Aura of Chaos


Rules Questions

Liberty's Edge

PRD wrote:
Aura of Chaos (Su): At 8th level, you can surround yourself with a field wild energies. Thee energies manifest as a 30-foot aura of chaos for a number of rounds per day equal to your cleric level. All enemies within this aura must declare one type of action at the start of their turn (attack, cast a spell, move, use an item, or activate a special ability) and make a Will save. Creatures that fail the Will save must take an action other than their declared action. If they succeed, they must take the declared action. Creatures cannot select actions that they cannot perform-

Is there anything stooping a creature from choosing an action it does not want to perform and choosing to fail a save?


Only by lying to the GM.

Telling the GM you really want to perform X when you know want to do Y is the only way.

The intent of the ability is to remove the option(action) that you really want to take.

Liberty's Edge

What if a player uses it?

This power is the protean sub domain 8th level aura btw.


Then the dm is cheating in which case you're screwed anyway?


The GM should also be honest. If he is running a caster(low BAB), and he claims he intended to make a melee attack then he has no right to to complain when there are "raised eyebrows".

Liberty's Edge

Jak the Looney Alchemist wrote:
Then the dm is cheating in which case you're screwed anyway?
prd wrote:
Voluntarily Giving up a Saving Throw: A creature can voluntarily forego a saving throw and willingly accept a spell's result. Even a character with a special resistance to magic can suppress this quality.

how is this cheating? The effect only said choose an action, not an action you wish to do.


As wraithstrike has said they should be choosing an ability that the creature in question wants to use. If they pick a different one and then fail the will save so as to bypass this then by function they are violating the spirit of the rules, RAI, assuming no house ruling.

Edit: Technically according to RAW he's in the clear although as was said he's going to be getting some very odd looks and possibly a rather irate player.


Flashohol wrote:
Jak the Looney Alchemist wrote:
Then the dm is cheating in which case you're screwed anyway?
prd wrote:
Voluntarily Giving up a Saving Throw: A creature can voluntarily forego a saving throw and willingly accept a spell's result. Even a character with a special resistance to magic can suppress this quality.

how is this cheating? The effect only said choose an action, not an action you wish to do.

What what be the point of choosing an ability if it did not matter what you chose just because you found a loophole in the rules?

Since someone can voluntarily fail a save as you mentioned the "aura of chaos" is useless if they don't choose something they really want to do.


Jak the Looney Alchemist wrote:

As wraithstrike has said they should be choosing an ability that the creature in question wants to use. If they pick a different one and then fail the will save so as to bypass this then by function they are violating the spirit of the rules, RAI, assuming no house ruling.

Edit: Technically according to RAW he's in the clear although as was said he's going to be getting some very odd looks and possibly a rather irate player.

Before I continue Jak this is really for Flash. I am just building off of your post.

I agree the by RAW he is clear, but the as we all know common sense has to come into play.

The dead condition in pathfinder does not state that you can no longer take actions, unlike other conditions. I am sure if you try to pull that one off the GM won't even take you seriously.

Liberty's Edge

I believe that the affected creature "should" choose an action is wants to do and then must make a save, but I've got a DM who likes to rule against players in many aspects where the rules are vague or unclear and I don't want to get to level 8 and have a dead ability just because of a technicality.


I feel your pain. There is not much we can do if the GM likes to use loopholes to get over on players.

I would suggest you not take that ability if your GM is likely to not be fair. You could also ask him ahead of time to be sure you both have the same understanding.


Flashohol wrote:
Jak the Looney Alchemist wrote:
Then the dm is cheating in which case you're screwed anyway?
prd wrote:
Voluntarily Giving up a Saving Throw: A creature can voluntarily forego a saving throw and willingly accept a spell's result. Even a character with a special resistance to magic can suppress this quality.
how is this cheating? The effect only said choose an action, not an action you wish to do.

I just wanted to mention that if you really felt like being pedantic...you cannot voluntarily forego the saveing throw against aura of chaos. Let's take a look at that quote above again:

prd wrote:
Voluntarily Giving up a Saving Throw: A creature can voluntarily forego a saving throw and willingly accept a spell's result. Even a character with a special resistance to magic can suppress this quality.

Emphasis mine.

Aura of chaos is not a spell.

This arguement doesn't stop a creature with a poor Will save from choosing an action it doesn't want to do simply because it will more than likely fail, but it would prevent people from choosing failure.

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