Critique my sorcerer build?


Advice


She's a 1st level, 15 point buy half elf sorcerer for Kingmaker.

Build:
Sorcerer

Female
Half-Elf
Sorcerer 1
Lawful Good

Strength 10
Dexterity 12
Constitution 13
Intelligence 12
Wisdom 13
Charisma 16

Size: Medium
Height: 5' 4"
Weight: 120 lb
Eyes: Green
Hair: Blond
Skin: Light

Hit Points: 8
Speed: 30 feet

Armor Class: 11
Touch AC: 11
Flat-footed: 10

Initiative modifier: + 1
Fortitude save: + 1
Reflex save: + 1
Will save: + 3
Attack (handheld): + 0
Attack (missile): + 1
Combat Maneuver Bonus: + 0
Combat Maneuver Defense: + 11

Languages: Common

Gear:

Dagger
Spear
Crossbow
Backpack
Bedroll
Blanket, winter
Flint and steel
Lantern (bullseye)
Rations
Waterskin
Whetstone

Feats:

Combat Casting
Skill Focus (Use Magic Device)

Skill ranks:

Use Magic Device 1

Favored class bonus: +1 HP

Spells Known:

0

Bleed
Disrupt Undead
Prestidigitation
Light

1

Cause Fear
Magic Missile

Spells per day: 4 first level

Bloodline: Undead

Fluff:
Born in Ulfen, Sorcerer is the bastard child of a human woman and an elf father, whom she never met. Her status as the product of a union her grandparents expressly forbid gained her no love in her village, and her shyness and awkwardness did not help matters. Her manifestation of a necromantic sorcery bloodline was the last straw, and she was stripped her of her name and cast out of her village. Along and unwelcome in her homeland, Sorcerer drifted, seeking someplace of her own, eventually ending up in Brevoy. Perhaps here she will find a place in the world. All she knows is that there are bandits making people's lives miserable, and she can't bring herself to do nothing about it when she has the power to help.

Sorcerer is a woman of medium height, and despite being only half elven, she looks full elven and is very frequently mistaken as such by non-elves. This is rather ironic, as she has never lived among elves, knows nothing of elven culture, and doesn't know a single word of the elven language. She has blond hair, green eyes, and a shy, withdrawn demeanor. She isn't very talkative and a paralyzing fear of social situations, but she has a very strong sense of right and wrong, and is willing to risk her life over it.

Is this a good build?


Looks pretty good to me, I see that you picked ray of enfeeblement though and I really think you should reconsider. It seems to me that you want that spell to be from the necromancy school so how about considering something like chill touch of cause fear (you can always unlearn later and cause fear is pretty good at low levels).


pipedreamsam wrote:
Looks pretty good to me, I see that you picked ray of enfeeblement though and I really think you should reconsider. It seems to me that you want that spell to be from the necromancy school so how about considering something like chill touch of cause fear (you can always unlearn later and cause fear is pretty good at low levels).

Ray of enfeeblement looks really good. Does it not work in play as good as it looks like it does? I'm not that experienced with spellcasters.


Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
pipedreamsam wrote:
Looks pretty good to me, I see that you picked ray of enfeeblement though and I really think you should reconsider. It seems to me that you want that spell to be from the necromancy school so how about considering something like chill touch of cause fear (you can always unlearn later and cause fear is pretty good at low levels).
Ray of enfeeblement looks really good. Does it not work in play as good as it looks like it does? I'm not that experienced with spellcasters.

I mean its OK. 1d6 + 1 is going to equate to 4.5 average damage so that is reducing the damage and attack by two. You have to succeed on a ranged touch attack and they get a save for half. So there are probably better actions you could be taking.

If you want to go the debuffing route cause fear just outclasses this altogether. Same range as the ray and the enemy gets a save, but suffers a partial effect no matter what (shaken -2 to attacks, skill checks ability checks and saves, how bout that?). If they get partial it only lasts for one round, but that lasts long enough to dispatch normally. Also you do not have to succeed on an attack roll.

I changed my mind about chill touch do not consider it just stick with mm. Also consider buying a crossbow.


pipedreamsam wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
pipedreamsam wrote:
Looks pretty good to me, I see that you picked ray of enfeeblement though and I really think you should reconsider. It seems to me that you want that spell to be from the necromancy school so how about considering something like chill touch of cause fear (you can always unlearn later and cause fear is pretty good at low levels).
Ray of enfeeblement looks really good. Does it not work in play as good as it looks like it does? I'm not that experienced with spellcasters.

I mean its OK. 1d6 + 1 is going to equate to 4.5 average damage so that is reducing the damage and attack by two. You have to succeed on a ranged touch attack and they get a save for half. So there are probably better actions you could be taking.

If you want to go the debuffing route cause fear just outclasses this altogether. Same range as the ray and the enemy gets a save, but suffers a partial effect no matter what (shaken -2 to attacks, skill checks ability checks and saves, how bout that?). If they get partial it only lasts for one round, but that lasts long enough to dispatch normally. Also you do not have to succeed on an attack roll.

I changed my mind about chill touch do not consider it just stick with mm. Also consider buying a crossbow.

I switched out ray of enfeeblement for cause fear and got a crossbow.


Also take a look at your first bloodline power, if you really hate someone you can soften them up with cause fear and if they pass you can touch them and bam, automatic fear (make sure your HD exceeds theirs). I hadn't looked at that bloodline yet, but it seems super solid now that I do. Decent bonus spells, some nice feat selection (no combat maneuver feats, power attack or cleave) and the powers are pretty good save for that 3rd level one. Note you get chill touch for free at third level so meh.

If you need any other help just let me know and i'll be happy to give my opinion.


One question. Is the fact that I lack spellcraft and knowledge arcana a problem?


Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
One question. Is the fact that I lack spellcraft and knowledge arcana a problem?

I haven't played the Kingmaker AP, but from my understanding early on it focuses on badits. Either way it should not be a problem early on and you do only have three skill points per level. Do you plan on using spells not from your list fairly often? If not then just forget about UMD and focus that skill focus to something like spellcraft or even perception to negate that not a class skill problem.

Btw, what is the story to having undead as a bloodline?


why you have only one skill? with int 12 you can put 1 rank in spellcraft and knoledge arcana


Nicos wrote:
why you have only one skill? with int 12 you can put 1 rank in spellcraft and knoledge arcana

I could, but she knows very little about magic, as she hasn't had a chance to study it, so I don't want to buy those skills unless it'll make her absolutely useless. Buying them doesn't make sense with her backstory. Despite her +1 Int modifier she's very poorly educated, and losing 2/3 of her entitled skillpoints reflects that.


pipedreamsam wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
One question. Is the fact that I lack spellcraft and knowledge arcana a problem?

I haven't played the Kingmaker AP, but from my understanding early on it focuses on badits. Either way it should not be a problem early on and you do only have three skill points per level. Do you plan on using spells not from your list fairly often? If not then just forget about UMD and focus that skill focus to something like spellcraft or even perception to negate that not a class skill problem.

Btw, what is the story to having undead as a bloodline?

I could switch out UMD for perception. As for spellcraft, I can't explain how she'd have it. She's an illiterate, uneducated peasant, so where would she learn?


Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
Nicos wrote:
why you have only one skill? with int 12 you can put 1 rank in spellcraft and knoledge arcana
I could, but she knows very little about magic, as she hasn't had a chance to study it, so I don't want to buy those skills unless it'll make her absolutely useless. Buying them doesn't make sense with her backstory. Despite her +1 Int modifier she's very poorly educated it, and losing 2/3 of her entitled skillpoints reflects that.

mmm lose skill point is not a good option. you can buy survival reflecting the fact that she grow in a hard enviroment. perception is alwasys good to have.


pipedreamsam wrote:
Btw, what is the story to having undead as a bloodline?

Sorcerer has no clue how she got the bloodline. She knows nothing of her paternal line, so it could be something there, or it could be some hidden secret in her maternal line.


Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:


Btw, what is the story to having undead as a bloodline?
I could switch out UMD for perception. As for spellcraft, I can't explain how she'd have it. She's an illiterate, uneducated peasant, so where would she learn?

From the same place her magic sprang from. Mysterious odd knowledge that shouldn't be there. One rank could easily be an 'intuitive understanding' of magical concepts.

Though honestly spellcraft isn't needed per se.


Nicos wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
Nicos wrote:
why you have only one skill? with int 12 you can put 1 rank in spellcraft and knoledge arcana
I could, but she knows very little about magic, as she hasn't had a chance to study it, so I don't want to buy those skills unless it'll make her absolutely useless. Buying them doesn't make sense with her backstory. Despite her +1 Int modifier she's very poorly educated it, and losing 2/3 of her entitled skillpoints reflects that.
mmm lose skill point is not a good option. you can buy survival reflecting the fact that she grow in a hard enviroment. perception is alwasys good to have.

I could get survival, perception, and I can't think of a good third. Just go with the two?


I really think spellcraft can wait especially if it conflicts with your character idea. How about bluff for trying to hide the fact that shes got undead roots? I just feel like UMD is wasted if you do not plan on picking casting spells from other lists (remember you do not need to to make checks if the spell on the device is on your list).


Climb or Swim, if you don't want to have an 'educated' character. Any character should be able to learn those. Also, you might want to consider acrobatics: opponents don't expect a sorcerer to tumble out of the way. LOL

Master Arminas


What about climb, swim, and survival? I kinda like that array.

I don't like bluff. She has moral qualms about lying (she'd do it if she absolutely had to, but only reluctantly so), and isn't very socially adept.


I don't see swim working too well considering she's coming from the frozen north... such lands usually kill swimmers -- in fact she might think the very thought of swimming is that of a last ditch effort akin to suicide.

Profession makes sense, as would a craft skill -- perhaps alchemy? Heal would work too.


use that skill point, even choosing climb is better thatn nothing.

If UMD bothers you for background rason, then take swin (ulfen swin a lot don`t they?) or sense motive (people alwasy try to advantage of alittle girl) or profesion ( she had to do something to get money). this are the skill i think that maybe fit with your background.


I'd keep perception, even if I had to use my favored class on it instead of hit points. But that is just me. So that would be Climb, Perception, Survival, and Swim. I, personally would drop UMD and just go with the other four. Remember, it should be a few levels before you get anything to use UMD with.

If you really want to keep UMD, change the favored class bonus to a skill rank and you are set.

Master Arminas


Abraham spalding wrote:
I don't see swim working too well considering she's coming from the frozen north... such lands usually kill swimmers -- in fact she might think the very thought of swimming is that of a last ditch effort akin to suicide.

Not necessarily. People up north do swim. Just ask a Canadian or Norwegian.


master arminas wrote:

I'd keep perception, even if I had to use my favored class on it instead of hit points. But that is just me. So that would be Climb, Perception, Survival, and Swim. I, personally would drop UMD and just go with the other four. Remember, it should be a few levels before you get anything to use UMD with.

If you really want to keep UMD, change the favored class bonus to a skill rank and you are set.

Master Arminas

I think I'll keep my favored class bonus handing out HP, and go with swim, climb, and survival.


i would choose, swin, survival an perception.

percetion is just too good and necesary.


Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
Abraham spalding wrote:
I don't see swim working too well considering she's coming from the frozen north... such lands usually kill swimmers -- in fact she might think the very thought of swimming is that of a last ditch effort akin to suicide.
Not necessarily. People up north do swim. Just ask a Canadian or Norwegian.

Yeah in heated modern pools or specific hot water springs that don't kill them due to toxic gasses or high temperatures. Swimming isn't going to be a common activity where the average temperature never exceeds 80 degrees Fahrenheit.

I think craft(alchemy) or the heal skill would be more useful in both the short and long term. I can easily see survival and perception -- those simply make sense, however if she's a 'simple peasant girl confused and on the run' especially from the north then shouldn't she have a more peasant like skill of actual usefulness than swim?

Though I could be inferring too much from the Ulfen blood.


Acid splash or ray of frost are good ranged touch attacks. Add a flask of acid as a focus item and acid splash does 1d3+1. The max damage is lower than the X-bow but cantrips are unlimited ammo and they ignore shields and armor. And have no weight or save. Sleep is a good lower level spell. Improved unarmed strike is fun if you want to mess with the DM. Grapple you say...face punch[AoO].


Abraham spalding wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
Abraham spalding wrote:
I don't see swim working too well considering she's coming from the frozen north... such lands usually kill swimmers -- in fact she might think the very thought of swimming is that of a last ditch effort akin to suicide.
Not necessarily. People up north do swim. Just ask a Canadian or Norwegian.
Yeah in heated modern pools or specific hot water springs that don't kill them due to toxic gasses or high temperatures. Swimming isn't going to be a common activity where the average temperature never exceeds 80 degrees Fahrenheit.

You'd be surprised. The Norse swam.


Consider dropping the multitalented racial trait (I saw how you felt about that on a previous thread) and grab arcane training, its better than you think.

If nothing else just go knowledge religion, never hurts to know more about where you came from.


Hmm. Maybe I could dump her intelligence down to 8 for a couple extra points of charisma, then go with survival as my skill.

Lantern Lodge

Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
pipedreamsam wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
One question. Is the fact that I lack spellcraft and knowledge arcana a problem?

I haven't played the Kingmaker AP, but from my understanding early on it focuses on badits. Either way it should not be a problem early on and you do only have three skill points per level. Do you plan on using spells not from your list fairly often? If not then just forget about UMD and focus that skill focus to something like spellcraft or even perception to negate that not a class skill problem.

Btw, what is the story to having undead as a bloodline?

I could switch out UMD for perception. As for spellcraft, I can't explain how she'd have it. She's an illiterate, uneducated peasant, so where would she learn?

Arhhh.... if she is illiterate, how does she has Int 12? I ask this cos, for each int modifier you learn a new language, as in read, write and speak, a new language. So how does does she justify it?

Note: I know that Int is more then just knowing languages. But knowledge and linguistics ARE PART of Int in the game...


When it always hot and humid you adapt, when if cool you adapt...when God hates you you are born with hair and thick cold resistance skin in a hot and humid enviroment...Mr. Fishy is hot and miserable 10 months a year...and cold six days...Mr. Fishy knows what he did...

And it's call a "polar bear plunge".


The problem with arcane training is that she was specifically forbidden from anything that had anything to do with magic (that, combined with her family's reaction to her manifestation of sorcery, suggests they may know something about how she got the undead bloodline). She knows nothing about magic, despite being able to use it.


Secane wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
pipedreamsam wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
One question. Is the fact that I lack spellcraft and knowledge arcana a problem?

I haven't played the Kingmaker AP, but from my understanding early on it focuses on badits. Either way it should not be a problem early on and you do only have three skill points per level. Do you plan on using spells not from your list fairly often? If not then just forget about UMD and focus that skill focus to something like spellcraft or even perception to negate that not a class skill problem.

Btw, what is the story to having undead as a bloodline?

I could switch out UMD for perception. As for spellcraft, I can't explain how she'd have it. She's an illiterate, uneducated peasant, so where would she learn?

Arhhh.... if she is illiterate, how does she has Int 12? I ask this cos, for each int modifier you learn a new language, as in read, write and speak, a new language. So how does does she justify it?

Note: I know that Int is more then just knowing languages. But knowledge and linguistics ARE PART of Int in the game...

I chose to skip the extra language. I also skipped her knowledge of elven (which, by RAW, half-elves have). She looks exactly like an elf, despite being only half elf, and I like the idea of the elf not being able to speak the language.


I dropped her int and redid skill points.

Revised Build:
Sorcerer

Female
Half-Elf
Sorcerer 1
Lawful Good

Strength 10
Dexterity 12
Constitution 12
Intelligence 8
Wisdom 13
Charisma 18

Size: Medium
Height: 5' 4"
Weight: 120 lb
Eyes: Green
Hair: Blond
Skin: Light

Hit Points: 8
Speed: 30 feet

Armor Class: 11
Touch AC: 11
Flat-footed: 10

Initiative modifier: + 1
Fortitude save: + 1
Reflex save: + 1
Will save: + 3
Attack (handheld): + 0
Attack (missile): + 1
Combat Maneuver Bonus: + 0
Combat Maneuver Defense: + 11

Languages: Common

Gear:

Dagger
Spear
Crossbow
Backpack
Bedroll
Blanket, winter
Flint and steel
Lantern (bullseye)
Rations
Waterskin
Whetstone

Feats:

Combat Casting
Skill Focus (Survival)

Skill ranks:

Survival 1

Note: Sorcerer is illiterate

Favored class bonus: +1 HP

Spells Known:

0

Bleed
Disrupt Undead
Prestidigitation
Light

1

Cause Fear
Magic Missile

Spells per day: 4 first level

Bloodline: Undead

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