|
This has come up in the fact the parties out of water, cant get to any water, and no one can cast create water. They would like to cast a spell and melt the ice for water.
Depends.
Spells that have an Instantaneous duration actually leave things behind for a long time.
Spells like Ice Storm specify that the ice disappears.
The survival skill lets someone find food and water out in the wild and it can be done untrained. Each character can make his own roll. It is only a DC 10.
I'm assuming that it means that they might find a stream or brook somewhere where they could replenish. What happens if there are no such things in the area, say a desert?
GM fiat as to whether to allow the survival check or not. But if you are looking for water in the desert, you could always say that they dug a shallow well to get at the water beneath the sands.
What happens if there are no such things in the area, say a desert?
Then a successful roll makes them realise they can harvest dew from rocks in the morning.
There's always water somewhere.
But u forget you need a full gallon of water a day to survive. So we come back to the first question. Does the ice stay ,say if they continually cast
ray of frost in a single spot.
It is the GM's decision as to the specifics for different spells, but I would rule that a ray of frost produces an inconsequential amount of ice and cannot be used as a water supply.
Ray of frost produces cold not ice.
However here is my suggestion:
Fabricate spell -- ice sculpture using the water vapor in the air as the 'raw material' (which you have at hand of course since there is air where you are). The ice sculpture is 'permanent' in that it doesn't go away so you have actual ice which you can break and put into your waterskins and eat.
Better though would be to put said ice sculpture into a bag of holding where it will remain ice.
|
It is the GM's decision as to the specifics for different spells, but I would rule that a ray of frost produces an inconsequential amount of ice and cannot be used as a water supply.
Not only inconsequential but also as the spell duration is instantaneous, so does the ice it makes disappear at the end of the spell?
Ray of frost produces cold not ice.
snipped
Not to be picky, but ray of frost does indeed create ice.
Quote: A ray of freezing air and ice projects from your pointing fingerEven if they cast it 30 times in a row which means over 3 minutes and its a lvl 0 spell so they can cast it as much as they want. or even over an hour so 600 times small amounts will add up.
As I said, it is up to the GM, there are no rules for ice spells into potable water. If he feels it can be used in such a way, it can be. If not, tough noodles, it can't. Were it my campaign, ray of frost could not create drinkable water.
Not only inconsequential but also as the spell duration is instantaneous, so does the ice it makes disappear at the end of the spell?
Instantaneous means that the entire spell's effect are played out immediately and have no duration associated with them. For certain spells there may be rules dealing with their aftermath, but in general it just means the spell takes place, and the effects are permanent (in most cases, this refers to damage).
Ray of Frost
A ray of freezing air ICE projects from pointing finger.
description from core book.
Yeah beyond too small to matter. Besides it's not a conjuration(creation) spell therefore it doesn't create a lasting material:
Creation: a creation spell manipulates matter to create an object or creature in the place the spellcaster designates. If the spell has a duration other than instantaneous, magic holds the creation together, and when the spell ends, the conjured creature or object vanishes without a trace. If the spell has an instantaneous duration, the created object or creature is merely assembled through magic. It lasts indefinitely and does not depend on magic for its existence.
Fabricate is going to be a better means of achieving what you want.
Other options include:
Transmute rock to mud (mud of course having a water component to it).
Stone to Flesh (again flesh has a liquid component to it).
Ray of frost produces cold not ice.
However here is my suggestion:
Fabricate spell -- ice sculpture using the water vapor in the air as the 'raw material' (which you have at hand of course since there is air where you are). The ice sculpture is 'permanent' in that it doesn't go away so you have actual ice which you can break and put into your waterskins and eat.
Better though would be to put said ice sculpture into a bag of holding where it will remain ice.
I like your idea overall but where are you getting that ice put into a bag of holding will remain ice? It should still melt--albeit more slowly than ice in the desert, certainly. As far as I'm aware, the bag of holding doesn't have a stasis effect and the temperature isn't below freezing (I believe the CRB mentions something about people suffocating in a bag of holding, but not enduring cold.)
I like your idea overall but where are you getting that ice put into a bag of holding will remain ice? It should still melt--albeit more slowly than ice in the desert, certainly. As far as I'm aware, the bag of holding doesn't have a stasis effect and the temperature isn't below freezing (I believe the CRB mentions something about people suffocating in a bag of holding, but not enduring cold.)Ray of frost produces cold not ice.
However here is my suggestion:
Fabricate spell -- ice sculpture using the water vapor in the air as the 'raw material' (which you have at hand of course since there is air where you are). The ice sculpture is 'permanent' in that it doesn't go away so you have actual ice which you can break and put into your waterskins and eat.
Better though would be to put said ice sculpture into a bag of holding where it will remain ice.
Correct -- however in the bag of holding you won't lose any water at all even if it does melt so there is that. Somehow I crossed the stasis effect from the gloves of storing into the bag of holding.
A bit of funniness with the bag of holding: You'll run out of weight you can put in it before you run out of volume if all you put in it is water.
I just got the idea to have a Simulcrum follow your party around to provide ice in an emergency. The idea of tearing off what appears to be another creature's arm to provide water for your party has never been so acceptable.
There's almost no conceivable terrain where you couldn't make a Survival check to get water. The DC would simply increase for certain places. Also, the check isn't "to get water", it's "to get enough water for one person to survive". A success doesn't mean finding a few drops, it means finding enough to keep yourself going.
The only heat that would be generated would be from the plane inside the bag of holding, the items inside the bag, or heat introduced into the bag when it is opened. It would take a pretty small amount of heat or cold to change the ambient temp inside a bag of holding as the size of the universe in the bag is quite small... but I would think if filled with ice, and not reopened, it would take a very very long time for it to melt, as it would be a mini antartica.
This interpretation, if correct, would open up entirely new uses for a * of holding. While far too expensive for common households to have on hand, richer ones could use it for refrigeration, even in the dead of summer--pile some ice and perishables in, close it up and you can rest assured it would stay cold for a few openings, at which time you put some more ice in... Hm. Perhaps in a magic-rich world, this would be one of the more "mundane" functions of magical items.
Ice boxes of the rich and famous, with robin leech. Alternatively, a portable hole filled with hot water makes a great portable pool or luxurious bath when you are just too busy to wait for your servants with buckets!
A bag of holding filled halfway with water, which is then somehow boiled once the bag is closed without doing damage to the bag ("depleted" nuclear fuel rod?) Would cause a massive increase in pressure, and would act something like an explosion when next opened.... a mean trick that would cause 3rd degree burns :P
Just put a gate ring on the bottom of an ocean and activate in the direction that you want mass violence to happen.
|
|
There's almost no conceivable terrain where you couldn't make a Survival check to get water. The DC would simply increase for certain places. Also, the check isn't "to get water", it's "to get enough water for one person to survive". A success doesn't mean finding a few drops, it means finding enough to keep yourself going.
I agree that the Survival skill does not provide exceptions. But as a DM I might rule exceptions in certain areas or at least significantly increase the DC. A few examples follow.
Plane of Fire. Plane of Earth, The Abyss, Where ever devils live, an outer plane that is a desert so dry that it essentially consists of stones and sand. Under the sea. Negative Energy plane, Positive Energy plane (ironic I know).
There's almost no conceivable terrain where you couldn't make a Survival check to get water. The DC would simply increase for certain places. Also, the check isn't "to get water", it's "to get enough water for one person to survive". A success doesn't mean finding a few drops, it means finding enough to keep yourself going.I agree that the Survival skill does not provide exceptions. But as a DM I might rule exceptions in certain areas or at least significantly increase the DC. A few examples follow.
Plane of Fire. Plane of Earth, The Abyss, Where ever devils live, an outer plane that is a desert so dry that it essentially consists of stones and sand. Under the sea. Negative Energy plane, Positive Energy plane (ironic I know).
I did say "almost". :) All of those areas are excellent examples. But earlier people were talking about what seemed to be a normal desert, where a sufficiently-skilled person can find water.