Fighting behind others with Reach weapons

[Degoon Squad]

If you are behind some one and armed with a reach weapon can you fight or does your friend block you( Form a Phalanx and fight Hoplite style)
Also are there rules for Pikes in any of the books(Really , really long spears)

[Howie23]

Yes, you can fight with a reach weapon behind a friend. However, depending on the configuration, your target will have cover.

[Mabven the OP healer]

If you have an ally or an enemy between you and your target, your target has cover, +4 to AC. This is because reach weapons calculate cover the same way ranged weapons do.

A long spear is a pike.

[Seraphimpunk]

Reach weapons determine cover like ranged attacks, so your ally that gets in the way may provide soft cover.

I'm unclear whether the -4 for being engaged in Melee would apply as well. But I've never seen a pole arm combatant take Precise Shot ...

[Howie23]

No, the -4 for being engaged in melee does not apply. Reach weapons merely use the same rules as ranged weapons to determine cover, nothing else.

[Umbranus]

And as the target has cover when you fight from the back line you can't make AoO, can you?

[StreamOfTheSky]

BY RAW, probably not.

Thankfully, I've never seen a DM actually enforce that rule.

In 3E, the Eberron Campaign Setting had a feat that allowed reach weapon users to ignore the cover bonus of having an ally in the way. It'd be nice if paizo put out such a feat for PF.

[Howie23]

Correct, you cannot take AoOs vs. creatures that have cover. That includes attacking around corners or through soft cover from allies or enemies.

SotS, if you want a feat that ignores the cover bonus, you can always use the one from Eberron, or write one that works for you. That is, after all, the magic of the OGL.

[WRoy]

StreamOfTheSky wrote:

In 3E, the Eberron Campaign Setting had a feat that allowed reach weapon users to ignore the cover bonus of having an ally in the way. It'd be nice if paizo put out such a feat for PF.

Small characters can take the Low Profile feat to not count as soft cover against allied reach melee combatants.

EDIT: It doesn't let the reach fighter proactively solve his problem, but it's worth mentioning for cooperative groups.

[AvalonXQ]

Here's one feat approach for the problem:

Two-tiered Assault (Combat, Teamwork)
You are skilled at coordinating with your allies to avoid getting in each others' way.
Benefit: Your allies with this feat do not provide cover against your attacks.

[Adamantine Dragon]

Keep in mind that if your target is more than half exposed, the cover AC advantage decreases from +4 to +2, so if you are fighting large or larger opponents you can probably reduce your cover penalties by half.

[oneplus999]

I normally count a small character who is between two medium characters as half cover (+2 AC) rather than the full +4 AC.

[Alitan]

So, does it matter if size categories are different? I.e., front rank Small, back rank Medium, facing a Medium (or larger) foe?

EDIT: Gosh, maybe if I READ THE ABOVE... nevermind. >goes for more coffee<

[StreamOfTheSky]

Yeah, best solution seems to be just using the Eberron feat... Asking someone else to take low profile or worse...needing to coordinate teamwork feats with someone else....just isn't practical.

For any who want the crunch:
Precise Swing

Spoiler:

Precise Swing
( Eberron Campaign Setting, p. 58)

[General]

You can ignore most obstacles when making a melee attack against an opponent.

Prerequisite
Base attack bonus +5,

Benefit
You ignore all effects of cover (but not total cover) when making a melee attack, including a melee attack with a reach weapon.

[Mike Lindner]

AvalonXQ wrote:

Here's one feat approach for the problem:

Two-tiered Assault (Combat, Teamwork)
You are skilled at coordinating with your allies to avoid getting in each others' way.
Benefit: Your allies with this feat do not provide cover against your attacks.

I cannot find this feat on the d20pfsrd.com or the PRD. Where is it from?

[blackbloodtroll]

Yes, where is this feat. Inquiring Inquisitors want to know.

[StreamOfTheSky]

Pretty sure Avalon was just making up a simple teamwork feat to address the problem on his/her own. It certainly would be a nice teamwork feat for Inquisitor archers, especially considering how they have all of...2 useful choices right now for those feat slots.

[blackbloodtroll]

Heresy.

[Howie23]

If so, then kudos to Avalon. That seems to fit in with PF's unique mechanics better than just a straight borrow from Ebberon to me, but to each their own. Play what you like, and like what you play.

[AvalonXQ]

I have a habit on these threads of inventing homebrew feats that address perceived problems.

I usually try to use the word "homebrew" in those posts explicitly to make clear that I just made it up. My apologies for not doing so above.