Armor as DR variant rules

[Cos1983]

I plan to use the new armor as DR variant rules but there are a few areas of concern that I have in regards to defense and critical hits.

1. "In this alternative system, a creature does not have an
Armor Class (AC); it instead has a Defense score. Defense is
similar to touch AC in the standard Pathfinder Roleplaying
Game rules, but it also adds the shield bonus (including any
enhancement bonus to the shield), and any enhancement
bonus to armor.
Defense = 10 + shield bonus + Dexterity modifier + other
modifiers (including armor’s enhancement bonus, but not
armor bonus or natural armor bonus)"

Does this mean that size modifiers no longer matter? there are part of touch AC but they don't factor into this new equation.

2. "In this alternative system, when a creature threatens a
critical hit, it does not make a critical hit confirmation
roll. Instead, the target of that critical hit makes a critical
defense check instead. A critical defense check is 1d20 + a
bonus equal to the creature’s DR + the creature’s Dexterity
modifier (up to the maximum Dexterity bonus allowed by
any armor worn) + the sum of any def lection and shield
bonus to Defense.
Critical defense check bonus = creature’s DR + Dexterity
modifier + shield bonus to Defense + deflection bonus"

If you bypass a creature's DR is its Critcal Hit Defense (CHD) reduced? for example if you threaten to critical a skeleton and you by pass its DR/armor but not its DR/bludgeoning is it's CHD now lower by 4? (4 is the standard DR/armor for a skeleton).

[Uthak]

This is what happens when they blind play test a rules suplement.

I my opinion that whole system seems why to complex, and if they had given it out as a free play test they could have gotten way more feedback on it.

*Rant over*

I would include the size modifier for Defense, and if the attacker has a way of bypassing DR then it should not count for the CHD.

but thats just my opinion.

[Mike Schneider]

Steal from GURPS -- it's the only game system with remotely rational armor rules.

[DungeonmasterCal]

Mike Schneider wrote:

Steal from GURPS -- it's the only game system with remotely rational armor rules.

Having never seen GURPS' rules, what are they?

[AdAstraGames]

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Mike Schneider wrote:

Steal from GURPS -- it's the only game system with remotely rational armor rules.

Having never seen GURPS' rules, what are they?

Excellent. They are explained in broad detail in GURPS Lite

Armor has DR. GURPS weapon damages don't go asymptotic like they do in d20 based systems.

[DungeonmasterCal]

AdAstraGames wrote:

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Mike Schneider wrote:

Steal from GURPS -- it's the only game system with remotely rational armor rules.

Having never seen GURPS' rules, what are they?

Excellent. They are explained in broad detail in GURPS Lite

Armor has DR. GURPS weapon damages don't go asymptotic like they do in d20 based systems.

Very cool. Thanks!

[Talonhawke]

yes you add size modifers thats where Other modifiers comes in.

dont know on the second but i would say no.

[keinlicht]

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

AdAstraGames wrote:

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Mike Schneider wrote:

Steal from GURPS -- it's the only game system with remotely rational armor rules.

Having never seen GURPS' rules, what are they?

Excellent. They are explained in broad detail in GURPS Lite

Armor has DR. GURPS weapon damages don't go asymptotic like they do in d20 based systems.

Very cool. Thanks!

You cannot easily fit GURPS armor rules intp Pathfinder rules. If you manage, I am highly interested. GURPS handles the whole fight differently and without targeted hits and blocks and parades that system does not run.

I was looking forward to test "armor as DR" and the "vigor and wounds" rules from ultimate combat. Now, after skipping through the threads related I feel like I should give it a pass. It is a pity.