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I don't play a lot of straight casters but I am getting a chance to play a starting 17th Level Sorc. in the Coliseum Morpheuon module. I know next to nothing about the module and I usually play gishes but am willing to tackle a high level caster built from scratch in a vacuum. I am not looking for detail builds just some advice from those who have played the module.
- My first request is what is the highest possible legal Pathfinder charisma score I can achieve.
- My second request is any advice on A Sorc build from those that have played the module. I am not looking for spoilers just a heads up on what direction I should go. I am leaning towards a Drow (possible noble) conjuration (summoner) Abyssal blood line sorc.
Allowed: Anything Pathfinder (no 3rd party or 3.5)
25 point buy in
No evil alignment
410,000 gp starting wealth
Charisma score
- starting score
18 + 2 = 20 (built in a vacuum so easy to do) I would normal start the stat lower if I had to play it from level one.
+4 Level ups (4-8-12-16)
+6 enhancement bonus from headband
+5 insight bonus from Wish or Tome
= 35
Is that the best I can do?
Also Summoner is not allowed (DM hates the class) and I am not a fan of Wizards so anything better at summoning than a Sorc?
Thanks in advance.
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If you're willing to accept a -6 to your Str, Dex and Con, you can gain a +3 to your Int, Wis and Cha by advancing the character to venerable age. Then, you can cast the Greater Age Resistance spell once a day to remove the ability score reductions from age while keeping the increases. Doing that, you can end up with a 38 Cha. Otherwise, I think you have the bases covered.
EDIT: I forgot about the lich transformation, which also adds +2 to your Int, Wis and Cha. If the GM allows that, you could hit a 40 Cha.
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@Blackbloodtroll - Thanks will take a look.
If you're willing to accept a -6 to your Str, Dex and Con, you can gain a +3 to your Int, Wis and Cha by advancing the character to venerable age. Then, you can cast the Greater Age Resistance spell once a day to remove the ability score reductions from age while keeping the increases. Doing that, you can end up with a 38 Cha. Otherwise, I think you have the bases covered.
EDIT: I forgot about the lich transformation, which also adds +2 to your Int, Wis and Cha. If the GM allows that, you could hit a 40 Cha.
Thank you sir. I completely forgot about age bonus/negatives. I will have to look up Greater Age Resistant but sounds doable.
As for Lich I wish, no templates. If I could I be a Worm that Walks.
Drow noble is worth a level adjustment, but if your GM allows it, then he allows it.
The bonus from wish or a tome is an inherent bonus, not an insight bonus. I don't know of anything that does give an insight bonus to stack, though...
Being venerable gives +3 to all mental stats, Charisma included. (someone already mentioned this)
It doesn't match your chosen race or bloodline, but a fire-bloodline Ifrit treats their charisma as 2 higher for the purposes of Sorcerer spells and class abilities, in addition to having a racial +2.
If your sole purpose is high Cha, at the expense even of class levels, and if your GM really does mean "anything goes," then the Half-celestial, Half-fiend, Half-janni, and Ghost templates all give +4 Cha. Obirandiath mentioned lich, but it is called out as being always evil. Edit: Just saw you said no templates.
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Drow noble is worth a level adjustment, but if your GM allows it, then he allows it.
The bonus from wish or a tome is an inherent bonus, not an insight bonus. I don't know of anything that does give an insight bonus to stack, though...
Being venerable gives +3 to all mental stats, Charisma included. (someone already mentioned this)
It doesn't match your chosen race or bloodline, but a fire-bloodline Ifrit treats their charisma as 2 higher for the purposes of Sorcerer spells and class abilities, in addition to having a racial +2.
If your sole purpose is high Cha, at the expense even of class levels, and if your GM really does mean "anything goes," then the Half-celestial, Half-fiend, Half-janni, and Ghost templates all give +4 Cha. Obirandiath mentioned lich, but it is called out as being always evil. Edit: Just saw you said no templates.
Thanks. You are correct, I meant inherent bonus - good catch.
* maybe I was secretly hoping (Freudian slip) for an insight bonus from someplace. LolNoble Drows in the air as no level adjust right now but probably will not happen.
- I will take a look at the Ifrit. Their ability is similiar to a Tiefling ability I gather.?
Yeah any PF books open but no Templates.
The trait description simply says "pick one spell when you take this trait". It doesn't have to be a spell you currently know. So you'd have to choose it at 1st level, but (especially since it's in a vaccuum) you could easily pick, say, Meteor Swarm, and just gain no benefit from the trait until you were a high enough level to cast 9th-level spells.
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The trait description simply says "pick one spell when you take this trait". It doesn't have to be a spell you currently know. So you'd have to choose it at 1st level, but (especially since it's in a vaccuum) you could easily pick, say, Meteor Swarm, and just gain no benefit from the trait until you were a high enough level to cast 9th-level spells.
Sweet, I kinda thought so but I have a tendency to read into things too much sometimes.
I think the Feat Spell Perfection + combination of Magical Lineage could prove fruitful to avoid the 9th Level spell limit but as I said I don't play full casters often so I am trying to be very careful about the rules. High level casters have very devastating powers.
Spell Perfection + Maximize Spell + Calcific Touch is a nice combo, add in Reach Spell and maybe Piercing Spell for good times. 4 points Dex damage (no save for the Dex dmg, SR only), close ranged touch, + 10 vs SR (if you have Spell Pen and Greater Spell Pen that goes up to +18 vs SR!). Good against anything except undead (and whatever else might be immune to stat damage). Magical Lineage would mean either the Reach or Piercing metamagic is free, apply Spell Perfection for Maximize (since it's +4 levels), and you get one VERY nasty 5th level spell. Doesn't come online until 15th level minimum, but starting at 17th that's no hindrance.
Also, consider a 2 level dip into Paladin for massive save bonuses and a little tiny bit of healing ability and smite. With as much Cha bonus as you'd have it might be worth the loss of CL. Magical Knack trait (I think, the one that gives you +2 CL not to exceed total HD) would take away all the sting from that aside from the actual spell level lost. Might be better to do this instead of Magical Lineage, you'd still have 7th level spells.
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Spell Perfection + Maximize Spell + Calcific Touch is a nice combo, add in Reach Spell and maybe Piercing Spell for good times. 4 points Dex damage (no save for the Dex dmg, SR only), close ranged touch, + 10 vs SR (if you have Spell Pen and Greater Spell Pen that goes up to +18 vs SR!). Good against anything except undead (and whatever else might be immune to stat damage). Magical Lineage would mean either the Reach or Piercing metamagic is free, apply Spell Perfection for Maximize (since it's +4 levels), and you get one VERY nasty 5th level spell. Doesn't come online until 15th level minimum, but starting at 17th that's no hindrance.
Also, consider a 2 level dip into Paladin for massive save bonuses and a little tiny bit of healing ability and smite. With as much Cha bonus as you'd have it might be worth the loss of CL. Magical Knack trait (I think, the one that gives you +2 CL not to exceed total HD) would take away all the sting from that aside from the actual spell level lost. Might be better to do this instead of Magical Lineage, you'd still have 7th level spells.
Paly huh? Never considered a martial dip but you are so correct about the saves. Only drawback I see is being lawful good, not my favorite alignment.
Yes, I'm playing almost this build exactly (2 pal / 1 oracle / 13 sorc) in a high level game currently, and basically when saves come up, it's "don't roll a 1".
The Oracle level is just more synergy, I went Lore with Sidestep Secret, which gives Cha mod to AC and Reflex saves. Ended up with +25 Fort, and +28 Ref/Will.
I'm sure it could be more optimized, but I was building for survivability. 30 AC (could easily get to 39ish) and 179 hp works out rather nicely.
I feel your pain on the alignment thing, but given the composition of the party I was joining it wasn't a loss; the group's (other) paladin would have been cramping my style anyway. :) Might as well join in.
- My second request is any advice on A Sorc build from those that have played the module. I am not looking for spoilers just a heads up on what direction I should go. I am leaning towards a Drow (possible noble) conjuration (summoner) Abyssal blood line sorc.
You probably want to post this question in the compatibility forums, I got lucky and my google alerts for Coliseum Morpheuon let me know about the post. Coliseum as a setting is open to virtually any build though I do think Chaotic alignments do better as the place is filled with unsavery folks with their own agendas. As an adventure it is team gladiatorial combat, so builds that have synergy with your other party member work best.
And remember your greater age resistance spell can be dispelled, . (my player did something similar in the play test, though he was a Int based caster).
I will see if one of the two authors has time to chime in.
Steve Russell
Rite Publishing
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- My second request is any advice on A Sorc build from those that have played the module. I am not looking for spoilers just a heads up on what direction I should go. I am leaning towards a Drow (possible noble) conjuration (summoner) Abyssal blood line sorc.You probably want to post this question in the compatibility forums, I got lucky and my google alerts for Coliseum Morpheuon let me know about the post. Coliseum as a setting is open to virtually any build though I do think Chaotic alignments do better as the place is filled with unsavery folks with their own agendas. As an adventure it is team gladiatorial combat, so builds that have synergy with your other party member work best.
And remember your greater age resistance spell can be dispelled, . (my player did something similar in the play test, though he was a Int based caster).
I will see if one of the two authors has time to chime in.
Steve Russell
Rite Publishing
Not being given to optimizing my own characters, I don't have much build advice for how you should put together your sorcerer other than suggesting that you go with what you think would be the most fun to play.
If I had to give some advice, as its high level, and we wrote it specifically to allow people to use a multitude of high level abilities, in addition to your offensive spells, I would suggest you make sure you have a nice blend of capabilities from your spell selection. Apart from spells, give some thought to your skills. You would not be remiss, without giving away too much, if you made sure you had at least a few ranks in the Fly skill. And, if you are going to max out your charisma, you might want to max out either Diplomacy or Bluff, and maybe even some performance capabilities of some sort. You don't have to be a Bard to put on a good show (both in and out of the arena).
I also agree with Steve that you will do best if you make sure you are complementing your other team-mates (again, both in and out of the arena). While combat is naturally going to be a factor in the arena, the events of the Coliseum Morpheuon are designed to test more than your teams ability to do massive amounts of damage. They will test your ability to survive strange environments, act decisively and intelligently, and adapt to a variety of challenges.
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4
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This is an awesome thread! I'm on the way to Seattle right now - I'll brain-storm on the plane.
My first inclination is one of the Tiefling bloodlines ... those are wicked-slick, and the two-level dip into paladin would be interesting. You know, I can't imagine that there isn't a 3PP class or Archetype out there SOMEWHERE that strikes a happy balance between paladin & antipaladin; it would be cool to play a tiefling who TRIED to live the austere life of a Jedi but lost the path somewhere along the way.
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- My second request is any advice on A Sorc build from those that have played the module. I am not looking for spoilers just a heads up on what direction I should go. I am leaning towards a Drow (possible noble) conjuration (summoner) Abyssal blood line sorc.You probably want to post this question in the compatibility forums, I got lucky and my google alerts for Coliseum Morpheuon let me know about the post. Coliseum as a setting is open to virtually any build though I do think Chaotic alignments do better as the place is filled with unsavery folks with their own agendas. As an adventure it is team gladiatorial combat, so builds that have synergy with your other party member work best.
And remember your greater age resistance spell can be dispelled, . (my player did something similar in the play test, though he was a Int based caster).
I will see if one of the two authors has time to chime in.
Steve Russell
Rite Publishing
Thank you so much for the reply Mr. Russell. I will take a look at compatibility forums as I have not heard about it before. I do plan on playing a chaotic alignment (althought the 2 level Paly dip looks interesting) and have decided not to "age" my PC (Solis Del'Nok). I was just curious as to how high one could legally get an ability score and thought I was missing something.
I am basing (loosely) my PC on a character out of author Raymond E. Feist books, Amirantha A demon summoner who is actually good aligned if not a bit of a charlatan.
- The DM hinted (very vaguely) that the magic in the world can be manipulated by the local denizens so I was unsure how that will effect a caster?
@Wicht
- As mentioned I do not play straight casters much so since my summon monter will be my main combat spells I am picking up (for a Sorc) a variety of helpful situation spells. EX: Seeming (mass disguise self), Haste, Overland Flight, Teleport, D-Door and so forth. Although Sorc do not get alot of skills I noticed.