"Dance Magic" - Since this confirms a return of the Shadowbolts, I bet we do finally see that song make it to animation.
"Movie Magic" - So, Daring Do is a movie chararcter in EqG!Equestria.
"Mirror Magic" - When we caught those glimpses of an EqG!Starlight, I never expected it to actually be Equestria!Starlight visiting. I'm actually looking forward to seeing her and Sunset interact.
I have missed every episode this season due to no fault of my own and I missed today's episode as well, which didn't even tape. I have moved to tape the episode later in the day, but I have got to catch up.
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Thoughts about today's episode (spoilered for everyone who doesn't live in Canada or shop at Wal-Mart):
Spoiler:
Okay, so there is a dedicated veterinarian in Ponyville? Given that Fluttershy was the only member of the Mane Six who didn't seem to have a job - though Twilight's living in the library didn't seem to be much of a career either - that seems to make her role in Ponyville up until now even more ambiguous (if not superfluous) than it already was. Ironically, this episode finally gives her a job (tending to her wildlife sanctuary), but man did it take a long time for the series to give her an actual occupation.
I'm a little curious why neither Dr. Fauna nor Fluttershy suggested just kicking the animals out. I mean, I know that the latter is the very definition of a soft touch, but those animals were quite clearly no longer in need of care, and were simply freeloading. Telling them to go back to the wild doesn't seem like it would be excessively harsh; we saw her do exactly this with the breezies in season four's It Aint' Easy Being Breezies, after all.
I have to give this episode credit: usually the moral of the story is obvious in the first five minutes or so, but here I was a little less certain. The obvious answer was that this was (another) story about Fluttershy needing to assert herself more, but it could also have been an issue of unrealistic expectations, particularly when consulting experts who have more technical knowledge of a subject than their client does (sort of like Rarity's frustration when Fluttershy asked for "French haute couture" for her dress in season one's Suited for Success. That fairly quickly showed itself to be the former, but it did seem ambiguous for a little while there.
Props to her for proactively stopping her friends when they started going down the same path as those experts. Which sort of leads me to this episode's major takeaway...
"We should call you 'Flutterbold' now!" That line pretty much sums this episode up. While I'm usually a bit dubious about episodes that retread the same ground that previous episodes have, this was quite clearly the culmination of Fluttershy's series-long arc towards being more self-confident and assertive. While I still expect her to be a bit hesitant in social situations, she honestly seems like she has her social anxiety/fear of conflict under control and no longer impairing her quality of life. It took quite a while to get here, but I suspect that this was the last episode we'll see about Fluttershy needing to stand up for herself (at least as the main theme).
That said, I kind of wish that previous episodes had introduced her dream of building a sanctuary, since it's something that she's had "for a long time" and yet we've never heard about it before now. I suppose we can chalk that one up to her never having been confident enough to talk about it before, but if they can telegraph Starlight having a thing for kites a full season in advance, they could have made mention of this.
Rarity, did you miss that Opal was clawing your couch? Seriously, that's not something I see you being okay with.
Hey, nice cameo by Big Daddy McColt! I love little nods to continuity like that.
And...Lola the Sloth was a shout-out to an actual sloth? Huh, okay, well, it's nice to see that the show allows for all sorts of guest appearances.
I have no idea how I've missed this thread being here. Now I'm watching, though I expect I'll be behind on the show for a while with the different premiere rates this season.
I'm oddly disappointed that cameleopards (giraffes) aren't sapient in Equestria.
The episode didn't really go the way I expected it to. It was obvious that the contractors were going to be a source of conflict, but I honestly expected that Fluttershy would learn that her plans (or rather, vague intentions) weren't very good either.
I also did find it strange that giraffes are not sapient in Equestria. But then again they don't have hooves and I think it is basically animals with hooves that are sapient.
I liked the Fluttershy episode, it was nice to see her be more confident and assertive.
It was also nice to see a good Rainbow Dash + Scootaloo episode.
I just wonder if Scootaloo has any parents and if so where are they.
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Dragon78 wrote:
Spoiler:
It was also nice to see a good Rainbow Dash + Scootaloo episode.
That episode hasn't aired outside of Canada yet; please do not discuss its plot without first using spoiler tags, for the sake of the people who don't want to know what it's about ahead of time.
You've been asked to be courteous to other posters here before, yet you continue to display willful disregard for others. Flagged for moderation.
1. It's polite messageboard etiquette to add spoiler tags if you're discussing things that haven't been fully released.
2. If an episode of something has aired *somewhere* there's a non-zero chance that reading a thread may result in spoilers from people who may or may not hold the same definition as you for what a spoiler is.
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Thoughts on yesterday's episode (spoilered for those that haven't seen it yet):
Spoiler:
So this episode is basically a rehash of season two's Sisterhooves Social with a dash of season four's Somepony to Watch Over Me? Okay, this is what I meant about being worried that the show was retreading ground that had already been covered. Previous episodes have shown us that this can be done well, either by bringing in an interesting new twist or simply executing the concept so well that it doesn't matter. This episode did neither of those things.
Okay, Rarity, it honestly looks like you're micro-managing your Canterlot store. I mean, yes, you're doing a good job of it, but for all that she seemed frantic, Sassy did have things "well in hoof." It's one thing to make new designs, but do you really need to be placing orders for new sapphires and other accessories? You said at the end of Canterlot Boutique that she'd be managing the store for you, which sort of undercuts the premise here: that you're so busy that you've let your relationships (in this case with Sweetie Belle) slip.
Am I the only one who's wondering who's taking care of Opal while Rarity is apparently running back and forth to Canterlot and Manehattan?
I really can't help but think that this episode would have been a lot more effective if Sweetie Belle - and the other CMCs, for that matter - had grown a damn inch since they were introduced. I get that there are concerns about permanently changing a character's design, and that incremental growth can be difficult to show, but it undercuts the idea that Sweetie Belle has grown up when she still looks the same, save for the tramp stamp cutie mark on her butt flank. (EDIT: So apparently she has grown over the years. My apologies, DHX. Complaint withdrawn.)
On a related note, it would have helped if the things Rarity had them doing were things we'd seen Sweetie Belle actually do before. Obviously, a lot of her old pastimes wouldn't have been things shown on-screen, but how funny would it have been if Rarity took her through old activities that she and her friends did when they were trying to earn their cutie marks? Seeing them doing glam rock together would have been hilarious, for example. That's really this episode's biggest failing - it could have been a tribute to how far Sweetie Belle (and, through her, the other CMCs) have come since they were introduced. Instead, we got a bunch of activities that we were told, not shown, that Sweetie used to love.
Not to complain completely, but I did appreciate how all of the other foals in the activities that Rarity had planned for them were all blank flanks. That was a nice way of showcasing that Sweetie Belle had outgrown what her sister thought of her.
Shout-out to them bringing back Zipporwhill from season four's Filly Vanilli, particularly since she had the same dog, now grown larger from when it was shown.
At the risk of nitpicking, why does Zipporwhill have a Latin American accent? Several of the ponies with accents have been contextualized within the setting - such as seeing other ponies with Southern American accents (showing that Applejack's family wasn't alone in that regard) and how Crusaders of the Lost Mark said that Pip Squeak was a "transplant from Trottingham" to explain his British accent - but we've had several others presented without any associated presentation of where that accent is common. Am I the only one who wants this to be resolved? (...hm, looking around, apparently I am.)
I did like that we got names for several more background ponies, even if most of them were, as far as I know, introduced in this episode.
Wait...there's an ice cream parlor in Ponyville? I guess that wouldn't compete with Sugarcube Corner, since their sweets are baked, but even so that's a lot of confectioneries in one relatively small town.
So with Episode 6 we are just shy of 1/4 of the way though the season, (for US viewers anyway). I've noticed some things that are very different with this season.
For safety's sake:
Episodes 1-6 spoilers:
So, at this point there feels like a distinct formula to the season. It seems to be a member of the core cast plus a background character, with a strong effort to pull in characters from back in seasons 1-3 to give them spotlight.
Episode 1 gives us Twilight and Celestia
Episode 2 is Starlight and Trixe (yes Starlight is core cast now,we'll have to live with it)
Episode 3 is Twilight and Flurry
Episode 4 is Pinkie/Starlight and Maud
Episode 5 is Fluttershy and the Vet (a bit of a weaker connection but it still fits)
Episode 6 is Rarity/CMC with Zipporwil
I think it's interesting they are really using the, by now massive, stable of past one shot and minor role characters. It makes for a stronger continuity and progression. Which seems to be a major theme this season, change, progression and growth. It will be interesting to see if the rest of the season pans out. Makes you wonder who else they'll throw in.
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Dragon78 wrote:
Now that I think about it, the reason we haven't seen a season 6 on DVD might be because of that Netflix deal:(
I don't know. Netflix has been adding seasons regularly for years, and it never did anything to the DVD releases before now. Has something about that changed?
Looks like Zecora finally gets to make an appearance in not just one but two episodes, almost back to back. The first of the two sounds more interesting.
The changling one feels a bit meh by the description. And I think we can now say with certantiy that Starlight and Trixie stories are the C track when it comes to episode plots. (By that I mean Mane 6 stories are A track, CMC Stories are B Track etc.)
And the Zeppelin one sounds fun, it'll be nice to see Twlight's family actually interact in some way.
But the last one feels like a retread of Feeling Pinkie Keen.
Now got caught up through "Parental Glideance." What I really need to do is catch up on the comics. Most recent I've read is the "Siege of the Crystal Empire" arc.
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Some thoughts on today's episode (spoilered for those that haven't seen it yet):
Spoiler:
Wait, how is a flock of birds supposed to get Scootaloo up to Cloudsdale? I mean, a hot air balloon is self-evident, as is a pegasus chariot, but a flock of birds? Is she supposed to lasso them or something? That was just a weird suggestion.
God damn does Madeleine Peters have a set of lungs on her, to be able to hit that high a note and sustain it for that long! I mean, yowza!
Is it me, or is it unusual for Windy Whistles's tail to be cut so short, compared to other ponies? Most that we've seen seem to let it grow longer; having it be shorter is an interesting way of making her appearance distinctive.
It's interesting when the show decides to run with what the fandom has put forth, and when it doesn't. In this case, having Rainbow's dad be "Bow Hothoof" rather than "Rainbow Blaze" is a pretty clear decision to go their own way, much like how the credits for last season's The Crystalling - Part 2 had Twilights parents be "Mr. Sparkle" and "Mrs. Sparkle," rather than the fan-names of "Night Light" and "Twilight Velvet." Maybe they're still gun-shy after the whole "Derpy" debacle?
I'm going to tentatively say that this episode confirms that Rainbow is an only child; or at least I hope so, given how much her parents have fixated on her and apparently only her. That makes her the only one of the Mane Six not to have any siblings.
Okay, this is pedantic even for me, but why don't Rainbow's parents have any clippings from Ponyville's newspaper(s) about their daughter when they're clearly such huge fans of hers? Is getting another town's paper that difficult? I mean, just have it mailed to you.
Ha! I saw Sky Stinger and Vapor Trail - from last season's Top Bolt - in that one shot! Nice little shout-out there!
Oh for cryin' out loud...the episode is framing Rainbow as being the only one at fault! That's clearly not the case! What this episode needed to point out was that Rainbow's parents were wrong too. Making such a spectacle of themselves is at least somewhat selfish, since it makes them the center of attention rather than the pony they're ostensibly rooting for. If everypony is looking at them, they're not looking at Rainbow. Too much of anything, taken to an extreme, is bad.
I also frowned at the idea of being super-excited over anything and everything your child does being a good thing. I'm of the opinion that being so enthusiastic over something like a participation trophy devalues things that are actual accomplishments, which has a negative effect on a child's motivation. Why aim for first place if your parents are just as excited when you get a participation ribbon? How does anything feel like a victory when everything you do is treated like one? That seems more likely to produce somepony that's full of themselves for no good reason, as opposed to Rainbow Dash, who's full of herself for very good reasons.
Wait, is Scootaloo finally going to tell us about her home life?! Are we FINALLY going to get to know if she's an orphan or just lives alone or whatever her situation is?! ARE WE?!...AW COME ON!
Oh yeah, that's another reason why so much exuberance is a bad thing; it tends to disrupt whatever else is going on around you, like teaching a class.
If I recall correctly, they'd let that slip before, but it's nice to have further confirmation.
The real test is if there's going to be a season 9 or not. If Hasbro is going to nix the series, I suspect that after the end of season 8 would be when they'd do it.
On an interesting note, particularly for people who are avoiding imported Canadian spoilers. Tree house has apparently run out of new episodes on their accelerated schedule and will be playing the season over again.
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atheral wrote:
On an interesting note, particularly for people who are avoiding imported Canadian spoilers. Tree house has apparently run out of new episodes on their accelerated schedule and will be playing the season over again.
Interesting. I wonder if they hit the mid-season break? Either way, I'm glad for this; the mismatched schedule between the Canadian and American broadcasts wasn't something I cared for.
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Some thoughts on yesterday's episode (spoilered for those who haven't seen it yet):
Spoiler:
I was slightly struck by how child-like the CMC were when coming up with their "disguises." Obviously, they are children - there's no way they're older than twelve, and quite possibly (a lot) less than that - but given that they've matured so much since they got their cutie marks (and that we just had an episode of Sweetie Belle emphasizing that she's not the little filly she used to be), seeing them act like little kids was a bit jarring.
Oh for crying out loud, just give that place a name! Calling it "Starlight's old village" just sounds awkward! Starlight can call it something like that, the same way people will talk about "my old home" or something to that effect, but having other people refer to it by the fact that Starlight used to live there just sounds weird. Give it a name already!
I sense a great disturbance in the fandom...as though millions of shippers cried out, and then were silenced. Seriously though, actually giving Big Mac a girlfriend is fairly major, particularly since it wasn't any of the mares that he's been hinted at liking before. After all, while things between him and Cheerilee were the result of a "love poison" in season two's Hearts and Hooves Day (although she gave him that rather saucy faint-and-wink bit in season four's Filli Vanilli), he seemed to get along a little too well with Marble Pie in season five's Hearthbreakers. So the fact that they're matching him up with another mare altogether is not insignificant. (I wonder if they didn't him up with Marble because they didn't like the idea that the two of them might be cousins, as posited in season four's Pinkie Apple Pie.)
For those who don't recall, Sugar Belle was one of the ponies who was unhappy with Starlight's rule in the season five premiere. So it's not like she just came out of nowhere.
Also, fun fact, her (extremely coquettish) voice is done by Rebecca Shoichet, the voice of Sunset Shimmer and singing voice of Twilight. I'm quite impressed by her range; this is why voice actors are professionals, and not just anybody off the street could do what they do.
Okay, the CMC's intuition that Sugar Belle likes Big Mac seems flawed (even if it did turn out to be right in the end). They posited that her wanting to order so many apples was a ploy to see him, and that her interactions with him were more than just friendly. But then they also decided that she was being a little too friendly with Feather Bangs (whom I'm tempted to rename "Shallow McHipster"). But none of these seemed in any way to indicate interest on her part; she honestly seemed like she was just being friendly, rather than flirting.
That sort of leads me to my big complaint about this episode: why didn't the CMC (since they were the architects of the hijinks, here) just talk to Sugar Belle? Why was everything framed in terms of Big Mac being the one to woo her? If they'd just asked her if she liked Big Mac, and if she said yes told her to tell him that - either directly or indirectly - this could have been a lot simpler (though I'll concede that would have made for a less amusing episode).
I'm something of a Big Mac fan, so hearing him step outside of his usual limited dialogue is quite a treat! Certainly it's better than how much of a jackass he made of himself in season five's Brotherhooves Social, which was the last time we got an episode that was truly centered around him.
I admit it, I giggled during the bit where Scootaloo needles Sweetie Belle about when she read the fairy tales.
That said, why does Equestria have such traditionalist fairy tales? The sociological underpinnings of their society seem different enough from our own that I question if they'd have "knights in shining armor" (and how could they not have a Shining Armor and Princess Cadance joke in there?) saving "damsel-ponies-in-distress" and, as Sweetie Belle put it, "always gets the girl." This just seems like an odd fit for Equestria, a land ruled by unaging female alicorns. Then again, the royal guard do all seem to be stallions, so maybe I'm reading too much into it (I do tend to do that, you might have noticed).
Nice call-back to the last time the CMC tried to get involved with Big Mac's love life!
"Hey! That's our metaphorical sunset they're riding off into!" Best Sweetie Belle line since sine her "Aw come on!" moment in Hearts and Hooves Day!
Urgh, Big Mac, did you forget that you're a member of the Pony Tones? You're not the crooner you're being presented as in this musical sequence.
Props to the dry bit of observational humor when Sugar Belle pointed out that their town consisted of a single street.
The resolution was cute, with Big Mac's making her a larger display being a very heartfelt gesture. I also liked that Sugar Belle explicitly said "I like you, too." And...er...why are you two just touching noses? Just kiss. That can't be an issue with the TV-Y rating can it? C'mon! Stop touching noses and kiss already! Oh for crying out loud!
So Shallow McHipster is all flash to cover up his insecurities? Well, at least that's better than him being self-absorbed the way Prince Blueblood was. But...wait...did the CMCs just tell him to try dating three mares at the same time? Because it sort of looks like they were telling him to go after all three of his admirers at the same time. To which all I can say is...damn.
Wait, he was voiced by Vincent Tong? That's the guy who also voiced Prince Blueblood, Garble, and Flash Sentry. Is there some sort of meta-joke going on that this guy voices everyone that the fandom hates?
Yeah, what with his cutie mark and the fact that he's constantly getting between Big Mac and Sugar Belle, it seems like a meta-joke about Flash Sentry "waifu stealer."
I just kind of feel sorry for Flash these days. He's had it dropped on him he's not getting the girl he liked. Plus, the alternate Twilight went for someone else. And I do appreciate that he acknowledged they were different people (and thus cutting off the cliche of chasing the lookalike). He also got shot down by Sunset. (He clearly was trying to ask her out in LoE.) Good grief, I'd like to see him find somebody at this point.
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Some thoughts on today's episode (spoilered for those who haven't seen it yet):
Spoiler:
Okay, I'm pretty confident that this wasn't what was intended, but that opening joke sounded an awful lot like Spike was spying on Rarity when she "just happened" to see him. Was he looking in the windows at her when she thought she was alone or something?
Come to think of it, given how the show has seen fit to start resolving long-running plot-threads - such as with Fluttershy standing up for herself or Rainbow Dash becoming a Wonderbolt - I'd be happy if the show finally dealt with Spike's crush on Rarity in some kind of decisive manner. The closest thing we've ever gotten is Rarity's pointedly stopping him when he tries to confess to her in Secret of My Excess, back in season two. Maybe it's time to revisit this and deal with it once and for all?
Bit of a gauche move announcing that Applejack is going to be a judge in your show before you actually asked her, Rarity. I know that I tend to get ticked when people volunteer me for things. (Though to be fair, she did ask her right after that...apparently because AJ overheard her.)
Okay, okay, I loved the joke about AJ's closet being nothing but twenty stetsons. We already knew this from season five's Made in Manehattan, but a lot of fans seem to think of it as a memento from her dead parents, when it fact it's just a type of hat that she likes.
Also, a big hats off (pun intended) to how the episode had Applejack deciding to participate. While the idea of Apple Bloom wearing such an impractical hat might have seemed contrived, her justifying it as "I wanted to try out having a signature hat too!" was both adorable and amusing. (And we know that she has chores around the farm, and idolizes Applejack, so it made sense in that context.)
Hoity Toity and Photo Finish in the same place at the same time? I'm not sure how much pretentiousness I can handle!
Okay, I know that there was a brief legal clash over this, and I know that the show changed her name to keep it from escalating, but it still makes me frown to hear them calling Coco "Miss Pommel." That's just...wrong, somehow.
...but not nearly as wrong as her designing such a hideous outfit. A disco ball? Really? From such a gifted young designer? I say unto thee, "Boo!"
When I realized what the moral of this episode was, I have to admit, I was impressed - enough so that it changed my opinion of it from "okay" to "brilliant." That's because I think it's hard to have Applejack have episodes where she learns a life lesson; she's usually the voice of down-to-earth wisdom. While early episodes, such as season one's Applebuck Season or Look Before You Sleep, had her being too proud/stubborn for her own good, there wasn't much growing left for her to do after that. Season four's Leap of Faith did a good job, whereas Somepony to Watch Over Me (from the same season) was rather poor in that it had to invent a personality flaw for her (i.e. that she was smothering Apple Bloom, something never seen before then) to fix.
In this case, the episode smartly invented a dilemma by taking one of Applejack's strengths - her honesty - and turning it into a problem, and it did so very adroitly. Applejack isn't usually callous, but at the same time we know that she had little patience for impractical things, which is how she sees Rarity's chosen profession. So it's entirely plausible that her being a judge of a fashion competition (especially when she's supposed to be judging practicality) would result in her honesty becoming blunt to the point of meanness. As such, this episode very deftly drove home an important lesson: honesty does not ameliorate being hurtful or rude, since what you think is a separate consideration from how you say it.
That bit with Rarity doing an enraged guitar riff was just...weird. At least when Twilight burst into flames due to peak frustration (in season one's Feeling Pinkie Keen), it was the culmination of a buildup throughout that entire episode. This was just sorta there. I mean, we've had sight-gags with Rarity before (such as her imitating Pinkie by turning into a ball and bouncing around the screen in season six's Gift of the Maud Pie), but this one really fell flat for me.
Does anyone else remember the "valley girl" pony and her "goth pony" friend from season five's Canterlot Boutique? They were some of the background ponies talking about Rarity's dresses in a few scenes? Lily Lace and Inky Rose aren't them, but they really seem similar. Like, a LOT.
Heh, nice pointing out that Lily is misusing "literally." Double points for that The Princess Bride reference!
Oh damn Strawberry Sunrise dissed AJ hard! So there's at least one pony out there who didn't learn this week's friendship lesson, amusingly enough. I'm calling it now: catfight between them in a later episode!
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Some thoughts on last Saturday's episode (spoilered for those who haven't seen it yet):
Spoiler:
So now we have confirmation that the Cutie Map can invoke ponies who aren't the Mane Six. While I suppose you could presume that this is due to Starlight tampering with it in season five's The Cutie Re-Mark, or helping to repair it in season six's Spice Up Your Life, I suspect that it's just that the map can indicate anyone it wants/needs to.
Also, very nice confirmation of what the fandom had long suspected to be true: that Celestia and Luna alternated their schedules with a meeting over breakfast/dinner when the day began.
Okay, super-nitpicking time, but maybe pancakes aren't the best idea for Luna, Celestia? I mean, some people like to have breakfast at the end of their day, I'll grant you, but maybe Luna wants to have dinner before she goes to bed? The faces on the pancakes are nice and all, but if she wants a salad that's not exactly going to be ideal.
Oh for the love of...okay, look, I get it. This episode wants to showcase that Luna and Celestia have very different duties, which is leading to a breakdown of empathy between them due to a lack of understanding. That's fine. But why oh why is Luna going around and replacing the plants on the wall-sconces every single night by herself? We know there are guards who have night duty (see season five's Rarity Investigates! and this season's A Flurry of Emotions), so just have them do it. Changing the plants is exactly the sort of thing that should be delegated.
Um, Twilight? Maybe you didn't know this because you were kind of busy during season five's Slice of Life, but the royal sisters have fought before without it turning apocalyptic. I mean, if they can get over forgetting Cranky and Matilda's wedding gift, then do we have to presume that this will be the end of the world?
Okay, I really appreciate the characterization of Starlight, here! Reacting to pressure with an aggressive pushback is exactly the sort of thing we've seen her do before, from when she lost control of her village in season five's The Cutie Map to doing her friendship homework in season six's Every Little Thing She Does. Responding to anxiety by attacking her problems is exactly who Starlight is, and it's nice to see her character being kept consistent.
Also, kudos to this episode for showing that Starlight still has the magic to play around with cutie marks. That hasn't been shown since her debut in the season five premiere, so it was a great way to use magic that she's already been shown to have (particularly since, notwithstanding Twilight's miscast spell in season three's Magical Mystery Cure, there's no other pony that's apparently able to do that).
And we get to see the Royal Canterlot Voice again too! Man, this episode is killing it with the shout-outs!
Wait, so Celestia's usual duties are pretty much all (rather minor) head-of-state activities? This isn't helping to dispel the popular fan-perception of how little actual governing goes on at the national level in Equestria. I mean, yeah, quashing rumors of timberwolves in White Tail Woods is important, but that doesn't seem like it requires more than a statement (albeit one more diplomatic than Luna's). And what exactly WAS the issue between the two mayors that required three hours to resolve? We know that Equestria has at least some sort of foreign policy (e.g. the confidential talks between the princesses and the duke and duchess of Maretonia in season four's Twilight's Kingdom - Part 1), but none of this seems like it's at that level.
Celestia's characterizing raising the moon as "even easier than raising the sun" sounded rather catty to me, so I wonder how much it should be taken literally. This is definitely going to kick off a new round of debates about Equestria's cosmology, I can tell.
Hang on...why would Celestia comment on how easy or hard it is to raise the moon in the first place? That's the sort of statement you'd make when you didn't already know what the task would require of you, and Celestia should know that. The series premiere explicitly stated that Celestia moved both the sun and the moon for a thousand years after Nightmare Moon was banished. She should be an old hand (old hoof?) at this. Come to think of it, this entire episode seems to have forgotten that Celestia used to do that.
Okay, props to this episode for keeping consistent with regards to dream-magic. We have Celestia using it while awake, which keeps to what we saw in season five's Do Princesses Dream of Magic Sheep?. Moreover, Luna's being unable to help reaffirms why Luna didn't seek Celestia's help in that same episode. Good stuff there.
However, I feel compelled to point out that Equestria got along for a thousand years without anyone guarding everyone's dreams, so it's not like this is really that big of a deal. Between this and how Celestia's duties are little more than low-level celebrity functions, there's an ironic message in here about just how superfluous the royal sisters really are.
Did...did Celestia just glimpse a dream from Discord? I didn't know that he actually slept! He's pretty much immortal, and very nearly omnipotent, so I just sort of assumed he didn't need to sleep.
And there she is! Ever since the show premiered, fans have been wondering what a corrupted version of Celestia would be like (often with the fan-name "Nightmare Sun"). And now we know: Daybreaker! Sure, that's just Starlight's nightmare of what a corrupted Celestia would look like, but even so I see this being a fan-favorite character for a very long time to come.
You know, Twilight, I'm glad that Starlight told you midway through the episode just how unhelpful you were being, because you really were. I appreciate that you're still moving gradually with learning to relate to Celestia as a peer and all, but this episode showcased just how far you have to go to take her off that pedestal of yours.
Hang on...why would Celestia comment on how easy or hard it is to raise the moon in the first place? That's the sort of statement you'd make when you didn't already know what the task would require of you, and Celestia should know that. The series premiere explicitly stated that Celestia moved both the sun and the moon for a thousand years after Nightmare Moon was banished. She should be an old hand (old hoof?) at this. Come to think of it, this entire episode seems to have forgotten that Celestia used to do that.
Yep, that took me by surprise. I think if we need to we can dismiss specific details from the series premiere as "Early Installment Weirdness". For example, Twilight was going to get Zecora's help before they'd actually met the pony; this could be the same. So maybe we're supposed to take it as Celestia having never been the one to move the moon during the Thousand Years' Banishment (the Two Sisters' Journal suggests it was done by Unicorn teams before the Alicorns came to power, so they could've been moving the moon while Celestia moved the sun).
As for the dream guardianship thing, I guess everypony had to just deal with the occasional nightmare from time to time while Luna was away. Which, come to think of it, makes a kind of sense and adds to the fear Equestria came to have of Nightmare Moon. Before she was banished, nopony had nightmares (at least, none that weren't soon thereafter resolved). Then she's banished, and nightmares across Equestria spike to alarming levels. It's their own unrealized fears and anxieties manifesting in dream form, but the nightmares were probably mistakenly attributed to Nightmare Moon's cruel influence. And after a thousand years of her seemingly reaching out from beyond her imprisonment and spreading nightmares, her memory remains as dreadful as it was when she'd first rebelled.
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Reply spoilered just to be on the safe side:
Spoiler:
Tectorman wrote:
Yep, that took me by surprise. I think if we need to we can dismiss specific details from the series premiere as "Early Installment Weirdness". For example, Twilight was going to get Zecora's help before they'd actually met the pony; this could be the same.
Er, when did that ever happen? Zecora debuted in the ninth episode of the first season, Bridle Gossip, and I can't find any instance of Twilight mentioning Zecora prior to that.
Given that Celestia raising and lowering the moon while Luna was out of commission makes more sense - since someone needed to do it while she was sealed away - I think it makes more sense to say that this episode overlooked that then the premiere was wrong.
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So maybe we're supposed to take it as Celestia having never been the one to move the moon during the Thousand Years' Banishment (the Two Sisters' Journal suggests it was done by Unicorn teams before the Alicorns came to power, so they could've been moving the moon while Celestia moved the sun).
I emphatically disagree. "The Journal of the Two Sisters" is, to my mind, a terrible product, and was even before it was explicitly contradicted in the sixth season premiere (when Celestia and Luna stated that Flurry Heart's having been born an alicorn was something that had never happened before, and was beyond their understanding; this flat-out contradicts the Journal stating that Celestia and Luna were both born as alicorns). In this case, having unicorns moving the moon would, according to the Journal, mean that there were unicorns permanently losing their magic, and there's no evidence of any such thing happening.
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As for the dream guardianship thing, I guess everypony had to just deal with the occasional nightmare from time to time while Luna was away. Which, come to think of it, makes a kind of sense and adds to the fear Equestria came to have of Nightmare Moon. Before she was banished, nopony had nightmares (at least, none that weren't soon thereafter resolved). Then she's banished, and nightmares across Equestria spike to alarming levels. It's their own unrealized fears and anxieties manifesting in dream form, but the nightmares were probably mistakenly attributed to Nightmare Moon's cruel influence. And after a thousand years of her seemingly reaching out from beyond her imprisonment and spreading nightmares, her memory remains as dreadful as it was when she'd first rebelled.
I agree that nightmares were just something that everyone had to deal with while Luna was gone, but the rest is speculation (albeit interesting). Given that everyone had a thousand years to get used to bad dreams just being normal, I doubt that they necessarily blamed them on Nightmare Moon, since what we see of Nightmare Night doesn't attribute that to her at all. Instead, they're worried about giving her candy so she won't "gobble them up." That seems more like she's become a generic "bogeyman"-style figure, rather than having any specific ills being attributed to her.
Er, when did that ever happen? Zecora debuted in the ninth episode of the first season, Bridle Gossip, and I can't find any instance of Twilight mentioning Zecora prior to that.
Given that Celestia raising and lowering the moon while Luna was out of commission makes more sense - since someone needed to do it while she was sealed away - I think it makes more sense to say that this episode overlooked that then the premiere was wrong.
Alzrius wrote:
I emphatically disagree. "The Journal of the Two Sisters" is, to my mind, a terrible product, and was even before it was explicitly contradicted in the sixth season premiere (when Celestia and Luna stated that Flurry Heart's having been born an alicorn was something that had never happened before, and was beyond their understanding; this flat-out contradicts the Journal stating that Celestia and Luna were both born as alicorns). In this case, having unicorns moving the moon would, according to the Journal, mean that there were unicorns permanently losing their magic, and there's no evidence of any such thing happening.
My mistake. It wasn't the series premiere, it was Stare Master. I knew Zecora had been name-dropped before she'd actually been introduced; I'd just thought it was the premiere. I still maintain that Early Installment Weirdness is a thing and that details from the beginning of the series can be disregarded, if need be.
Using the J2S idea of Unicorn teams helps with more than just this episode. One thing I remember bothering me about the season 6 finale is the question of who was controlling the sun and moon during the Changeling Invasion. Were Changeling-Celestia and Changeling-Luna powerful enough to take on those duties to maintain the facade? Was it Chrysalis? The idea that the princesses sometimes need to leave that part of their duties to a reserve team of Unicorns (due to being ill or kidnapped or similarly indisposed) and that the Changeling imposters who had taken the princesses' place just took advantage of that system seems more palatable, IMO.
I also don't recall the J2S implying the Unicorns lost any magic, just that Celestia and Luna discovered they could do those jobs more easily and so took over doing them.
Alzrius wrote:
I agree that nightmares were just something that everyone had to deal with while Luna was gone, but the rest is speculation (albeit interesting). Given that everyone had a thousand years to get used to bad dreams just being normal, I doubt that they necessarily blamed them on Nightmare Moon, since what we see of Nightmare Night doesn't attribute that to her at all. Instead, they're worried about giving her candy so she won't "gobble them up." That seems more like she's become a generic "bogeyman"-style figure, rather than having any specific ills being attributed to her.
I was speaking more in broad strokes, that the misattribution of nightmares to her led to her remaining a boogeyman of legend for a thousand years, even though she was most recently "that which gobbled fillies up" rather than "that which causes nightmares". I mean, much of the lore of hundreds of years ago surrounding Santa Claus is out of the public memory, but it did serve to keep the character around to today. Same thing with Nightmare Moon.
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Spoilered just to be safe.
Spoiler:
Tectorman wrote:
My mistake. It wasn't the series premiere, it was Stare Master. I knew Zecora had been name-dropped before she'd actually been introduced; I'd just thought it was the premiere.
I'm still confused; Zecora was introduced in Bridle Gossip, which was the ninth episode of the first season, whereas Stare Master was the seventeenth episode of the first season. Insofar as I'm aware, there's no instance of her being mentioned before she was introduced.
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I still maintain that Early Installment Weirdness is a thing and that details from the beginning of the series can be disregarded, if need be.
We'll need to agree to disagree, here. I'll certainly admit that initial episodes of a new show can still be uncertain with regards to what will eventually become their canon, but I'd stop short of saying that this means that details from early episodes can be blanket-disregarded so as to resolve perceived disparities. I think that there needs to be more critical examination than that.
Quote:
Using the J2S idea of Unicorn teams helps with more than just this episode. One thing I remember bothering me about the season 6 finale is the question of who was controlling the sun and moon during the Changeling Invasion. Were Changeling-Celestia and Changeling-Luna powerful enough to take on those duties to maintain the facade? Was it Chrysalis? The idea that the princesses sometimes need to leave that part of their duties to a reserve team of Unicorns (due to being ill or kidnapped or similarly indisposed) and that the Changeling imposters who had taken the princesses' place just took advantage of that system seems more palatable, IMO.
The issue of who was moving the sun and the moon after the changelings had successfully captured the alicorns is a good question, but it remains something of an open question, to my mind. For instance, notice that Princess Luna was able to continue using at least some of her magic after she was captured (i.e. she was able to contact Starlight in her dream), so there's cause to say that she and Celestia were possibly still moving the sun and moon (possibly under threat from Chrysalis?). Moreover, the changelings were able to somehow break into Luna's dream, despite there being no suggestion previously that they had any ability to do so. That could be interpreted any number of ways, particularly in conjunction with seeing Chrysalis overpower Princess Celestia herself in A Canterlot Wedding - Part 2 when she's drained sufficient love.
In short, the episode does present a quandary, but it also leaves open the possibilities of plausible answers without needing to go further afield.
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I also don't recall the J2S implying the Unicorns lost any magic, just that Celestia and Luna discovered they could do those jobs more easily and so took over doing them.
Unless I'm quite mistaken, I recall that the book laid out that the unicorns moving the sun and the moon were permanently burning themselves out as a result of doing so, leaving them unable to use magic. (I'll also refer you to all of the other problems mentioned in the article I linked to in my previous post, and its comments.)
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I was speaking more in broad strokes, that the misattribution of nightmares to her led to her remaining a boogeyman of legend for a thousand years, even though she was most recently "that which gobbled fillies up" rather than "that which causes nightmares". I mean, much of the lore of hundreds of years ago surrounding Santa Claus is out of the public memory, but it did serve to keep the character around to today. Same thing with Nightmare Moon.
Again, we'll need to agree to disagree here. My general rule is to not assume more than is shown, and if that's insufficient to explain what we see then to try and be as conservative as possible when it comes to filling in the blanks. In that regard, I don't see much need to create lore regarding why ponies fear Nightmare Moon beyond what we're shown. Just because something could be like how something else works isn't affirmative enough to suggest that it actually is.
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Some thoughts on yesterday's episode (spoilered just to be safe):
Spoiler:
Wait, so Pinkie Pie can get to Yakyakistan just by taking a hot air balloon? What happened to the whole "uncontrollable weather" bit from season six's The Crystalling? I mean, true, Pinkie didn't seem to have much of an issue with the weather when she went there in season five's Party Pooped, but this episode seems to be taking the trip slightly more seriously.
So the yak festival is just them stomping on stuff? This seems like an intriguing reference to the traditional stomping grounds of the buffalo from season one's Over a Barrel. Is there a connection between the yaks and the buffalo, despite the former living in the frozen north and the latter living in the southern deserts? I doubt the show will ever answer that, but it's fun to consider.
You know, when we saw the gates of Yakyakistan in Party Pooped, it really had a whole "forbidden city" thing going for it, or at least I thought so. But now...it's just a tiny village - nowhere near as big as Ponyville, from the look of it - consisting of some yurts with a wall around it. The place isn't so much a city-state as it is a hamlet-state. This really make the yaks seem even more provincial, and their civilization even more unimportant on the world stage, than I thought it was. Heck, all of their buildings seem to be communal, rather than individual!
So I'll go ahead and ask, how is it that this particular festival never caused an avalanche before now? Because it seems like this would have happened before, what with their location and the stomping and all.
Hey Rutherford, it's nice that you actually have a sense of humor and camaraderie and all, but I can't help but ask what happened to that whole "yaks demand everything be perfect" bit of yours from Party Pooped? Because things are FAR from perfect in Yakyakistan right now.
Okay, that scene with the two young yaks complaining was adorable, mostly because their quiet conversation highlighted how they kept dropping their articles and referring to themselves as "yak." So cute!
That said, I found it a tad bit odd that they apparently had Kelly Sheridan (the voice of Starlight Glimmer and Sassy Saddles) voicing one of the young yaks, and nobody else in this episode. Given how many talented voice actresses they put to use, couldn't one of them simply added the two or so lines that that young yak spoke? It seems rather odd to call in someone else for such a small thing.
Okay, no. Just no. Pinkie Pie, YOU of all ponies do not get to question someone else's logic. Sure, Rutherford's story was unbelievable to even casual scrutiny, but you are the last pony who gets to say that someone else's exploits don't hold up to rational inquiry!
So a half-dozen ponies are able to do in a single night what all of the yaks couldn't do at all (or at least after a few days of trying)? Yeah, this is really highlighting why ponies in general and Equestria in particular are apparently the world's foremost power. I mean, harmony is nice and all, but it's pretty clear that while the ponies wouldn't hold themselves above anyone else, they're first among "equals."
Hrm, that scene with Twilight making plants grow was kinda awkward, since that's sort of Applejack's thing.
I'm having a bit of a hard time figuring out the moral of the story here. I think it's supposed to be about cultural sensitivity insofar as knowing not to push them to do something they don't want to do, but being too proud to ask for help when they need it isn't exactly the best of values. If Pinkie hadn't been there, the yaks would have just suffered in silence, with no help incoming due to their isolationist nature. For that matter, helping someone who hasn't asked for help is an easy way to justify being intrusive; to be fair, in this case it was made plainly obvious that help was required, but that won't always be the case. So I'm seeing this as sort of a mixed message.
And we are now at the halfway point of the season with the Hiatus starting as of now. (Unless you count the next three Saturdays with the EQG specials as part of this season).
So Far I'm enjoying this season, lot of new stuff shown and a lot of callbacks which is a good thing in my mind.
And my earlier theory about cast selection this season seems to still be supported. With it being one or two members of the core cast paired with a recurring or major background character.
Spoilers for EP 7-11:
Episode 7 is Rainbow Dash/Scootaloo with Rainbow's Parents
Episode 8 is CMC with Big Mac and Sugar Belle
Episode 9 has Rarity and AJ with Photo Finish and Hoity Toity
Episode 10 is Starlight/Twilight and the Royal Sisters
Episode 11 is Pinkie and Prince Rutherford.
This trend may be holding true in the second half, though there are a few that don't neatly line up. Five of of the next don't fall in line neatly as of right now.
Spoiler for synopsis of future episodes:
12- Fluttershy and Discord
13- Apple Siblings and their Parents *Doesn't Match*
14- Mane Six *Dosen't Match*
15- Spike, Ember and Thorax
16- CMC and their "Sisters" *Doesn't Match*
17- Rainbow and Daring Do
18- Fluttershy and Zecora
19- Starlight, Trixie and Thorax
20- Rarity and Zecora
21- Twilight and Family
22- CMC and ??? *Doesn't Match*
23- Pinkie and Rainbow *Doesn't Match*
24,25,and 26 are unknown though 25 and 26 are probably a two-part finale
Be interesting to see if it holds true, I like having the expanded cast, as it allows for a wider breadth of story potential.
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Some thoughts on the first Equestria Girls special episode (spoilered just to be safe):
Spoiler:
Was Camp Everfree so damaged that they need to raise funds to repair it? I mean, other than that dock, the place seemed fine. Even Gloriosa's magical rampage at the end didn't really seem to destroy anything. I'd ask why the girls here are the ones raising the funds - they've already done more than enough for that place - but I'm presuming that they took it upon themselves.
Why is there a deadline on the Camp's fundraising? This doesn't seem like some sort of formal event that's being undertaken on any sort of widespread basis (since Sci-Twi seems to indicate that they'e the only ones raising money). Can't they just raise enough money on whatever timetable is convenient for them until they hit their target?
So this contest wants you to to write and perform original music, along with choreographing and editing a video for it? Given that we know this world has Youtube (from the original Equestria Girls movie), the quick cash is the only reason to enter this contest. If you can do all of that, just start uploading your stuff and you should be able to sign a deal with some company pretty quick.
Oh hey look, it's the those girls from the Friendship Games movie who didn't really do anything. Sugarcoat, Lemon Zest, Sunny Flare, Sour Sweet, and...wait, where's Indigo Zap? No, seriously, where is she? She's "on vacation somewhere"? Okay, but...why write her out in the first place? Her voice actress is Kelly "Starlight Glimmer" Sheridan, for cryin' out loud!
So Cadance became the Principal of Crystal Prep? No wonder she felt so comfortable mouthing off to her boss at the end of Friendship Games! Of course, given that this universe has analogues of everyone in Equestria, that should mean that she's taking up quite a bit of maternity leave to take care of her new baby, right? Right? Because otherwise there'd need to be quite a bit of explaining about how she didn't look like she was married, let alone pregnant, in that movie!
So the Crystal Prep girls are raising money for a spring dance, and this is taking place shortly after Legend of Everfree, they're planning for something that sounds like it's eight or nine months away. I...guess that makes sense? A lot of those big events do seem to take a lot of time to organize.
I'm really having a flashback to season four's Rarity Takes Manehattan, with how the premise is that Rarity's idea is appropriated by someone else in a competition.
Nice bits with Rarity having a fainting couch, and later on going "om nom nom" while drowning her sorrows in ice cream.
I know she's the Element of Generosity and all (or at least, the analogue thereof), and that this is meant to be a somewhat didactic kids' show about the virtues of working together and not being petty, etc., but I'm still amazed that Rarity didn't have it in her to rub those Crystal Prep girls' faces in their troubles, considering how they treated her when she confronted them.
Wait wait wait...so Twilight, Sunset, et al have "ponied up" for their video? I thought that as of Friendship Games they didn't do that when they performed music (which they're technically not doing here, since they're dancing rather than singing or playing instruments), instead transforming when they performed actions in accordance with their Element of Harmony (notwithstanding Twilight and Sunset).
Okay, that song was pretty catchy, but I really didn't like Pinkie's rapping in the middle of it. That just made me cringe, even if it did hearken back to her rapping in season four's Testing Testing 1, 2, 3.
