SItuation: Some enemy critter has just been paralyzed; little Str7 witch decides to end the sucker's life.
Striking with her Dagger, proclaiming a Coup de Grace - woo hoo, auto crit! So, we get...
1d4-2 + 1d4-2... (rolling a 2 and a 1), totaling in 2 points of nonlethal damage.
Will the situation still call for a Fort Save (DC12) to avert death?
SItuation: Some enemy critter has just been paralyzed; little Str7 witch decides to end the sucker's life.
Striking with her Dagger, proclaiming a Coup de Grace - woo hoo, auto crit! So, we get...
1d4-2 + 1d4-2... (rolling a 2 and a 1), totaling in 2 points of nonlethal damage.Will the situation still call for a Fort Save (DC12) to avert death?
I don't see why not. Coup de grace just says save vs 10+dmg dealt, doesn't specify lethal damage.
Here's another:
Coup de grace vs DR.
The selfsame witch has been running around for a bit, coup de gracing her sleeping opponents left and right, and grows tired of her puniness, so she buys a belt of giant strength +4. Now she's running around with 11 Str.
But then, she comes across something with DR 5/magic. Since she spent all her money on her belt, she still has just her puny little normal dagger.
She sleeps her foe then gets ready for her signature coup de grace.
She hits and crits!!!! Hooray! And then she rolls a 2 and a 3. Better than her 1 and 2 from before, but still not enough to overcome this pesky DR. No damage is dealt.
Does the foe have to make a DC 10 fortitude save or die?
SItuation: Some enemy critter has just been paralyzed; little Str7 witch decides to end the sucker's life.
Striking with her Dagger, proclaiming a Coup de Grace - woo hoo, auto crit! So, we get...
1d4-2 + 1d4-2... (rolling a 2 and a 1), totaling in 2 points of nonlethal damage.Will the situation still call for a Fort Save (DC12) to avert death?
Personally, I would call it Fort Save or go unconscious, since it is non-lethal damage.
Probably a rules question that i've missed... but why is the dagger doing 'non-lethal' damage?
If the player is TRYING to kill the victim, I'd say it's save or die...
If the player is actively TRYING to do non-lethal, then i'd say Save or unconscious.
It's very frustrating to FINALLY be in the position to try and take a prisoner... only to be told you killed him accidentally. If i'm killin' someone... then by gum, i MEAN to kill 'em ;)
If they're held or tied up, thematically you should be able to bonk them on the head and knock them out.
SItuation: Some enemy critter has just been paralyzed; little Str7 witch decides to end the sucker's life.
Striking with her Dagger, proclaiming a Coup de Grace - woo hoo, auto crit! So, we get...
1d4-2 + 1d4-2... (rolling a 2 and a 1), totaling in 2 points of nonlethal damage.Will the situation still call for a Fort Save (DC12) to avert death?
Yes, it will still call for a save for death, this is a part of the Coup De Grace Action. Even if you dealt 1 point of damage it would still call for the save.
IMO the DC to avoid death would be 10 since you have not dealt any leathal damage to the creature, i know the rule doesn't specify a type of damage, just sayin.
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SItuation: Some enemy critter has just been paralyzed; little Str7 witch decides to end the sucker's life.
Striking with her Dagger, proclaiming a Coup de Grace - woo hoo, auto crit! So, we get...
1d4-2 + 1d4-2... (rolling a 2 and a 1), totaling in 2 points of nonlethal damage.Will the situation still call for a Fort Save (DC12) to avert death?
Yes, it will still call for a save for death, this is a part of the Coup De Grace Action. Even if you dealt 1 point of damage it would still call for the save.
IMO the DC to avoid death would be 10 since you have not dealt any leathal damage to the creature, i know the rule doesn't specify a type of damage, just sayin.
I agree. The coup de grâce can kill the victim in two possible ways. The damage might be enough to kill him outright, but if the sheer damage doesn't kill the victim he must make s fortitude save (DC 10+damage) to survive.
If the witch inflicts 0 damage on a sleeping character at positive hit points, the victim must still make a DC 10 fortitude save. There is a good chance that he'll make that save, though, and wake up in a really bad mood. If the character is unable to inflict much damage, the coup de grâce is a risky action.
The poster of the question already took that into account in the original post.
Think of it as hitting someone in the throat with your fist. That person has a reasonable chance of dying (DC 10). But didn't take HP damage.
Probably a rules question that i've missed... but why is the dagger doing 'non-lethal' damage?
When penalties reduce your damage below 1, you deal 1 point of non-lethal instead.
So one might imagine that the dagger bounced off the intended victim (0 damage), but it happened to nick his jugular vein (failed save)?
Or crushed a vital organ
Nope it just nicked some no vital organ in such a way that an air-bubble entered the bloodstream and found its way to the brain and poof dead.