The text of Abundant Ammunition reads:
When cast on a container such as a quiver or a pouch that contains nonmagical ammunition or shuriken (including masterwork ammunition or shuriken), at the start of each round this spell replaces any ammunition taken from the container the round before. The ammunition taken from the container the round before vanishes. If, after casting this spell, you cast a spell that enhances projectiles, such as align weapon or greater magic weapon, on the same container, all projectiles this spell conjures are affected by that spell.
RAW, it seems like this spell should also affect quivers that contain ammunition made from special materials (which, as far as I know, are nonmagical), such as adamantine arrows. Is there any rule-based reason why this would be false?
There's nothing.
Adamantine arrows are specifically masterwork as well, so they work.
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Only proviso is that you will need enough ammunition in your container to start with for your full attack, if you plan on using it for full attacks...
That is because it doesn't replace the ammo until the start of your next round, so if there is only one arrow, one arrow is all you get to shoot.
Ought to be interesting to see it interact with an Efficient Quiver containing a mixture of arrow types...
Would it replenish ammunition that has had Weapon Blanch applied? And, if so, would it just replace the base ammunition, or would the new ammo still have the weapon blanching on it?
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It also has a material component: one piece of ammunition to be duplicated. That's a pretty expensive component for adamantine ammo so try to have a divine caster do this.
I think that that material component apply to a divine caster too.
A interesting thing is that the ammunition stay in existence even after the spell end or is dispelled. Good thing as it reduce possible problems.
On the other hand it conflict with this rule about conjuration spells:
"A creature or object brought into being or transported to your location by a conjuration spell cannot appear inside another creature or object, nor can it appear floating in an empty space. It must arrive in an open location on a surface capable of supporting it."
I think the explanation is that the conjuration spells can't summon something inside a solid object, not a object as a general definition.
You think it is possible to enchant the magazine of a repeating crossbow or a revolver with this spell?
It would not be of much use for early firearms as with the right feats you can load and fire them more times than you have chambers, so you would not get a enhanced rate of fire.
I think that that material component apply to a divine caster too.
The divine version of the spell requires only a divine focus, which is not consumed in the casting.
Thank you all for your replies and clarification on this. It's the answer I expected, but I'm a bit disappointed, as this essentially means infinite adamantine arrows for my group's ranger.
Abundant Ammuntion "Components V, S, M/DF (a single piece of ammunition)"
Spell - Components "...If the Components line includes F/DF or M/DF, the arcane version of the spell has a focus component or a material component (the abbreviation before the slash) and the divine version has a divine focus component (the abbreviation after the slash)."
No 'slash' in the Material Components means it is a matrial compenent for both types of casters (arcane and divine) - so both have to pay 1 arrow per casting of the spell.
I would say for interaction with containers with multiple types of ammuntion that the spell only replaces the type used as the focus.
For magic items created using this rule remeber that its going to take the cost of 100 pieces of the ammunition and that it is very hard to magically create "Cold Iron".
How the spell interacts with Weapon Blanches, I would say yes it works for spell, no to magical items created using the spell.
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Abundant Ammuntion "Components V, S, M/DF (a single piece of ammunition)"
Spell - Components "...If the Components line includes F/DF or M/DF, the arcane version of the spell has a focus component or a material component (the abbreviation before the slash) and the divine version has a divine focus component (the abbreviation after the slash)."No 'slash' in the Material Components means it is a matrial compenent for both types of casters (arcane and divine) - so both have to pay 1 arrow per casting of the spell.
I would say for interaction with containers with multiple types of ammuntion that the spell only replaces the type used as the focus
You just contradicted yourself. I'm not sure how you think you're reading it, but you gave evidence that supports your opposing view. AA has M/DF, so the M is for arcane, the DF is for divine.
Another thing, nowhere does it mention that the ammunition has to be the same as the one being replaced by the spell. RAW, you could use a sling bullet for the Mat component and cast the spell on a quiver of arrows if you wanted. Had the Mat been (a single piece of ammunition in the target quiver) or something similar, then yes, but RAW you don't have to waste an expensive piece of ammo to cast the spell.
Eric - it looks like you are correct on the M/DF for the spell. If it had been listed as "M(a single piece of ammunition), DF" then my inccorect interpretation would have been correct.
I would say that common sence governs the fact that the ammunition has to be of the same type as the amoo replaced.
Another thing, nowhere does it mention that the ammunition has to be the same as the one being replaced by the spell. RAW, you could use a sling bullet for the Mat component and cast the spell on a quiver of arrows if you wanted. Had the Mat been (a single piece of ammunition in the target quiver) or something similar, then yes, but RAW you don't have to waste an expensive piece of ammo to cast the spell.
While I agree with you on the wording, I personally will be house-ruling that the spell must be cast using a piece of the desired ammunition. Not that such an alteration solves the infinite special ammo issue for divine casters, of course.
I'm still a bit confused about this sentence, though:
The ammunition taken from the container the round before vanishes.
What purpose does this serve? Is it just to make sure you can't recover the ammunition after using it?
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I think that that material component apply to a divine caster too.The divine version of the spell requires only a divine focus, which is not consumed in the casting.
Thank you all for your replies and clarification on this. It's the answer I expected, but I'm a bit disappointed, as this essentially means infinite adamantine arrows for my group's ranger.
RAW: Sure.
I should amend it to:I think that for as spell, if you need a costly material component, the divine version should still require the costly component and still consume it.
A bit wordy, but it will make a difference when producing some magical item.
Re-reading the spell the material component is "a single piece of ammunition", not "one piece of ammunition to be duplicated" as Atarlost suggested so the problem don't exist.
Probably I will houserule the way Atarlost suggested, plus my modification for divine casters, I don't like much the idea of a practically infinite supply of special ammunitions at no cost
I'm still a bit confused about this sentence, though:
The ammunition taken from the container the round before vanishes.What purpose does this serve? Is it just to make sure you can't recover the ammunition after using it?
Probably that is what the developer was thinking.
at the start of each round this spell replaces any ammunition taken from the container the round before.
RAW I could grab 20 adamantine arrows from my quiver, put them on a shelve and get another 20 adamantine arrow the next round.
Without that caveat I would be capable of creating arrow from thin air and sell them.Edit:
There is a bit of problem about what will happen when the spell end.
As it is a Conjuration (summoning) and it don't say that the item will disappear at the end of the spell the ammunition produced by teh spell will stay.
But what will happen after they are removed from the container?
They will still disappear after a round?
As it is a Conjuration (summoning) and it don't say that the item will disappear at the end of the spell the ammunition produced by teh spell will stay.
But what will happen after they are removed from the container?
They will still disappear after a round?
The way I've come to think of it now is essentially as an automatic ammo fetching spell. Ammo you remove from the container is used, then it disappears only to reappear again in the container at the start of the next round. When the spell ends, all that remains is a quiver full of ammunition that can be moved around as normal.
Personally, I would rather see the spell be reclassified as as conjuration (creation) spell, which would cause the ammo to disappear once the duration has ended. Then casters would get infinite ammo for the duration of the spell rather than forever.
Edit: That reclassification is probably unnecessary considering the limited spellcasting potential of weapon-dependent classes like rangers.
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Personally, I would rather see the spell be reclassified as as conjuration (creation) spell, which would cause the ammo to disappear once the duration has ended. Then casters would get infinite ammo for the duration of the spell rather than forever.
I see a problem with that too:
- my archer start the fight with 20 adamantine arrows- friendly caster cast the spell
- my archer use 6 arrows round
- after x round the battle end and after a few more rounds the spell end.
How many "true" arrows I have expended?
I have no way to know if the arrow I picked from my quiver is one of the arrows conjured by the spell or one of the original arrow.
So, unless I start every fight with exactly 1 round of ammunition in my quiver, I would almost certainly use a mix of normal and conjured arrows.
The way I've come to think of it now is essentially as an automatic ammo fetching spell. Ammo you remove from the container is used, then it disappears only to reappear again in the container at the start of the next round. When the spell ends, all that remains is a quiver full of ammunition that can be moved around as normal.
Your proposed solution here is more elegant.
We can add to the fluff of the spell that "it recover and repair the ammunitions you used in the last turn".That way it is not summoning something from the "plane of infinite arrows" but it using a targeted form of teleportation and mending to allow us to use again the old ammunitions.
* The "plane of infinite houses" for the production of Secure Shelters is (c) by F. Da Sacco and used here with permission :D