What i mean is, if there is a save on a creatures ability, Like the black spot sea urchin, where it's curse ability requires a Fort save, but it says the save is Charisma based, does that mean the PC takes their base Fort bonus and add their charisma modifier?
IE: Fighter lvl 1, 16 Con 12 CHA, would have a fort of +4, instead of +5? or is the DC of the ability based upon the CHA of the creature using the ability?
the target rolls a fort save as noted on their character sheet. the dc is based off the casters charisma. so the fighter is a +5 and the dc is 10 plus the spell level pluse the charisma mod of the caster.
okay, i was just making sure. It's kind of weird to put that "Save is X based" in for specific abilities that are only available to one creature in the stat block.
I can see it for when an ability gets damaged/drained, but with low level monsters, it seems weird when there aren't a whole lot of spells/attacks that affect ability scores, especially the mental ones.
What it is telling you is what stat contributes to the ability's DC, not what stat contributes to the save. It's listed in monster stat blocks in case something changes the monster's stats.
For example, dragons have a breath weapon which requires a reflex save. This save is said to be "constitution based". What this means is that, if the constitution of the dragon is increased, the DC of the reflex save goes up. If the dragon's constitution goes down, the DC of the reflex save goes down.
Regardless of what the DC is based on, a reflex save is made using a dexterity modifier.
Think of it like how a wizard adds his intelligence to his spell saves. Effectively, his saves are "intelligence based". A sorcerer's saves would be "charisma based".
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@ meibolite:
It means that when determining the DC of the ability you use the attacking monster's modifier that is being called out to determined the save DC.
Most save DC's for poison are constitution based, but most magical affects that might charm you would be charisma based
The formula for determining the DC of a special ability is 10+1/2 HD of the creature+base modifier.
Sample breakdown using a bone devil(10 HD)
Sting—injury; save Fort DC 20; frequency 1/round for 6 rounds; effect 1d3 Str damage; cure 2 consecutive saves. The save DC is Constitution-based.
10+5(1/2 HD)+5(con modifier)=20
thanks guys, though the way i was partially interpreting it could make some things very fun in a weird way. but i didn't want to ruin my party's poor 5 cha barbarian with a curse that would make him drown because his fort changed to base + cha instead of base + con. would be hilarious to see the dwarf sink to the bottom of the ocean because he wasn't "pretty enough" though.
I can see it for when an ability gets damaged/drained, but with low level monsters, it seems weird when there aren't a whole lot of spells/attacks that affect ability scores, especially the mental ones.
It's very helpful when you are modifying monsters before an encounter. Adding the Advanced Template will boost the save DC of whatever ability by 2 points, for example. Adding the Giant template will boost Con or Str DCs. When you start adding hit dice to monsters, stats increase too.
Also, some monsters have SLAs like Eagle's Splendor or Bear's Endurance.
Mostly, for the low level critters, it's included for completeness and uniformity.
meibolite: I wont repeat what the others have stated as they have done quite well doing so. But an example of why a 'low level' monster might need to know this: summon monster. I summon a Goblin Dog. With Augment Summoning it's con is increased by 4 thus the allergic reaction is upgraded from DC12 to DC14.
Just one rather common example as to why such information is required. Plenty of others exist.
- Gauss