After looking over the Keep on the Borderlands conversion I got to thinking how awesome it would be to do something similar with the most classic D&D adventure arc by Gary Gygax.
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T1-4 The Temple of Elemental Evil
A1-4 Scourge of the Slave Lords
G1-3 Against the Giants
D1-3 Descent into the Depths of the Earth/Vault of the Drow
Q1 Queen of the Demonweb Pits
Has anyone attempted this? If not would anyone be interested in trying? It only covers up to level 15 so what to do afterwards? Should 14-15 level PCs be able to take on Lolth with as much as she's been upgraded over the years? Maybe it could work if it were just one of her avatars? Is this idea totally crazy? What do you all think?
I love it. I wish Canonfire.com would do more 3.5 conversions.
I would say it was one of her avatar. 15 level PC's normally take on Balor's who down to demon lords who are also beneath Lloth.
Only T1, G1-3 and D1-3 in your list are by Gary Gygax, so you might have to look for some other adventures if you really wanted it to be a "classic Gygax campaign" - S1/3/4 & WG4-6, perhaps?
Ive seen some of the G series converted here a ways back.
Have Lloth be some kind of super-demon, exploiting the power of lost Tharizdun. Ties back into the beginning of the campaign, and you can finish up with the Greyhawk Tharizdun adventure.
(WG2?) It's been a while.
I think you're giving a little to much weight to the suggested levels of the modules. That is AD&D, the actual challenge ratings of the encounters will often be wildly different, but that's a good thing. You've got a lot of ground to cover in that list of yours, the party will likely be topping 15th level by the time they finish with the giants.
So, take them to 20th (and capstones) with D1-3 + Q1 and face Lolth in a high-level magic flinging extravaganza. Sure combat can be a pain at that level, but it's only once; and a truly epic way to end the ultimate Gygax campaign.
@Callum
Ah! Good point. But still T and A are traditionally considered the lead up to the others. As per the presentation provided in the Queen of the Spiders reprint. Even if part of it wasn't straight from Gygax taken together it's about the most classic campaign arc there is.
@Lincoln Hills
Those are some excellent points you bring up. Streamlining all the needless combat seems like the way to go. As for keeping the party on track in the old days going off the rails wasn't even an option. These days I'm sure most GMs can find more gentle ways of directing the party. I wouldn't worry about that too much.
@ Can'tFindthePath
Ya I think you're right. The best way to handle it would be just to re-level things a bit. It seems to me the completion of the A series should mark the half way point of the leveling process at 10th. Then G and D could take things to say 18th or 19th and have Q top things off at max level.
Thanks Lincoln Hills,
I was thinking of WG5. I haven't run it recently, but the last time I did, it turned out to be significantly harder than advertised for the players. The organization of the enemy, and the synergy between the monsters and the traps add up to a lot.
Because it is, in effect, two adventures in one, it would be easy just to pump up the second half.
Or course, if you would rather go with the traditional GDQ sequence, then just impose some kind of explanation like "The demon form is all the power she can manifest on this plane", or something like this.
Lloth won't be destroyed utterly, but that isn't required for a win.
You might be interested in this thread!
@Callum
Ah! Good point. But still T and A are traditionally considered the lead up to the others. As per the presentation provided in the Queen of the Spiders reprint. Even if part of it wasn't straight from Gygax taken together it's about the most classic campaign arc there is.@Lincoln Hills
Those are some excellent points you bring up. Streamlining all the needless combat seems like the way to go. As for keeping the party on track in the old days going off the rails wasn't even an option. These days I'm sure most GMs can find more gentle ways of directing the party. I wouldn't worry about that too much.@ Can'tFindthePath
Ya I think you're right. The best way to handle it would be just to re-level things a bit. It seems to me the completion of the A series should mark the half way point of the leveling process at 10th. Then G and D could take things to say 18th or 19th and have Q top things off at max level.
To me the best way to approach this would be to figure out the 'milestones' along the way, pauses in the action where it would be appropriate to level up the characters and then to do so. That way when you're going back and tailoring the fights you'll know what level your characters will be for each encounter.
Thanks Lincoln Hills,
I was thinking of WG5. I haven't run it recently, but the last time I did, it turned out to be significantly harder than advertised for the players. The organization of the enemy, and the synergy between the monsters and the traps add up to a lot.
Because it is, in effect, two adventures in one, it would be easy just to pump up the second half.
Or course, if you would rather go with the traditional GDQ sequence, then just impose some kind of explanation like "The demon form is all the power she can manifest on this plane", or something like this.
Lloth won't be destroyed utterly, but that isn't required for a win.
The titular Demonweb Pits are in the Abyss, no?. It is "real" Lolth. And I'm pretty sure she originally had 66 hp, though can also use Heal 3x per day. Obviously she needs a complete rework to fit 3.x/PF power levels. As a cleric-spell-granting deity, she should be unfightable on her home plane, but ignoring that, the DWP are presented as a level of the Abyss, so she's got to be a demon lord for that to make any sense.
I understand she's statted in 4e MM3, for whatever that's worth.
I love the way she's statted out in 4e FWIW.
I see no reason why the 'Demonweb Pits' couldn't be a demi-plane built as a sort of proving ground for faithful and foes alike, presided over by an avatar... A level 18 wizard could do as much by himself given a few weeks to prepare. Of course, their intrusion into the Pits would draw Lloth's attention to them and viola - there's your higher level campaign.
Could use the Aspect stuff presented in some book. The "Loth" in the demonweb pits might just be an aspect of loth, A small piece of her that is just the right power level for the adventure.