Large Pathfinder Game Tips

[CliffyD]

I am planning on running a large game of Pathfinder with a player output of approximately 9 people. There are three newbie players that will be joining and I really want to impress them with a challenge. I know a group that large can be difficult to challenge being as how the other 6 are veteran players.

What I want to know is what can I throw at them that will be a large enough challenge without killing them off? I plan to make the newbies play melee or ranged and keep them away from spells for their first time through. I have run large scale games of D&D that weren't a problem, but I didn't know if Pathfinder was different in the aspect of not as challenging monsters?

Be that as it may...I could really use the help in CR calculation for a 9 person party adventure for an epic battle. Thanks in advance.

[CliffyD]

The APL of this 9 person party will be 1st because I'm starting the campaign off at that level for the newbies.

[Karuth]

You could let them fight something large but slow and allow them to attack sections of it (just the legs for example). Something is capturing the beasts attention, so if they are not acting too stupid they should not get the creatures full attention.
They just have to cope with the little things, like small erthquakes with every step and maybe parasites living on the creature. Let them climb up and find the weak spot to kill it (like in Shadow of the colossus ;3)

Or just make it many small enemies. Like a big band of Goblins, Kobolds or whatever. Have them experience a chaotic battle where things go wrong and funny things happen (Main Melee fighter getting grapples and tripped by several of the smaller ones and then they pile on top of him)

Or force them to split up. For example one group has to save some villagers while the other fights some monsters.

[DeathQuaker]

I agree with Karuth's suggestions--especially fighting a horde of goblins or kobolds--EXCEPT for the split up option. Splitting into two different combat scenarios creates a LOT more work for the GM and runs the risk of one group getting bored while the others are fighting. There are times probably when a group that big is going to need to split up but I wouldn't start off like that.

But honestly? Were I in your position, CliffyD, I'd run two different games--one with 5 vets, and one with the 3 newbs plus a vet who is good with working with new people. Group of 5 and a group of 4 will be much easier to manage than one group of 9, IMHO. It makes some more work for you to run two games than one, but I'd still find it less stressful, personally. You may have your reasons for doing one big group, of course, just my thoughts on the matter.

As to the CR--you have effectively two parties' worth of adventurers, newbs or no (and don't underestimate new players), I would double the CR challenges. So versus a 1st level, 9 person party, I would make most of the challenges at least 2 or 3 (e.g., 6-9 goblin warriors, or 5 goblin warriors plus a leader, etc.).

[sozin]

My 2c.

1) Manage your combats as efficiently as possible. With that big a crew, you're going to need to keep your initiative orders tight and controlled. If you aren't using one of the many combat pad solutions out there (Paizo's Gamemastery Pad is excellent), use one. If you see folks doinking around with their iPhones while they wait their turn, you'll know you're not going fast enough. If you can find a 30 second egg timer (or big digital display), keep folks on the clock - if they haven't acted by the time the clock hits 0, they auto-delay.

2) Get one of the players to be your DM assistant and manage initiatives.

3) Don't allow any summoners into your game, or cohorts, or summoning based druids. They are guaranteed to slow combat down.

3) For CR calculations, use the handy dandy Excel CR calculation sheet ( Excel 2003 link, Excel 2007/2010 link).

4) Stay on top of the NPC statblocks. I use herolabs and the herolabs tactical console for this - makes tracking hit points, buffs, spell lists, conditions, etc a cinch.

[Mok]

I've run split combats before successfully. Basically you just run one big combat, but it is split into two different locations that can't be joined. That way you can use normal CR rules to build a force for each group of players.

In terms of the narrative, you just have to shape things so that having the two different groups makes sense. Such as storming a really large castle, where one group is climbing the keep, meanwhile another is infiltrating through a secret entrance. Make the overall plot have a countdown timer, so that both groups have to keep moving along and not dawdling.

Each group has a goal, say... one group has to climb the keep and take out the mcguffin at the top that magnifies the sorcerer's power, meanwhile the other group has to rescue the human sacrifice before the person gets sacrificed in the great ritual the sorcerer is attempting to pull off.

The important thing, and it can help if you explain this ahead of time to the players, is that this is going to be "cinematic" and so when combat happens it's going to "snap to grid" in a sense. When one group triggers a combat, the other group is likewise going to trigger combat. In the above scenario, having guards about allows this to happen and it still making sense.

If you organize all of this correctly then combat is like any normal combat, just two battle mats are being used at the same time. There isn't really any way of getting around having 9 players at the table though, aside from having some harsh rules on turn play, such as "if you move your figure, it's moved, no take backs" and "You have five seconds to declare what you're going to do, otherwise you are put into delay and have a chance to step in on another initiative count." Basically, no hemming and hawing on a player's turn, or strategizing aloud to the table as to what is the most optimal move.