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A player of mine is playing a grenadier alchemist. They just got to level two, and I realized what kind of awesome things he could do with the character. With the free martial proficiency, alchemical weapon, and explosive missile, he can become quite the explosive archer.
The thought process goes like so: I figured since he was already taking ranged feats, using a bow as his martial weapon is a good choice. It's also a solid backup for when he runs out of bombs, which is a possibility with the long, punishing days I put my players through. He can use all his alchemist fires, acid flasks, etc. on his bow, as well as his bombs with the explosive missile discovery. He's less a bomber and more a rocketer. A dex mutagen will help with his to-hit, partially making up for his med BAB. He's going to be constantly making alchemical items (with the aid of this fantastic table, courtesy of Eric Clingenpeel), so he'll have plenty of things to augment his attacks.
My only real concern is a lack of feats. I don't think he wants to dip at all, so what feats are most essential for this character, in terms of archery and others? Also, can explosive bomb be combined with fast bombs?
I have an archer bomber. They are fantastic fun to play!
Are you familiar with the Conductive weapon property from the Advanced Player's Guide? It's perfect for just such a concept!
I play a Grenadier Archer and it is a blast. Bad pun.
Downside is Explosive Missile is a standard so you can't use it with Fast Bombs. You also suffer from 3/4 BAB.
I took the feat Bullseye Shot from Faiths of Purity which gives you +4 to ranged attacks as a move action. This goes well with Explosive Missile so you can light up the BBEG form across the battlefield like Bo Duke. Good Times.
Also I took the Wing Discovery at 6 lvl. Become a living F-16 delivering flaming goodness from the skys. You will never regret that choice.
Also Explosive Bombs does work with Fast Bombs.
Well by explosive bomb I meant explosive missile, and you seem to imply that doesn't work. Is that so? I like the bullseye shot-explosive missile combo, if it doesn't.
And RD, you're using a conductive bow to channel bombs? That's a pretty neat idea. I'm not sure if I would allow that with bombs for believability reasons, based on what the property seems to be for, but I probably would since it requires double uses.
So, what feats and extracts and discoveries are best?
Are you familiar with the Conductive weapon property from the Advanced Player's Guide? It's perfect for just such a concept!
Why does conductive work with bombs? A bomb is not just a special ability using a ranged touch attack but uses the Throw Splash Weapon special attack.
Maxxx, it works because bombs are a supernatural ability that require a ranged touch attack to hit. That means it can be used with a ranged conductive weapon. I think a better question would be "why wouldn't it work?"
As for believability, Jackissocool, building exploding arrows on the spot is no more or less realistic than building exploding bombs on the spot, so I'd be surprised if anyone disallowed it on those grounds (it's clearly the intent that the abilities work together).
I guess my issue is just the way I interpret conductive. It seems like it channels something much more magical - bloodline powers, for example. Bombs don't seem the same, like spells aren't extracts. By RAW, however, it works, and I wouldn't disallow for power reasons if my player chose to pursue it.
With the conductive property. You can get iterative attacks that way, though, assuming you've got fast bombs. With explosive missile, there's no iterative attack but it only costs one bomb.
EDIT: There's also the alchemical weapon ability the grenadier archetype gets, which is a seperate action that uses a normal alchemical item (i.e., alchemist's fire, acid flask, tanglefoot bomb). It uses a seperate acton to activate, so you take a move (later a free) action to put on your weapon, then you could standard attack or full round attack next turn and the first attack would also activiate the item. Te combination of these various abilities is the basic idea behind the archer bomber.
Okay so I this is pretty nifty but it costs TWO bombs to fire one arrow correct?? Even if that is so, its an awesome idea but I just needed confirmation please =D
That is correct, however, you get some pretty awesome range in return.
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Okay so I this is pretty nifty but it costs TWO bombs to fire one arrow correct?? Even if that is so, its an awesome idea but I just needed confirmation please =DThat is correct, however, you get some pretty awesome range in return.
That you do and really your bomb numbers can climb rather nicely with your levels and high INT so unless you just blow through bombs or your DM absolutely punishes your group with ridiculous encounters daily then you should be able to manage them quite nicely
I just noticed something else really neat about Conductive: You don't have to expend your two charges until after you've confirmed a hit. That means they will never go to waste.
However, Jackissocool is mistaken; the ability can only be used once per round.
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I just noticed something else really neat about Conductive: You don't have to expend your two charges until after you've confirmed a hit. That means they will never go to waste.
However, Jackissocool is mistaken; the ability can only be used once per round.
That is even better and makes me want to roll one up for PFS now instead of my Magus I have been planning haha...so can you apply all your specialized bomb stuff such as Force Bombs and the like so its not just basic fire damage??
*edit
Nevermind I just looked on your character sheet Ravingdork so it answered that question LOL
...so can you apply all your specialized bomb stuff such as Force Bombs and the like so its not just basic fire damage??
Yes. Yes you can.
You could use both Condiuctive and Explosive missile (uses up three uses), but does double bomb damage as a standard action (wonder if can Vital Strike it).
Interesting. I hadn't considered stacking them.
Explosive Missile must be decided before the attack roll, making it decidedly less efficient that just using a conductive weapon.
Wait, now you can channel bombs through your weapon, and if you miss it doesn't count? I'm really not so sure conductive could work with bombs. RAW, yes it can, but it seems against RAI to me. The examples given are all so magical and totally seem like things that could be channeled through a weapon. But channeling a bomb? I don't know. Bloodline powers and such things are usually rays or something of the like. Something like a spell. But bombs are not like spells at all. I really just can't grasp it. I know this is fantasy, but this seems internally inconsistent. I feel like I'm invoking the Rule of Uncool here, but it's the only thing that makes sense to me. I will rule as such in my games. In your games, of course, feel free to do otherwise.
So, getting slightly back on topic before this goes where it's not supposed to, what feats and discoveries should he prioritize? RD, I see you didn't take any other energy types. Why? It seems like a good idea to take at least one.
Damage is damage. I wanted versatility in utility, so I picked up some battlefield control type effects.
I had been thinking of trying to fit a granadier missle bomber build into an arcane archer. Action economy seems to ruin it though. :(