TELEKINESIS'S CMD?!?!?!?!

[Darth Uchiha]

Telekinesis tells us how to determine the CMB in order to grapple someone (or use some other maneuver). What it doesn't tell us, however, is what the caster's effective CMD is in order to break free.

So, if I am a wizard using telekinesis to maintain a grapple on an enemy, what do they check against in order to break free?

My guess would be 10 + caster level + (casting ability modifier * 2). Is this correct?

[Thelemic_Noun]

That is probably too high. I believe its CMB and CMD modifiers are equal.

[Maxximilius]

Wait, what ?

CMD = 10 + CMB + Dex bonus + Eventual Bonuses.

Here, the CMB is clearly defined as Caster level + Intelligence/Charisma instead of Strength or Dexterity. Caster level 15 with 14 Str, 14 Dex, 24 Intelligence and Improved Grapple feat, replacing strength by Intelligence would have a CMB of 15 + 7 + 2 = 24, so 10 + 24 + 2 = 36 DMC to beat to break free. By replacing Dex with Intelligence, CMB would be 15 + 2 + 2 = +19, and the CMD, 10 + 19 + 7 + 2 : 38.
With Agile Maneuvers, you would benefit twice from Dexterity replaced by Intelligence, and CMB would be 24/CMD 43.

At least, it seems right this way.

[Darth Uchiha]

Thelemic_Noun wrote:

That is probably too high. I believe its CMB and CMD are equal.

Also, grapples are kind of bad; trip and disarm are much better.

You don't think it even has the standard +10? That doesn't make much sense to me. I really hope Paizo answers this because I'm not sure how players are expected to just figure it out on their own!

Also, grapples are good when you can use them to pin flying creatures to keep them from flapping their wings and make them fall.

[Thelemic_Noun]

Darth Uchiha wrote:

Thelemic_Noun wrote:

That is probably too high. I believe its CMB and CMD are equal.

Also, grapples are kind of bad; trip and disarm are much better.

You don't think it even has the standard +10? That doesn't make much sense to me. I really hope Paizo answers this because I'm not sure how players are expected to just figure it out on their own!

Sorry, I wasn't clear. :(

The modifiers are the same. CMD still starts with a base of 10 before modifiers.
My bad.