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Got some questions about the cat-o’-nine-tails.
1) Does it count as a whip for feats/traits/abilities?
2) What fighter weapon group does it belong in?
3) Is there a barbed(lethal) version?
1) yes. It's a whip.
2) Flail.
3) Doesn't look like it, although the eastern weapon nine-section whip only does lethal.
3) Doesn't look like it, although the eastern weapon nine-section whip only does lethal.
The nine section whip is something completely different than a cat o nine tails.
The first is nine metal sticks put together with chain links to form one long weapon.
The latter is nine small whips side by side.
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DeadlyAura faint necromancy; CL 5th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, inflict light wounds; Price +1 bonus.
DESCRIPTIONThis special ability can only be placed on weapons that normally deal nonlethal damage, such as whips and saps. All damage a deadly weapon deals is lethal damage. A whip (or similar weapon that cannot damage creatures with armor or natural armor bonuses) with this special ability deals damage even to creatures with armor or natural armor. On command, the weapon suppresses this ability until told to resume it.
If it's a whip, do bards automatically gain proficiency with it?
Just say it's barbed. Even a barbed whip would likely be considered a non-lethal weapon as it would take a while to actually whip someone to death.
I really wish there was a barbed rip-the-skin-off-jesus's-back version of this.
It deals lethal damage if the target has less than +1 armor bonus or less than +3 natural armour bonus. Unless Jesus is some sort of lizard man, a whip or cat-o-nine-tails would rip plenty of skin off.
There is a reason that whipping was a scary punishment.
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No a cat o'nine tails is no different than a normal whip as it has the non-lethal weapon quality. It does NO damage if you have more than +1 armor or +3 natural armor. Placing the deadly weapon enhancement on it would allow this weapon to cause real damage.
Whips and scourges were used to punish not kill, thus the non-lethal damage.
--School of Vrock
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Just say it's barbed. Even a barbed whip would likely be considered a non-lethal weapon as it would take a while to actually whip someone to death.
Historically, a Cat is simply an unbraided thick rope (thick rope being three thin ropes braided together, each composed of three braided cords...hence 9 unbraided total) with knotted ends. There were never barbs on a Cat. The weapon that had barbs, or bits of glass, or nails, etc, is called a scourge.
With a cat, yes, it would take quite some time to kill someone with it. There are historical examples of British sailors receiving 500 lashes without dying...at least from the lashing. Infection usually did them in.
With a scourge, however...I remember reading somewhere years ago that in the Roman Empire you could be scourged to death as a form of execution. I believe the sentence was 40 lashes, that being enough to kill most men with the scourge.
Actually, historically speaking, Cats were semi-domesticated felines oftentimes used as pets. And the male ones had barbed members.
Wait, since when does the CO9T deal nonlethal damage? Doesn't the Skull and Shackles adventure use the whip for minor pirate punishments (since it deals nonlethal damage) and the CO9T for severe punishments (dealing lethal damage)?
Have I been punishing my unruly crew incorrectly? Or are you (or the module) mistaken?
There is also the whip mastery feats to consider.
Prerequisite: Weapon Focus (whip), base attack bonus +2.
Benefit: You no longer provoke attacks of opportunity when attacking with a whip. You can deal lethal damage with a whip, although you can still deal nonlethal damage when you want. Further, you can deal damage with a whip despite a creature’s armor bonus or natural armor bonus.
Normal: Attacking with a whip provokes attacks of opportunity as if you used a ranged weapon. A whip deals no damage to a creature that has an armor bonus of +1 or natural armor bonus of +3.
Prerequisite: Weapon Focus (whip), Whip Mastery, base attack bonus +5.
Benefit: While wielding a whip, you threaten the area of your natural reach plus 5 feet. You can also use a whip to grasp an unattended Small or Tiny object within your whip’s reach and pull that object into your square. To do so, you must hit AC 10 with a melee touch attack. Further, you can use the whip to grasp onto an object within your whip’s reach, using 5 feet of your whip as if it were a grappling hook, allowing you to use the rest of your whip to swing on like a rope. As a free action, you can release the object your whip is grasping, but you cannot use the whip to attack while the whip is grasping an object.
I remember there being a feat or trait or something that let you use your whip as a grappling hook as a full round action. this is better ;]
Edit, found it, its a trait(Equipment);
Benefit: You can use a whip as if it were a rope with a grappling hook at the end. Attaching your whip is a standard action, but detaching it is a full-round action.
Really, thinking about it there should be a feat that lets you grasp objects and then hurl them at your foes like a giant sling. just wishful thinking tho...
So, you do threaten with a Cat-o'-nine-tails?
As far as i can tell yes. Doing nonlethal damage doesn't stop you from threating.
Why have cat-0-9-tails as a punishment at all in Skull and Shackles if it isn't really worse than a whip lashing?
Does it have a higher Damage Range?
As far as i can tell yes. Doing nonlethal damage doesn't stop you from threating.
You do not threaten with a whip. here is the stats for a weapon, specifically sentence 2, second part;
A whip deals no damage to any creature with an armor bonus of +1 or higher or a natural armor bonus of +3 or higher. The whip is treated as a melee weapon with 15-foot reach, though you don't threaten the area into which you can make an attack. In addition, unlike most other weapons with reach, you can use it against foes anywhere within your reach (including adjacent foes).
Using a whip provokes an attack of opportunity, just as if you had used a ranged weapon.
You can use the Weapon Finesse feat to apply your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to attack rolls with a whip sized for you, even though it isn't a light weapon.
Weapon Feature(s): finesse, reach.
Admittedly that is with a whip. the cat-O-9 has no such line, so you can threaten with that, remember tho, it has no reach!