Dragon disciple some question for this prestige class with a lot of problems.


Rules Questions


1) There was a talent that give an extra use of claws, such us extra rage?
I'm not refered to Eldritch Heritage of the demonic bloodline, because if he use the demonic claws, he can't use is bite.

Quote:
Dragon Bite (Ex): At 2nd level, whenever the dragon disciple uses his bloodline to grow claws, he also gains a bite attack. This is a primary natural attack that deals 1d6 points of damage (1d4 if the dragon disciple is Small), plus 1–1/2 times the dragon disciple's Strength modifier. Upon reaching 6th level, this bite also deals 1d6 points of energy damage. The type of damage dealt is determined by the dragon disciple's bloodline.

Ok, RAW is not specified the bloodline, so, if i have the demonic bloodline's claws actived (by eldritch heritage or by the crossblooded) I can attack with the bite too. Or not?

2) Grant this f*%#ing blood of the dragons the bonus feats of my draconic bloodline when i'm a dragon disciple?


1a. If you have two bloodlines that give claws it does not allow you to use claws more.
1b. Claws do not stop you from being able to use a bite.
2.I don't understand this question


Alex_UNLIMITED wrote:
1) There was a talent that give an extra use of claws, such us extra rage?

Trait or Feat? Either way, I don't know of one.

Alex_UNLIMITED wrote:
I'm not refered to Eldritch Heritage of the demonic bloodline, because if he use the demonic claws, he can't use is bite.

I'm not sure what you're talking about.

If you have no levels in sorcerer, and you take a level of Dragon Disciple, you gain bloodline powers of the draconic bloodline, using your dragon disciple level as your sorcerer level to determine the bonuses gained. This means you get Claws (Su) from the Draconic Bloodline as soon as you take a level of Dragon Disciple.

I assume the intent is for Dragon Bite to work with the Draconic Bloodline's Claw ability, but it doesn't specifically say so, so if you somehow have claws from another bloodline, by RAW it should also grant you the bite attack. So you'll have to ask your DM.

Alex_UNLIMITED wrote:
2) Grant this f#%#ing blood of the dragons the bonus feats of my draconic bloodline when i'm a dragon disciple?

Upon reaching 2nd level, and every three levels thereafter, a dragon disciple receives one bonus feat, chosen from the draconic bloodline's bonus feat list.


wraithstrike wrote:
1a. If you have two bloodlines that give claws it does not allow you to use claws more.

But, why?


You can only make as many claw attacks as you have claws. Neither spell makes it so that you grow 4 claws. Both of them only changed your hands to claws. If you have 2 claws then you get 2 claw attacks.


1. If you spend two feats using Eldrich Heritage to gain claws from Abyssal you should get double uses of your claws per day.

1b. If you grow claws from your bloodline (does not specify Draconic) you get a Dragon Bite.

2. You don't get any extra feats to choose from Eldrich Heritage for your Bonus Feats when you take Dragon Disciple. If you took the Crossblooded Sorcerer Archetype, more options of bonus feats would be available to you.


Oterisk wrote:
2. You don't get any extra feats to choose from Eldrich Heritage for your Bonus Feats when you take Dragon Disciple. If you took the Crossblooded Sorcerer Archetype, more options of bonus feats would be available to you.

The Dragon Disciple Bloodline Feat specifies you only get bonus feats from the Draconic Bloodline.

If you took more levels of sorcerer, instead of Dragon Disciple, you could take whatever bonus feats you qualify for.

Liberty's Edge

Alex_UNLIMITED wrote:

1) There was a talent that give an extra use of claws, such us extra rage?

I'm not refered to Eldritch Heritage of the demonic bloodline, because if he use the demonic claws, he can't use is bite.
Quote:
Dragon Bite (Ex): At 2nd level, whenever the dragon disciple uses his bloodline to grow claws, he also gains a bite attack. This is a primary natural attack that deals 1d6 points of damage (1d4 if the dragon disciple is Small), plus 1–1/2 times the dragon disciple's Strength modifier. Upon reaching 6th level, this bite also deals 1d6 points of energy damage. The type of damage dealt is determined by the dragon disciple's bloodline.

Ok, RAW is not specified the bloodline, so, if i have the demonic bloodline's claws actived (by eldritch heritage or by the crossblooded) I can attack with the bite too. Or not?

2) Grant this f+++ing blood of the dragons the bonus feats of my draconic bloodline when i'm a dragon disciple?

Bear in mine this is a core rules prestige class, written well before all the other stuff.

It DOES specify a bloodline in the requirements to take the prestige if using sorcerer is uses, the draconic bloodline. The only time you don't use this is if you are using a bard for entering the class. Since this class is specifically tied to draconic bloodline, I would say all the abilities are tied to that bloodlines powers and the Extraordinary Abilities of the class would not effect another bloodline power gained through a feat or archetype. By this note, I personally would not trigger the "Dragon Bite" EX when "Dragon Claws" are not used. This prestige class is VERY specific about the bloodline, so if taking crossblooded archetype, you must take dragon claws and not demon claws to gain the benefits. Every bonus of this class would only tie to draconic if using crossblooded as base

On the claws from multiple bloodlines note, they are totally separate claw types and would have their rounds tracked separately. One is dragon-like claws and the other is demon-like claws.


Grick wrote:

The Dragon Disciple Bloodline Feat specifies you only get bonus feats from the Draconic Bloodline.

If you took more levels of sorcerer, instead of Dragon Disciple, you could take whatever bonus feats you qualify for.

Well, I had it right in my Guide, but that's what I get for going by memory for the quick answer. Darn memory...

Shar Tahl wrote:
Bear in mine this is a core rules prestige class. It DOES specify a bloodline in the requirements to take the prestige if using sorcerer is uses, the draconic bloodline. The only time you don't use this is if you are using a bard for entering the class. Since this class is specifically tied to draconic bloodline, I would say all the abilities are tied to that bloodlines powers and the Extraordinary Abilities of the class would not effect another bloodline power gained through a feat or archetype.

With this logic, you couldn't use Summoner to become a DD because it isn't core. Look, I understand the fluff reasons of what you are saying, but consider this. As a crossblooded sorcerer, you have two bloodlines mingled together. If they are mingled together its possible, at least thematically, they could be used together and would work that way.

With the feats I agree with you, because those are based on character level instead of summoner level. But the Blood of Dragons ability does say that levels of Dragon Disciple do stack with Sorcerer levels when considering the effects of their bloodline.

So in short, it may not be RAI, but it is RAW. It can be made to fit the fluff of the character, and its not game breaking.

To be honest, the whole Prestige class isn't game breaking. Magi can do more damage with spells in combat, and nearly all the melee classes can out damage them.


wraithstrike wrote:
You can only make as many claw attacks as you have claws. Neither spell makes it so that you grow 4 claws. Both of them only changed your hands to claws. If you have 2 claws then you get 2 claw attacks.

I think the question was more about rounds per day than attacks per round. I don't know of any way other than charisma-boosting items to get more rounds.

Liberty's Edge

Oterisk wrote:
stuff

Forgot about summoners being spontaneous, my mistake.

On the other thing, I know full well RAW you can do it any way you like, since it was written before the crossblooded archetype. You clipped off my quoted part right after that where I said "I personally would....", meaning this is how "I" would run things, as I interpret the synergy of the new rules mixed with old material.


Shar Tahl wrote:
Oterisk wrote:
stuff

Forgot about summoners being spontaneous, my mistake.

On the other thing, I know full well RAW you can do it any way you like, since it was written before the crossblooded archetype. You clipped off my quoted part right after that where I said "I personally would....", meaning this is how "I" would run things, as I interpret the synergy of the new rules mixed with old material.

Sorry about that, you are perfectly within your rights to be able to do whatever you want at your table. I'm sure it fits your style. I just get a little defensive about my favorite Prestige Class. In my mind, they are very much misunderstood, and so I wanted to clarify.

Liberty's Edge

not a problem. It is not a optimal path to take(most prestige are not), but I too like this class a lot. I run a kobold dragon disciple in a long running campaign I am in.


wraithstrike wrote:
You can only make as many claw attacks as you have claws. Neither spell makes it so that you grow 4 claws. Both of them only changed your hands to claws. If you have 2 claws then you get 2 claw attacks.

I have understand now. No, I did not want to use 4 calws. LOL

I agree with the demonic bloodline and the bite. The dragon disciple is my favourite prestige class, he deserves it for be a bit more competitive.


Bobson wrote:
wraithstrike wrote:
You can only make as many claw attacks as you have claws. Neither spell makes it so that you grow 4 claws. Both of them only changed your hands to claws. If you have 2 claws then you get 2 claw attacks.
I think the question was more about rounds per day than attacks per round. I don't know of any way other than charisma-boosting items to get more rounds.

In that case disregard my previous answer. I thought the OP was asking about claw attacks per round.

Sorry about that.

Sovereign Court

So as a Crossblooded Sorcerer, who took Draconic as one of their blood lines. Is there any reason why they can’t go Dragon disciple?

Grand Lodge

Oterisk wrote:
With this logic, you couldn't use Summoner to become a DD because it isn't core.

It'd be a questionable choice given that the only things that would be advanced would be the Summoner's spells known and spells per day. That and what the dragon disciple would specifically grant you.


Darius Alch wrote:

So as a Crossblooded Sorcerer, who took Draconic as one of their blood lines. Is there any reason why they can’t go Dragon disciple?

The don't have 5 ranks in Knowledge(Arcana)? That would be it, I think.

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