Synthesist questioning (again?)

[uriell]

Hello,

First, I want to apologize about my bad english, it is not my day to day tongue ^^

on to the questions :
I plan to play a synthesist and somethings are unclear to me, I cheked the forum and read ultimate magic faq .
http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fz

Let's say I play a 2nd level character, fighter 1/synthesist1.
Evolution with biped form taken : natural armor + member (arms)
Fused, I have a 4 armed biped with a 16 strength,
2 arms with claws, 2'normal' arms

How many attack do I get ?
I know I used the eidolon BAB + my fighter bab for a total bab of +2.

As an eidolon I can have up to 3 natural attack a round.
So can I strike with a greatsword 1 time + 2 natural attack (claw)?
1 two handed sword :
to hit = bab (+2) + strength(+3) = +5
Damage = weapon + 5(strength *1.5)
2 attacks with claws :
to hit = bab (+2) + strength (+3) + mixing natural weapon and manufactured weapon (-5) = + 0 for each claw attack
Damage 1d4 + 1(strength /2 rounded down)

As i get to fighter 1/synthesist 6, BAB total is +6, so now I can have iterative attack with my great sword, eidolon get 4 maximum natural attack. Let's not add, feat, magic, strength augmentation

1 two handed sword :
2 attacks : to hit +9 and +4 - damage unchanged.

2 attacks with claws :
to hit = bab (+6) + strength (+3) + mixing natural weapon and
manufactured weapon (-5) = +4 for each claw attack - damage unchanged.

Other questions : does Power attack apply for each attack ? manufactured and natural ?

thank for your help ^^

[uriell]

bump

[Andrew R]

You may make 2 claw attacks OR a weapon attack plus a claw as two weapon fighting. You can have up to 3 natural attacks so you could take the evolution for a bite attack or take claws agian and make 3 claw attacks

[ShadowcatX]

That is not correct Andrew.

You may take your weapon attacks, then, for every limb not holding that weapon and that has a natural weapon, you may take a natural weapon attack (at -5 because using a manufactured weapon reduces primary attacks to secondary) up to the limit of your normal attacks.

At second level you would have sword, claw, claw.

[Phasics]

I'd just like to say that while you can make iterative plus natural that doesn't mean you HAVE to.

you'll have a much better time if you design a form based on a cool RP idea and not trying to wrap RP around a mechanically nutty million attack combo.

Just sayin ;)

Peronsally i.e. this is NOT RAW: I think synthesist should be limited to attacks listed for all natural, manufactured and unarmed attacks. So at 20th level you hard capped to 7 attacks TOTAL even though you might be TWF greatswords with 7 tentacles. but that's just me ;)

[Andrew R]

ShadowcatX wrote:

That is not correct Andrew.

You may take your weapon attacks, then, for every limb not holding that weapon and that has a natural weapon, you may take a natural weapon attack (at -5 because using a manufactured weapon reduces primary attacks to secondary) up to the limit of your normal attacks.

At second level you would have sword, claw, claw.

Ok im thinking 3.5 rules, just reread it in the PRD. correct you can claw, claw sword but treated as two weapon fighting

[Jen the GM]

I don't believe that is correct either. Natural attacks get added on after everything else, as a secondary attack if you are also using a manufactured weapon.

So manufactured attack stays the same, claw (secondary), claw (secondary)

[uriell]

Thank for your help.

[Andrew R]

Jen the GM wrote:

I don't believe that is correct either. Natural attacks get added on after everything else, as a secondary attack if you are also using a manufactured weapon.

So manufactured attack stays the same, claw (secondary), claw (secondary)

Unless the prd is wrong

You can make attacks with natural weapons in combination with attacks made with a melee weapon and unarmed strikes, so long as a different limb is used for each attack. For example, you cannot make a claw attack and also use that hand to make attacks with a longsword. When you make additional attacks in this way, all of your natural attacks are treated as secondary natural attacks, using your base attack bonus minus 5 and adding only 1/2 of your Strength modifier on damage rolls. In addition, all of your attacks made with melee weapons and unarmed strikes are made as if you were two-weapon fighting. Your natural attacks are treated as light, off-hand weapons for determining the penalty to your other attacks. Feats such as Two-Weapon Fighting and Multiattack can reduce these penalties.

[DM Are]

Andrew R wrote:

Unless the prd is wrong

The part referring to TWF is wrong. Paizo Devs have stated multiple times that it was an error, and that attacks with manufactured weapons and natural weapons don't use the TWF-rules. The Bestiary rules also omit that sentence.

[Artanthos]

You can use your natural attacks, but they count as secondary. They will be at -5 to hit and receive only a 1/2 str bonus until you get multiattack. After that, the to-hit penalty is only -2.

you'll probably deal more damage adjusting your strength to 18 and using claw, claw, bite. Pick up the extra limbs when you have more evolution points.