Support for dragon Kin?

[Captain Sir Hexen Ineptus]

I know that the developers don't like half dragons and other humanoid descendants from dragons, but I was wondering if we could get at least in this tool some support for dragons?

The single elemental resistance option should be available to dragon kin.

We could have a dragon type/sub-type.

Could we have a base dragon-kin type race?

I have always liked playing half-dragons, ever since 2nd ed, but always drowned out by clearly higher powered monster races.

Thanks,
-Hexen

[Golden-Esque]

Captain Sir Hexen Ineptus wrote:

I know that the developers don't like half dragons and other humanoid descendants from dragons, but I was wondering if we could get at least in this tool some support for dragons?

The single elemental resistance option should be available to dragon kin.

We could have a dragon type/sub-type.

Could we have a base dragon-kin type race?

I have always liked playing half-dragons, ever since 2nd ed, but always drowned out by clearly higher powered monster races.

Thanks,
-Hexen

If you make the race a humanoid, you can call the Subtype whatever you want. The rules clearly say that the subtype for humanoids is the same as the race's name in most cases; if you have a dragonborn race, then you have the dragonborn subtype.

[Captain Sir Hexen Ineptus]

Golden-Esque wrote:

Captain Sir Hexen Ineptus wrote:

I know that the developers don't like half dragons and other humanoid descendants from dragons, but I was wondering if we could get at least in this tool some support for dragons?

The single elemental resistance option should be available to dragon kin.

We could have a dragon type/sub-type.

Could we have a base dragon-kin type race?

I have always liked playing half-dragons, ever since 2nd ed, but always drowned out by clearly higher powered monster races.

Thanks,
-Hexen

If you make the race a humanoid, you can call the Subtype whatever you want. The rules clearly say that the subtype for humanoids is the same as the race's name in most cases; if you have a dragonborn race, then you have the dragonborn subtype.

You are correct, and some of the racial traits would work form them, but RAW they are not valid because they are tied to things of the wrong type. Elemental resistance is tied to outsiders for example.

[StabbittyDoom]

My view on the whole ruleset is that it's like the pirate's code: They're more like guidelines than actual rules.

Type pre-requisites should be considered suggestions rather than hard rules.

That said, we really should have basic rules for *all* the types, not just the ones that the Pathfinder devs like.

If I want a dragon or ooze race, by god I'm going to make it.

[Mikaze]

StabbittyDoom wrote:

That said, we really should have basic rules for *all* the types,

Yep. Aberrations need some love too.

Even the ooze type. Have two concepts that fall under that type and, hey, one 3PP has been selling material for their own for quite a while now.

[Lincoln Hills]

Captain Sir Hexen Ineptus wrote:

...Could we have a base dragon-kin type race?... I have always liked playing half-dragons, ever since 2nd ed...

I haven't seen the playtest material, Hexen, but what I'd do is go with the Monstrous Humanoid type which should have the necessary tools for tail, talons and so forth. As far as elemental resistance, I agree that's good flavor but I don't know if it's mandatory to the trope. Immunity to sleep or natural armor are just as much a part of the concept and I bet they're in the options.

[Bryan Stiltz]

Captain Sir Hexen Ineptus wrote:

Golden-Esque wrote:

If you make the race a humanoid, you can call the Subtype whatever you want. The rules clearly say that the subtype for humanoids is the same as the race's name in most cases; if you have a dragonborn race, then you have the dragonborn subtype.

You are correct, and some of the racial traits would work form them, but RAW they are not valid because they are tied to things of the wrong type. Elemental resistance is tied to outsiders for example.

the bolded part (emphasis mine) is my single biggest concern so far with the playtest.

I would really like the pre-req's to be tied to other customization options. Want Fire immunity? How about Prerequisite: Advanced race. Or Prerequisite: +2 con racial ability (still limiting, but now means I'm not making my -2CON races immune to damage types just to tweak them*). Or Pre-requisite: None, even???

*man, that's a cheese I'd like to tackle if I can find a minute - build a -2 or -4 CON race and then stack immunities and DR so even though I have really low HP, you can't hurt me

[Lincoln Hills]

I agree that limiting elemental resistance in that way seems a bit too restrictive. The ability is handed out to monsters (even humanoids) fairly regularly: it'd be nice to re-create a race such as, say, firenewts or snow goblins.

[The Best Goblin!]

I think that support for all types is ideal, as well. But if the developers want to avoid that, for whatever reason, they could at least make a half-dragon subtype, like they did with undead and constructs. Half-dragon was a really popular template with my old d&d group.

[DeathQuaker]

I've been thinking about it, and it seems like for what I imagine most people want out of a playable draconic race, you can do this as humanoid (reptilian) or humanoid (draconian) (or monstrous humanoid if need be)--and then raise/open up the restrictions on appropriate abilities like elemental resistance.

In other words, it seems to me the real problem isn't that there's a draconic subtype, it's that elemental resistance is restricted to outsiders only when there's no good apparent reason for doing that.

Once the restriction's raised, it shouldn't be a problem. You could even do a convincing standard race--humanoid (draconic), give it a bite attack, natural armor, elemental resistance, and maybe an appropriate spell like ability.

And maybe add an ability that grants some kind of bonus when the race takes the draconic sorcerer bloodline (a la elemental races with elemental bloodline and tieflings with abyssal or infernal bloodlines).