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According to Ultimate Combat: "An Unarmed Fighter is proficient with all monk weapons, including exotic monk weapons." Which of the following do "monk weapons" entail?
1: Weapons that the monk class is proficient in.
2: Weapons in the monk weapon group (as revised in Ultimate Combat).
3: Weapons with the "monk" special quality.
For some reason, it seems unclear to me. Any assistance would be swell! :)
The reason it seems unclear is because (to my knowledge) the phrase "monk weapons" is never actually defined.
Personally, I'd call it anything with the "monk" weapon quality.
Yes, an undefined phrase would explain my confusion. I'm glad it's not just me! I wonder if they'll ever FAQ the whole "undefined monk weapons" thing?
I'll probably go with your suggestion, for now . . . that would definitely work out.
Slightly OT: I still think it's weird that monks didn't gain proficiency in any of the new "monk" weapons in UC.
Go with the monk tag weapons.
Monk Weapons: If a weapon is specified as a monk weapon, does that mean that monks are automatically proficient with that weapon?
No. It means that they can use this weapon while using flurry of blows. It does not mean that it is added to the list of weapons that a monk is proficient with, unless the weapon description says otherwise.
—Stephen Radney-MacFarland, 10/13/11
This I would beleve is the best evidence though in a roundabout way.
Monk weapons are the weapons monks can flurry with.
Any time the term monk weapon gets used it is refering to weapons monks flurry with except when talking weapon groups.
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yeah, and for the the Unarmed Fighter, its not clear whether they're talking weapon group, or monk tag, or the class Monk's original weapon proficiencies. All it would have taken is one writer looking at the text and being " this is a little ambiguous. clarify it ".
monk:
club, crossbow (light or heavy), dagger, handaxe, javelin, kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shortspear, short sword, shuriken, siangham, sling, and spear.
monk weapon group:
Monk: bo staff, brass knuckles, butterfly sword, cestus, dan bong, double chained kama, double chicken saber, emei piercer, fighting fan, jutte, kama, kusarigama, kyoketsu shoge, lungshuan tamo, monk's spade, nine-ring broadsword, nine-section whip, nunchaku, quarterstaff, rope dart, sai, sansetsukon, seven-branched sword, shang gou, shuriken, siangham, tiger fork, tonfa, tri-point double-edged sword, unarmed strike, urumi, wushu dart
monk tag weapons:
..i'm not going to look them all up...
one group has the basic mix of monk weapons, and some simple weapons.
one group has a primarily melee only group.
all groups have weapons normally classified as "exotic". so logic can't be used to clarify the ambiguity in the write up for the archetype.
its a fair point to ask which one they intended Unarmed Fighter to be proficient in, since its not even specified if he loses all Simple and Martial weapons that a Fighter gets access to.
Since they use the term Monk weapons I would assume it means the same thing it means everywhere else its used.
Though I agree this book is riddled with little things like this that maybe one more going over might have caught.
I actually have a related question. When Unarmed Fighter states that you gain proficiency in Monk weapons, does it mean you only gain proficiency in monk weapons, or in addition to the normal fighter weapon proficiencies?
To the best of my knowledge archetypes are never subtractive unless the archetype specifies otherwise. (Then its usually a replacement for something else)