Fabricate spell as attack?


Rules Questions


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So I had a player tonight uses the Fabricate spell on the silk robs of a evil wizard.
The spell dose not have that "The spell cannot affect objects carried or worn by a creature." So I said it worked. They wanted to turn the silk robs into a a silk rope, I can't find a good reason not to.
The more I think about it the more this spell scares the crap out of me.
With no save and no SR this spell is disgustingly powerful. I either have to have every NPC have all of there gear magic or risk the PC are just going to nerf it all.
What is stopping PC's from turning full plate armor on a fighter into a tube of steel, or the great sword into a length of steal rope. I don't like the idea of at 9th level having to make all gear +1 just so it doesn't get transmuted.
And then you add the environment in as a target they can turn the stone bridge under opponents into sling bullets or the steel door into so much chain.
This spell reads like disintegrate without the saves.
Is the casting time a typo by change?


Items that are worn by other people are usually considered "attented" that means the one wearing them gets a save against it.

Fabricate doesn't allow a save but it says "Creatures or magic items cannot be created or transmuted by the fabricate spell". I'd extend this immunity to attented objects as well, because I'm pretty certain that's the RAI at least.


"Creatures or magic items cannot be created or transmuted by the fabricate spell."

Typically "creature" includes the equipment carried by the creature, so you wouldn't be able to target a fighter's sword or armor. You see this in spells like enlarge person, gaseous form and flesh to stone. Now, I don't know of any place in the rules where it says that a creature includes their gear, but next time someone casts invisiblity you might have to wonder if the subject's sword or shield is visible if it isn't tucked into their clothing.

As for the bridge and steel door, I think that might be a valid and creative use of the spell. Although the bridge would take many rounds to complete the spell.


A good knowledge/engineering roll could (possibly) pick out the 10 cubic feet of bridge that would collapse the span when removed...


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I think creative uses of a spell should be rewarded and encouraged not nurffed. your player thought of something cool and interesting to do with the spell. don't nerf him because he is creative.


I'd say let him do it this time, but let him know that in the future, it won't work like that anymore. Sure, it's a little cheap, but it rewards him for creativity and keeps the spell from becoming silly powerful.

I'm sure you could find a good reason for it working in this instance and not others, maybe the silk in the guy's clothes had a special not-necessarily-magical attribute to it that makes it more resonant with transmutation effects, allowing them to be changed more easily and with an automatically successful DC 15 craft check to make them look nifty. Useful if you need a new pretty silk garment and don't have the time to run to the store.

Okay, I've had my minor creativity of the day, time to go back to contemplating the effects of a DC 30 craft check Fabricate when applied to pebbles.


It's your game Trek (correction, it's your gaming group's game), so you decide how you want to play it. You might just have to ask your players what they would think if enemy spell casters made use of fabricate in this way against them?


Just because the robes become a rope, does not mean the wearer is now tied up by the rope! Just rule anything so transformed falls to the ground at the wearers feet! The spell still does what the rules call for and you don't suddenly turn a obviously non-offensive spell into an attack spell.

Also note the casting time. "Casting requires 1 round per 10 cubic feet of material to be affected by the spell." That is a minimum 1 round casting time. One full cycle of the initiative cycle while the wizard is completing the spell.

EDIT: This so called "creative use" does not work at all!

"Components V, S, M (the original material, which costs the same amount as the raw materials required to craft the item to be created)"

See that "M"? That means the caster HAS to already possess the material to be tranmuted!

"Components
A spell's components explain what you must do or possess to cast the spell."

"Material (M): A material component consists of one or more physical substances or objects that are annihilated by the spell energies in the casting process. "


Frankthedm wrote:

EDIT: This so called "creative use" does not work at all!

"Components V, S, M (the original material, which costs the same amount as the raw materials required to craft the item to be created)"

See that "M"? That means the caster HAS to already possess the material to be tranmuted!

"Components
A spell's components explain what you must do or possess to cast the spell."

"Material (M): A material component consists of one or more physical substances or objects that are annihilated by the spell energies in the casting process. "

You've got a point there Frank.

The spells intent, as I see it, is for the caster to manipulate the material as reflected in the lengthy casting times and the need for Craft checks; although, this can be done from afar with a range of some 70 ft. I wonder if the caster can "possess" 10 cubic ft. of material from 70 ft. away? I doubt the interpretation should be that the caster must possess the material but can produce the object at a distance up to 70+ ft. away.


With eschew materials, you could still use it if the thing you transmute a target into costs less than 1gp. Restricts it a bit bit still is useful!


Hmmmmm, this spell is something of a sticky wicket.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I've used it to spontaneously create traps in dungeons, or even in battle. There's nothing quite like the look on the face of a guard who has been guarding the same hallway for a decade when his head's taken off by a scythe blade trap from said hallway. They never see it coming. :P

The best part is that most mundane traps are generally made of metal, stone, and wood--materials that nearly every dungeon provides!

Craft (trapmaking) for the win!

Liberty's Edge

stringburka wrote:
With eschew materials, you could still use it if the thing you transmute a target into costs less than 1gp. Restricts it a bit bit still is useful!

No. the thing you want to transmute should cost 1 gp or less, not the thing you want to make. The material component is the thing you want to transmute and the material component is what is affected by the feat, not the final product.

Even if the initial product is worth 1 gp or less fabricate will not work as you will be transmuting nothing to ... nothing.
fabricate wrote:
You convert material of one sort into a product that is of the same material.

And it will not work at removing someone weapon as what you transmute is the material component.

For the "stone bridge" example, it is made of minerals.

online dictionary wrote:

definitions of minerals: 1. A naturally occurring, homogeneous inorganic solid substance having a definite chemical composition and characteristic crystalline structure, color, and hardness.

2. Any of various natural substances, as:
a. An element, such as gold or silver.
b. An organic derivative, such as coal or petroleum.

so the caster would be affecting 1 cubic foot/level.

Then (as Frankthedm pointed out) there is the need to posses the material component, and the material component is the item to be transmuted.

And last but not least, then there is the big fail-safe at the start of the spell:

Fabricate wrote:
You convert material of one sort into a product that is of the same material.

a armor or a weapon are made generally by multiple materials. Even a stone bridge is made of stone and mortar. So your wizard would need a spell to affect every single stone of the bridge, one at a time. Maybe, with a good engineering check he can affect the mortar if he can touch it in a location, but unless all the mortar in the structure is connected he will have problems with the line of effect.

Raving, it is a nice idea, but you don't get a ready to spring trap. At best you get a items made all of the same material (let's say a steel bear trap) but in his packaged form. Priming the item for use is not part of the spell.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Diego Rossi wrote:
Raving, it is a nice idea, but you don't get a ready to spring trap. At best you get a items made all of the same material (let's say a steel bear trap) but in his packaged form. Priming the item for use is not part of the spell.

Hearsay. You have no RAW proof anywhere stating in what state the item comes into being as. It may well be up to the caster (or more likely, the GM).

As for materials, many of the best traps are simple pits and falling stones.

Liberty's Edge

Ravingdork wrote:
Diego Rossi wrote:
Raving, it is a nice idea, but you don't get a ready to spring trap. At best you get a items made all of the same material (let's say a steel bear trap) but in his packaged form. Priming the item for use is not part of the spell.

Hearsay. You have no RAW proof anywhere stating in what state the item comes into being as. It may well be up to the caster (or more likely, the GM).

As for materials, many of the best traps are simple pits and falling stones.

True, the spell don't say anything on the status of the created items, but I think it should be the same status of a just crafted item. You don't craft a ready to spring bear trap.

Pits and falling stones work flawlessly (with the limit that you need to possess the material component to transmute).

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