| 4 people marked this as FAQ candidate. |
I have a question about the poison effect from the various prismatic spells.
Frequency 1/round for 6 rounds; Initial Effect death; Secondary Effect 1 Con damage; Cure 2 consecutive saves
How can the secondary effect ever come into play? If you fail your initial save, you die. Doesn't that make the secondary effect and the cure redundant? What am I missing here?
The spell requires two saves to cure the poison.
If you fail the first save you die.
If you make the first save you still have to make the next saves which causes con damage.
These afflictions have an initial effect, which occurs when the first save is failed, and a secondary effect, when additional saves are failed, as noted in the text. Hit point and ability score damage caused by an affliction cannot be healed naturally while the affliction persists.
The cure is 2 consecutive saves. Therefore somebody who makes the first save doesn't suffer the "death" effect but still needs to make another save to be cured. If that second save is failed the victim takes 1 Con damage and goes back to needing 2 successful saves in a row to cure the poison.
concerro, I'm not quite sure your explanation—which otherwise makes sense—fits with the explanation from the poison FAQ posted on the blog a while ago.
In that FAQ, Jason explained there are various times to make a save. You attempt the first save right when you are poisoned. If you make that save, the poison does not affect you at all, regardless of what is listed as the cure. Only if you fail that initial save, you take damage (which would be the primary effect), and then you need to make additional saves on your following turns, and take damage (secondary effect) until either the poison time runs out or you make enough saves to trigger the cure.
That only works for poisons with 2 effects, but one save. For poisons with 2 effects you must always make 2 saves.
Here is what you are referring to:
A poison with an onset and an initial and secondary effect are tricky, but the way it works is this. You get your first save. Make it and the poison ends.
Most poisons have one save even if they have 2 effects. That is when the above quote applies.
This(green prismatic poison) poison has 2 saves needed to cure it so even if you make the first save you are not cured.
Ignore my last post. This specific question came up in the blog, and he was supposed to make a ruling on it, but he never did.
Link to the question. I would suggest people FAQ my next post.
| 14 people marked this as FAQ candidate. Question unclear. 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I had always been a bit confused by the Green Prismatic Poison. With an initial effect of death, I've never been sure when the secondary effect and saves to cure would actually come into play.
That is a bit odd. I am going to look into that and get back to you. I have a suspicion that the effect of that ray will need to change. Looks like it was a left over from an earlier version of the poison mechanics.
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing
I am posting this so it can be FAQ'd.
Thanks for pointing that out. I faq'ed your post.
FAQ'ed.
|
Maybe it is needed because of this:
(Ex) A creature with this ability is difficult to kill. Creatures with regeneration heal damage at a fixed rate, as with fast healing, but they cannot die as long as their regeneration is still functioning (although creatures with regeneration still fall unconscious when their hit points are below 0). Certain attack forms, typically fire and acid, cause a creature's regeneration to stop functioning on the round following the attack. During this round, the creature does not heal any damage and can die normally. The creature's descriptive text describes the types of damage that cause the regeneration to cease functioning.
Attack forms that don't deal hit point damage are not healed by regeneration. Regeneration also does not restore hit points lost from starvation, thirst, or suffocation. Regenerating creatures can regrow lost portions of their bodies and can reattach severed limbs or body parts if they are brought together within 1 hour of severing. Severed parts that are not reattached wither and die normally.
A creature must have a Constitution score to have the regeneration ability.
As written the regenerating creature will not die (but regeneration will not cure any damage ....). The Green prismatic poison isn't a death effect, so a regenerating creature will not die for that, but if it is brought to 0 constitution its regenerating ability will stop working.
I don't know if there are other effects that can protect you from the death by poison but not from the constitution loss but it is possible there are.
In every instance, FAQed.
In another regeneration thread I was in it was stated that a regen score of 0 and lack of a regen score which is "-" in a statblock are not the same thing.
It is also stated in your quote that "Attack forms that don't deal hit point damage are not healed by regeneration."
Which reminds me that thread got a lot of FAQ's but has yet to be answered. I may need to bump it.
I had always been a bit confused by the Green Prismatic Poison. With an initial effect of death, I've never been sure when the secondary effect and saves to cure would actually come into play.I am posting this so it can be FAQ'd.That is a bit odd. I am going to look into that and get back to you. I have a suspicion that the effect of that ray will need to change. Looks like it was a left over from an earlier version of the poison mechanics.
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing
bump.
How can the secondary effect ever come into play? If you fail your initial save, you die. Doesn't that make the secondary effect and the cure redundant? What am I missing here?
Err.. some things have permanent or temporary immunity to death?
I don't think this needs a FAQ.. it's just an assuming they survive...
According to Jason in the poison blog if you make the first save the second save never comes into affect, and he said the rules on this one would be fixed.