
Class Abilities: Rage Power (Fiend Totem, Lesser)
Feat: Dimensional Dervish
20th Level Magus 16
Class Abilities: Counterstrike

[Altus Lucrim]

Something to consider, If you are planning on Raging anyway to boost Str, picking up a single level of Alchemist would allow you some additional skills and the ability Mutagen, Stack that Alchemical bonus on top of your other bonuses in order to really raise that Str up <or Dex as the case may be>