Dragon Surfing, Stalwart Defender question

[ddgon]

Ok so this is what happened, our dwarf Stalwart Defender thought it was a good idea to be teleported onto the back of a flying and attacking red dragon. Now the dragon was attacking us, but the dwarf wanted to get in melee range. So the wizard teleported him to the dragons back and he fell onto the dragon, making the check the DM gave him.

Then he activated his stance. So technialy he can't be moved right? even if the dragon flys upside down and such? Anyone have ideas on how this should be handled?

Let me clerify. The Dragon is a bad guy we are trying to kill. The movement of getting the dwarf off him, (and falling) is not something the dwarf wants. The dwarf wants to just hack of the dragons head. So he ends up surffing on the dragon's back while the dragon attacks him.

any advice on this issue?

[Shane Gifford]

That sounds like it should be made into a sport at "Ye Olde Stalwart Defender Training Academie." Awesome!

But anyways, I'd probably rule that if the dragon were to flip over, he'd have to make difficult Climb checks to hold on, otherwise he'd fall off. I'm basing this off the hypothetical, "What if the Defender stances and then the ground disappears?" Obviously, the defender would still fall instead of levitating. That's how I'm thinking it should be done, though it is only my opinion.

[LazarX]

The stance requires being placed on firm ground. But that's not the case here. Essentially he's in a modified grapple in midair. So I would say no...the stance does not activate.

But it is the kind of move that is derring do, so hopefully the dwarf in question has some good CMB, although in this case I wouldn't require him to actually beat the cmb as it's more of a "hang on for dear life" scenario as opposed to actually trying to grapple the beast.

But not an auto success from a stance he's not in a position to activate.

[Jiggy]

ddgon wrote:

Ok so this is what happened, our dwarf Stalwart Defender thought it was a good idea to be teleported onto the back of a flying and attacking red dragon. Now the dragon was attacking us, but the dwarf wanted to get in melee range. So the wizard teleported him to the dragons back and he fell onto the dragon, making the check the DM gave him.

Then he activated his stance. So technialy he can't be moved right? even if the dragon flys upside down and such? Anyone have ideas on how this should be handled?

Let me clerify. The Dragon is a bad guy we are trying to kill. The movement of getting the dwarf off him, (and falling) is not something the dwarf wants. The dwarf wants to just hack of the dragons head. So he ends up surffing on the dragon's back while the dragon attacks him.

any advice on this issue?

Are you referring to the "defensive stance" ability?

PRD wrote:

While in a defensive stance, a stalwart defender cannot willingly move from his current position through any means...

Basically, he has to choose to stay put in order to maintain the stance, but there's nothing saying he can't be moved against his will. In fact, one of the defensive powers he can choose as he levels grants him a boost to his CMD against things like bull rush - thus further negating any assumptions that he was already unable to be moved.

When something weird shows up, start by re-reading the relevant rules to make sure you didn't miss something. ;)

[Selgard]

*just one time* i'd let it work just for the sheer "cool" factor of using his main class ability in this manner. :P "dragon surfing" and the inherent danger just sounds good.

That being said- if it were to become a regular occurrence I'd probably have to remind the dwarf about gravity at some point.

-S

[David Thomassen]

Defensive Stance "...While in a defensive stance, a stalwart defender cannot willingly move from his current position through any means (including normal movement, riding a mount, teleportation, or willingly allowing allies to carry him). If he enters a defensive stance while on a moving vehicle he does not control (such as a wagon or ship), he can maintain the stance even if the vehicle moves. "
So I would rule it that he must have first made a climb check to securely hold onto the dragon (He would know that the dragon would invert at some point to get rid of the Defender) and then activate the Defensive Stance.
Nothing in the Ability's description stops another from moving the Defender. So make the climb role, accept the penalties to AC and start hacking.

[BigNorseWolf]

The dragon is the new ground. As long as he stays on the neck/back/tail where he activated the stance he's fine.

[Shizzle69]

This brings me back to my days as a gnome cleric in 3.5. This was my second character ever so I made lots of design mistakes. The dm, however, gave me a nasty ring of teleport 60 ft 3/day as a move. He did this mostly so the party wouldn't die (as I would be able to bamf around and heal them.) He threw our first dragon at us. It was a green dragon messing around with transmute rock to mud and fly-by and breath weapons. You know normal dragon crap. So I decided i'm bamfing on it's back and bringing it down. How you ask was a gnome going to bring him down. Well with my trusty tan bag of tricks of course. I had the party barbarian toss me towards the dragon as he flew by, then I teleported on his back, dropped a fuzzy ball and prayed I rolled over 90. It came up 97. Boy was that dragon supprized to find a rhino on his back. Needless to say dragon riding is awesome.

Sorry to go off on a tanget there, but this games session is one of the reasons I love D&D/Pathfinder so much. As far as your dragon riding question goes, I don't see why his stance couldn't give his some sort of bonus to a ride/CMB check. He's obviously a stable guy.