Modules in place of Eyes of the TEN?

[VanceMadrox]

Just a quick question, how do the new module rules apply to characters who have hit Level 12 but not played the retirement arc?

Would such characters be eligible to play The Ruby Phoenix Tournament module? (since they're within one level)?

If so I assume that they would level to 13 and thus be ineligible for Eyes of the Ten.

Still using the module as an additional form of retirement doesn't seem to bad to me.

[The Grandfather]

You are correct. RFT is an alternative way to reach level 13 without playing EotT.

[Vinyc Kettlebek]

VanceMadrox wrote:

Just a quick question, how do the new module rules apply to characters who have hit Level 12 but not played the retirement arc?

Would such characters be eligible to play The Ruby Phoenix Tournament module? (since they're within one level)?

If so I assume that they would level to 13 and thus be ineligible for Eyes of the Ten.

Still using the module as an additional form of retirement doesn't seem to bad to me.

When you are level 12 you can use modules to level up to 13. You have to be within one level of the module, so the only two modules playable by level 12s to reach 13 are The Ruby Phoenix Tournament, written for level 11s, and Academy of Secrets, written for level 13s. Academy should be saved for a group of level 13s. It might be rough for a group of 12s, and if played at 13 will set you up for Tomb of the Iron Medusa.

[TwilightKnight]

Assuming this is your first character, the best approach is to play Eyes of Ten, after which you will be level 13. Then play Academy of Secrets followed by Iron Medusa. That will leave you at level 15. Perhaps by then there will be a level 15 mod to fill the gap, otherwise you can play Moonscar when it is released in May, followed by Witchwar thereafter. After that who knows. It stands to reason that Paizo will fill out the remaining levels to 20 and perhaps have epic rules that will allow you to go beyond.

[VanceMadrox]

I'm not actually that concerned about going to higher levels, I'm just interested that Damien could still yet play the Ruby Phoenix Tournament. I'm more interested in that then Eyes of the Ten.

[Mark Moreland]

Bear in mind that, while you can play any module you're eligible for, Eyes of the Ten was specifically crafted to act as a capstone to a Pathfinder's normal adventuring career. I'd strongly recommend folks play it over a similarly-leveled module specifically because of its strong ties to the Pathfinder Society Organized Play campaign.

Also, consider that every PC that skips Eyes of the Ten in favor of another 12th-level adventure is one less character reported as having played it, and thus one less bit of data supporting us producing a second retirement arc, which a lot of people have been asking for lately.

[VanceMadrox]

Good points Mark.

Still I think that until we get a 2nd set of retirement scenarios the Ruby Phoenix Tournament works as another good way to retire a character.

[Belarias]

Before the capability of continuing to play modules for PFS play, a few of my players had actually approached me asking "After <character name> retires, can you run a home game that we can continue playing them?"

I was debating this as those characters work well together... I'm glad you solved this puzzle for me.

I was also noticing that the Module Chronicles now have spaces for day jobs, did that get added to modules recently?

And another question, some of these people played through Tomb of the Iron Medusa under the old rules, what would you suggest so I dont have a problem when they hit that level range?

[TwilightKnight]

Make it the best of both worlds. When you reach level 11, play Ruby Phoenix. At the end, you'll be 12th. Then play Eye of Ten, retire, and play in the retirement mods. Win-Win!

[Vinyc Kettlebek]

Belarias wrote:

And another question, some of these people played through Tomb of the Iron Medusa under the old rules, what would you suggest so I dont have a problem when they hit that level range?

Since Tomb of the Iron Medusa can’t be played multiple times by the same player. Those who played it under the old rules would have two options. The first would be to wait for Paizo to publish another module in that level range and play that instead. The second would be to play in Special Events at a Con open to characters of that level. The second might prove to be a pain in the butt, since they might have to play several specials in order to level enough to qualify for the next available module.

[VanceMadrox]

Bob Jonquet wrote:

Make it the best of both worlds. When you reach level 11, play Ruby Phoenix. At the end, you'll be 12th. Then play Eye of Ten, retire, and play in the retirement mods. Win-Win!

Damien's already 12 as you're well aware

[Dragnmoon]

Mark Moreland wrote:

Also, consider that every PC that skips Eyes of the Ten in favor of another 12th-level adventure is one less character reported as having played it, and thus one less bit of data supporting us producing a second retirement arc, which a lot of people have been asking for lately.

Mark, I may be reading The Guide wrong, But I am reading it as saying you Can't play Level 12 Modules In place of the Level 12 Retirement Arc.

PFS Guide Pg 21 wrote:

Once a character reaches 12th level, she may no longer play in tiered scenarios of levels 1–11, but can play special Tier 12 scenarios and events. If a character reaches level 12 by playing a sanctioned module, any XP beyond 33 points are lost prior to starting the Tier 12 scenarios/events. When playing the Tier 12 scenarios, characters receive XP, Prestige Points, and GP—halving each if they use the slow advancement track—as normal. While characters are generally restricted from playing beyond their tier (as explained in Chapter 7), should a PC reach 13th level during a multipart Tier 12 arc, she may play the final installments as a 13th-level character; this is the only exception to the normal tier restrictions.

[Michael Brock]

You are reading it wrong. You can play level 12 modules in place of the Eyes of Ten. The line you bolded is to prevent people from gaming the system to finish the last two scenarios of Eyes of Ten at 14th level.

If you hit 12th level, and you play Ruby Phoenix Tournament or Academy of Secrets, you advance to 13th level at the end of the module.

[Dragnmoon]

Michael Brock wrote:

Yes, you can play level 12 modules in place of the Eyes of Ten. The line you bolded is to prevent people from gaming the system to finish the last two scenarios of Eyes of Ten at 14th level.

If you hit 12th level, and you play Ruby Phoenix Tournament or Academy of Secrets, you advance to 13th level at the end of the module.

Got ya, You may think about in the future editing that to make it more clear.

[Michael Brock]

I don't see anything unclear. It states "starting the Tier 12 scenarios/events." Events include modules, specials, interactives, and any other event that allows play of a 12th level PC. No where is Eyes of Ten singled out. In the future we may have other Tier 12 scenarios. What is exactly unclear about it?

[Dragnmoon]

Michael Brock wrote:

I don't see anything unclear. It states "starting the Tier 12 scenarios/events." Events include modules, specials, interactives, and any other event that allows play of a 12th level PC. No where is Eyes of Ten singled out. In the future we may have other Tier 12 scenarios. What is exactly unclear about it?

At least in my head, Scenarios/Events does not Cover modules, they are 3 distinct things. Many times in the guide the distinction between Module ans scenarios is brought up, this rule if it covers modules goes away from that.

In fact the same section separates them.

That line is not consistent with that distinction.

Edit: Example

Upon reaching 13th level, a character may no longer play Tier 12 adventures, but may play any number of Tier 13 and higher events, scenarios, or sanctioned Pathfinder Modules, advancing 1 level every 3 XP as normal.

The way the guide is written makes it seem we are supposed to think of them as different.

[The Grandfather]

Dragnmoon: Do you have a suggestion for a more clear wording of approximatly the same word count?

[Don Walker]

I know this is very late to the party, but if we equate the word adventure with anything that could generate XP(s) for the PC, then the word 'adventure' would cover it.

And we wouldn't need the awkward phrase: events, scenarios, or sanctioned Pathfinder modules.

[Qstor]

@Don I think that might generate confusion with Adventure Paths?

Maybe a definition section in the Guide to Organized play to define events, sanctioned modules and scenarios?

Mike

[cblome59]

Darn you words!

[Bbauzh ap Aghauzh]

What would you say if I took those words away
Then you couldn't make things new