My DM took the nerf bat to my character for the 5th time today and so I retired the character, have been .
I am wanting to play a caster, but have been told that I am not allowed to play a Sorcerer or a Magus.
I would prefer to be able to do spell damage because the group already has a front line tank, and a ranger.
Are there any suggestions of which caster class to play that would be good?
I am hesitant to pick a druid because my DM has said "Animal companions and Eidolons can not take the Improved Natural Weapon Feat because it is in the Monster Manual."
(This was the straw that made me retire my old character.)
Gandalf.
No wait, Merlin.
Ooh, ooh, Ulrich of Craggenmoor. Yeah, that's a good one.
From the way it sounds, if you play anything that actually works your gm is going to nerf it. An evoker wizard can do plenty of spell damage but you may feel underpowered compared to the damage of the front line characters. If you want to be effective and not flashy a bard can make everyone else better without making it look like you do something worth getting nerfed over.
How'd you get nerfed?
Consult with Trinam and play a barbarian to show your GM casties are not the problem.
Witch has neat flavor but little in the way of direct damage.
Wizard is lots of fun.
How'd you get nerfed?
Decrees by my DM:
Nerf #1 Augment Summoning does not work for my spell like abilities to summon creatures.
Nerf #2 My spell like abilities can't be used to make scrolls of summon monsters.
Nerf #3 When summoning monsters, I had to use Handle Animal checks to control the monsters, pushing them to do tricks that they didn't know, like attacking.
Nerf #4 The Eidolon was forbidden from taking ranks in use magic device.
Nerf #5 Improved Natural Attack was not allowed as a feat for the Eidolon to take.
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I will be allowed to bring in a level 7 character. So I want the most fun for my time. I also want to step away from the summoning circle and rely on myself and not creatures that I summon.
My DM took the nerf bat to my character for the 5th time today and so I retired the character, have been .
I am wanting to play a caster, but have been told that I am not allowed to play a Sorcerer or a Magus.
I would prefer to be able to do spell damage because the group already has a front line tank, and a ranger.
Are there any suggestions of which caster class to play that would be good?
I am hesitant to pick a druid because my DM has said "Animal companions and Eidolons can not take the Improved Natural Weapon Feat because it is in the Monster Manual."
(This was the straw that made me retire my old character.)
Not allowed to play certain classes? Why not? Why is this a game you want to continue to be a part of?
Not allowed to play certain classes? Why not? Why is this a game you want to continue to be a part of?
Not allowed to play classes because we already have chracters that are those classes.
Currently this is the only game that I know of that is playing, and people that I know are playing in it.
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How about an Oracle? If your DM will let you pick Inflict instead of Cure (I've known some DM who won't even if the character in question wasn't evil) then you could do some decent spell damage with that. A lot of Oracle abilities really start to come into their own at Level 7, so you'd be skipping out on the crap levels and getting straight to the good stuff.
Barbarians are the full-BAB caster, and Spell Sunder is amazing, but it sounds like you want an actual casty-type casty.
I recommend a witch, if only because Hexes are an amazing and beautiful thing. Evil Eye+Cackle is insane, you're an INT-based progression, and your spell list still includes useful things like CLW and Summon Monster (and haste if you get the agility patron)!
How'd you get nerfed?Decrees by my DM:
Nerf #1 Augment Summoning does not work for my spell like abilities to summon creatures.
Nerf #2 My spell like abilities can't be used to make scrolls of summon monsters.
Nerf #3 When summoning monsters, I had to use Handle Animal checks to control the monsters, pushing them to do tricks that they didn't know, like attacking.
Nerf #4 The Eidolon was forbidden from taking ranks in use magic device.
Nerf #5 Improved Natural Attack was not allowed as a feat for the Eidolon to take.
Edit:.....Forgot one.
Nerf #6 When going from flying to landing, the check was a DC 25. Failure wad 4d6 damage for a crash landing. (At that point the eidolon stopped flying for the rest of the game.)
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I will be allowed to bring in a level 7 character. So I want the most fun for my time. I also want to step away from the summoning circle and rely on myself and not creatures that I summon.
How'd you get nerfed?Decrees by my DM:
Nerf #1 Augment Summoning does not work for my spell like abilities to summon creatures.
Nerf #2 My spell like abilities can't be used to make scrolls of summon monsters.
Nerf #3 When summoning monsters, I had to use Handle Animal checks to control the monsters, pushing them to do tricks that they didn't know, like attacking.
Nerf #4 The Eidolon was forbidden from taking ranks in use magic device.
Nerf #5 Improved Natural Attack was not allowed as a feat for the Eidolon to take.
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I will be allowed to bring in a level 7 character. So I want the most fun for my time. I also want to step away from the summoning circle and rely on myself and not creatures that I summon.
Well, if you want to rely on yourself, then I suggest (drumroll please)...
An Alchemist!
But-
IMO there isn't a good guide for how to play Alchemists that takes into account all of the wonderful goodies of this past year's books (until I write it, mwahahaha), so you could do a lot worse than to try wizard. Check out Treantmonk's Excellent Guide
Barbarians are the full-BAB caster, and Spell Sunder is amazing, but it sounds like you want an actual casty-type casty.
I recommend a witch, if only because Hexes are an amazing and beautiful thing. Evil Eye+Cackle is insane, you're an INT-based progression, and your spell list still includes useful things like CLW and Summon Monster (and haste if you get the agility patron)!
We already have: (Arrows indicate that a character switch will occur.)
SorcererCleric ---> Oricle
Magus
Witch
Fighter
Summoner ---> ???? (Me)
You could always play a druid that doesn't use an animal companion.
What kind of sorcerer
EDIT: Also what books/material are allowed?
What kind of sorcerer
EDIT: Also what books/material are allowed?
Non-specialized. Serpentine Bloodline.
A wizard can be pretty deadly. Played right, they can be downright devastating. There is a reason why the concept "god wizard" exists.
What kind of sorcerer
EDIT: Also what books/material are allowed?
Non-specialized. Serpentine Bloodline.
Does he make many attack rolls with things like rays/etc?
EDIT: Also what books/material are allowed?
Apparently only "Pathfinder approved" the DM isn't a big fan of 3rd party publications unless they have been licensed by Paizo.
The sorcerer rarely attacks with rays.
Most common spells I have seen her cast:
Call stone, magic missile, mage armor, and charm person.
Bard is pretty good if you want to be your Magus and Fighters' best friends, and be a skillmonkey to boot.
If you want to help the oracle, a battle cleric could be a good option.
If you want to make your GM cry you could play a Barbarian, but that's not a caster so it's not what you're asking for so screw that.
7th level character.
You want to play a spellcaster.
You're not going to make a Magus, Sorcerer, or Summoner.
You'd like to deal damage with spells.
Your party includes a tank (what class?) and a ranger, and . . . anyone else?
Are there any other important restrictions or house rules? (Which books are allowed, for example.)
Assuming your "tank" is a fighter, and the party only has three members, I would consider making a Witch. They're not great at direct damage, but the Elements patron will make DD an option. Witch gives a good range of spells, and hexes will give you some reusable combat powers. 7th level is good place to start a Witch. You'll have 4th level spells, 4-9 hexes, and a number of hexes improve at 8th level.
7th level character.
You want to play a spellcaster.
You're not going to make a Magus, Sorcerer, or Summoner.
You'd like to deal damage with spells.
Your party includes a tank (what class?) and a ranger, and . . . anyone else?
Are there any other important restrictions or house rules? (Which books are allowed, for example.)Assuming your "tank" is a fighter, and the party only has three members, I would consider making a Witch. They're not great at direct damage, but the Elements patron will make DD an option. Witch gives a good range of spells, and hexes will give you some reusable combat powers. 7th level is good place to start a Witch. You'll have 4th level spells, 4-9 hexes, and a number of hexes improve at 8th level.
The Tank is a 2 handed fighter.
Sorcerer, Magus, Witch, and Summoner are off limits.House rules:
When healing if you roll a 1 re-roll it.
If you die, throw a fit for the next 10 minutes and the DM will make you not dead.
7th level character.
You want to play a spellcaster.
You're not going to make a Magus, Sorcerer, or Summoner.
You'd like to deal damage with spells.
Your party includes a tank (what class?) and a ranger, and . . . anyone else?
Are there any other important restrictions or house rules? (Which books are allowed, for example.)Assuming your "tank" is a fighter, and the party only has three members, I would consider making a Witch. They're not great at direct damage, but the Elements patron will make DD an option. Witch gives a good range of spells, and hexes will give you some reusable combat powers. 7th level is good place to start a Witch. You'll have 4th level spells, 4-9 hexes, and a number of hexes improve at 8th level.
The Tank is a 2 handed fighter.
Sorcerer, Magus, Witch, and Summoner are off limits.House rules:When healing if you roll a 1 re-roll it.
If you die, throw a fit for the next 10 minutes and the DM will make you not dead.
yeah I would totally ask Trinam for barbarian guidance and freaking roll over your gm's plans.
or play a mystic theurge, because thats how I roll.
If you die, throw a fit for the next 10 minutes and the DM will make you not dead.
This can be abused.
We need to make a suicide bomber character who kills himself AND anything in a 30' radius.
If you die, throw a fit for the next 10 minutes and the DM will make you not dead.This can be abused.
We need to make a suicide bomber character who kills himself AND anything in a 30' radius.
Oh, stop, you derailer you.
If you die, throw a fit for the next 10 minutes and the DM will make you not dead.This can be abused.
We need to make a suicide bomber character who kills himself AND anything in a 30' radius.
I gave strong consideration to a Psionic type or a Warlock. But I find the warlock very limiting and am very unfamiliar with the Psionic type.
I gave strong consideration to a Psionic type or a Warlock. But I find the warlock very limiting and am very unfamiliar with the Psionic type.If you die, throw a fit for the next 10 minutes and the DM will make you not dead.This can be abused.
We need to make a suicide bomber character who kills himself AND anything in a 30' radius.
Neither of those are Paizo core that I've seen. Is he allowing other sourcebooks from 3.5 or something? Or is the Psionics book Paizo approved?
Neither of those are Paizo core that I've seen. Is he allowing other sourcebooks from 3.5 or something? Or is the Psionics book Paizo approved?I gave strong consideration to a Psionic type or a Warlock. But I find the warlock very limiting and am very unfamiliar with the Psionic type.If you die, throw a fit for the next 10 minutes and the DM will make you not dead.This can be abused.
We need to make a suicide bomber character who kills himself AND anything in a 30' radius.
He is very wishy washy on the books that he will allow. However, if it bears the Paizo logo it is usually good enough for him.
...
Ok! So. I'm not familiar with much outside of Paizo's core, but it sounds like Warlocks are a little narrow for you. I'd recommend familiarizing yourself with a psion to see if it's for you.
How'd you get nerfed?Decrees by my DM:
Nerf #1 Augment Summoning does not work for my spell like abilities to summon creatures.
Nerf #2 My spell like abilities can't be used to make scrolls of summon monsters.
Nerf #3 When summoning monsters, I had to use Handle Animal checks to control the monsters, pushing them to do tricks that they didn't know, like attacking.
Nerf #4 The Eidolon was forbidden from taking ranks in use magic device.
Nerf #5 Improved Natural Attack was not allowed as a feat for the Eidolon to take.
Edit:.....Forgot one.
Nerf #6 When going from flying to landing, the check was a DC 25. Failure wad 4d6 damage for a crash landing. (At that point the eidolon stopped flying for the rest of the game.)
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I will be allowed to bring in a level 7 character. So I want the most fun for my time. I also want to step away from the summoning circle and rely on myself and not creatures that I summon.
I think #2 and #3 are actually the correct interpretations and not a nerf.
The other 4 though... well #5 could be ok, the GM is allowed to exclude material, but he should say before the game what you can and can't use.
#6 is just stupid, what was his reason for "I fly 5 cm above the ground and then stop flying" gives 4d6 damage?
Ok! So. I'm not familiar with much outside of Paizo's core, but it sounds like Warlocks are a little narrow for you. I'd recommend familiarizing yourself with a psion to see if it's for you.
Seems so. I'll give it a shot. We already have a high elf in game. So why not a Drow Noble. >:)
Seems so. I'll give it a shot. We already have a high elf in game. So why not a Drow Noble. >:)
Ok! So. I'm not familiar with much outside of Paizo's core, but it sounds like Warlocks are a little narrow for you. I'd recommend familiarizing yourself with a psion to see if it's for you.
Woah, woah woah.
Are you trying to cause massive party conflict and troll your game?
Because if that is your objective, while I don't support it there's a much better way to go about it.
Psion is likely to aggravate a DM who's gotten himself good and familiar with enormously complex magic rules and now must deal with a whole new book of stuff that only applies to one character. Psi power points, and so forth. And anyway, there's three psi classes, each based off either Int, Will, or Cha. Sound familiar? I skimmed over some of it a while ago and a lot of it is the same spells with different names. So, like, why play a psychic warrior when you can play a cleric?
Consider that he now has to go through the psi material if you're to get any decent equipment that boosts your class abilities. Consider that you may totally nerf his encounters by getting around them in completely unexpected ways by using non-core-based material. If there's any friction at all between you and DM, this will not be the solution. Unless DM is dropping hints that he wants Psi in his campaign.
Sorcerer, Magus, Witch, and Summoner are off limits.
So, you want to play a spellcaster,
Off limits: Sorcerer, Magus, Witch, SummonerNot spellcasters: Rogue, Barbarian, Paladin, Fighter, Monk, Cavalier
Gunslinger, Ranger
Spellcasters who don't deal much damage with spells: Bard, Cleric, Druid, Inquisitor, Oracle, Alchemist
Allowable classes that deal damage with spells: Wizard
If you're willing to count bombs as "dealing damage with spells" and count a six-level caster as a spellcaster, you may enjoy an Alchemist.
I suppose I'll think on it for a week or so. No more games until next year.
I suppose I'll think on it for a week or so. No more games until next year.
A very good call. There is never a need to move hastily.
Sorcerer, Magus, Witch, and Summoner are off limits.So, you want to play a spellcaster,
Off limits: Sorcerer, Magus, Witch, Summoner
Not spellcasters: Rogue, Barbarian, Paladin, Fighter, Monk, Cavalier
Gunslinger, Ranger
Spellcasters who don't deal much damage with spells: Bard, Cleric, Druid, Inquisitor, Oracle, Alchemist
Allowable classes that deal damage with spells: WizardIf you're willing to count bombs as "dealing damage with spells" and count a six-level caster as a spellcaster, you may enjoy an Alchemist.
But make sure DM is okay with Alchemists. If he's hard on Summoners, he may consider sneak attack bonus + INT via touch AC a step in the wrong direction. And they come from the same book.
If he does allow Alchemists, make sure he understands the variables before you commit energy to rolling one up. Get his approval on the bombs targeting Touch AC, and on things like mutagenic Alchemical bonuses stacking with enhancement bonuses. In other words, RAW, the +4 dex bonus from mutagen will stack with a cat's grace, giving you a grand total of +8. This is important because DEX is the key ability for Alchemists, second only to INT.
What I'm saying is that you should show respect for your DM by clearing all this with him beforehand and not surprising him with it on day one. There's no downside; even if he's totally familiar with the whole class, he's unlikely to be annoyed by confirming these rules (which some DMs consider game breaking, and yours might be one). And if he is annoyed by so trivial a thing, find a new game. Or start one.
Take a look at the admixture evocation school in the APG. You can change energy types on the fly a few times a day. You can adapt to energy immunities and vulnerabilities, so your blast spells are more likely to work for you. Fire-immune monsters are often vulnerable to cold, so hit 'em with a cold ball for extra damage, and so on.
Damage spells are pretty specific, too, so the GM can't really nerf you too bad. Just don't destroy potential treasure!
Barbarians are the full-BAB caster, and Spell Sunder is amazing, but it sounds like you want an actual casty-type casty.
I recommend a witch, if only because Hexes are an amazing and beautiful thing. Evil Eye+Cackle is insane, you're an INT-based progression, and your spell list still includes useful things like CLW and Summon Monster (and haste if you get the agility patron)!
We already have: (Arrows indicate that a character switch will occur.)
Sorcerer
Cleric ---> Oricle
Magus
Witch
Fighter
Summoner ---> ???? (Me)
Looks like some ranged support is in order. If the other casters largely have utility casting covered, you could always play an "arcane archer" style character. You'd be a spellcaster, but spend combat unleashing a bunch of damage. An Inquisitor does this well, and bards can even do it decently, too. At level 7, you'd be right about to really come into your own for that style build (Fighter 1/Transmuter 5/EK 1 -->10) as every level from there on out really gets full BAB and casting...the worst parts of the build are pretty much over.
I don't see any reason to roll up a caster in this guy's game. He's obviously one of those "house rule... EVERYTHING" guys who will slap any class that looks at him funny with a nerf so hard their heads come off.
Meh, house rules are house rules. The examples listed don't seem too unreasonable (except the Augment Summoning thing). I actually have more of a problem with "off limits classes". I'm not clear if this is GM Fiat or OP just not wanting to overlap, though.
If the former, why the heck not? Why curtail the fun by telling people what they can and can't play? If there's three sorcerers in a party already, I can see suggesting that you avoid that class, I can see giving warnings about neglecting certain roles, but outright banning? Let 'em play what they will, and let 'em reap the consequences if they omit too many party roles. Is what I say, anyway.
the group already has a front line tank, and a ranger.
We already have:
Sorcerer
Cleric ---> Oracle
Magus
Witch
Fighter
Summoner ---> ???? (Me)
I'm I reading something wrong? I don't see a ranger in the second list. How many characters are in the party? Assuming the Cleric switches to Oracle, will you have seven characters? Fighter, Ranger, Magus, Oracle, Sorcerer, Witch, "Mogart"
In any case, you're looking to add another arcane caster to a group with Magus, Sorcerer, and a Witch.
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Since you already have an Oracle, I change my vote to Inquisitor. They've got spellcasting progression as good as the Bard, both Cure and Inflict on their spell lists (and no reason I see that they can't get both) plus their Judgments and various abilities that improve their weapons, including bows, for when you run out of spells per day.
the group already has a front line tank, and a ranger.We already have:
Sorcerer
Cleric ---> Oracle
Magus
Witch
Fighter
Summoner ---> ???? (Me)I'm I reading something wrong? I don't see a ranger in the second list. How many characters are in the party? Assuming the Cleric switches to Oracle, will you have seven characters? Fighter, Ranger, Magus, Oracle, Sorcerer, Witch, "Mogart"
In any case, you're looking to add another arcane caster to a group with Magus, Sorcerer, and a Witch.
The group does have a Ranger, but she hasn't played in 9 sessions so I assume she is gone.
Your party: Fighter, Magus, Oracle, Sorcerer, Witch
It looks to me like your party could use anything other than another arcane caster.
Looks like they have room for at least one barbarian riding a synthesist summoner cohort. Maybe two.
That is a horrible idea. A horrible idea.
Your party: Fighter, Magus, Oracle, Sorcerer, Witch
It looks to me like your party could use anything other than another arcane caster.
Looks like they could use a skill monkey.