Can a Nature Oracle make a good summoner?


Advice


I want to get peoples opinions if a nature oracle can make a good summoner. I do not mean the class, I mean a summoner of monsters.


Uh... Sure, being able to have both normal Cleric Summons AND Druid SNA at your disposal doesn´t hurt...
Neither does being able to speak with a good amount of those creatures, or the CHA bonus to Saves that the Animals get.
(although how that´s worded, it could well apply to ALL animals within range, including those that want to eat you)

Besides normal Feat option for buffing Summons, I would also consider the Verdant Bloodline for Eldritch Heritage, you will have no problem meeting the CHA pre-req´s, and it boosts your Summons with nice bonus to Natural Armor and Saves. I seem to remember something that gives your summons your Caster Level in Temp HPs, but can´t quite remember what it was... Could have been another Class to begin with. In any case, you should definitely be able to be more than competent at the Summoning schtick. ...Now, I can´t say whether or not you will manange to annoy the heck out of your co-players with all you Summon spam... 8-o

Grand Lodge

zmanerism wrote:
I want to get peoples opinions if a nature oracle can make a good summoner. I do not mean the class, I mean a summoner of monsters.

Well he can cast the spells and take the feats that any wizard or conjurer can. Is there anything specific you needed to know? He can't out summon a Summoner if that's what you're asking.


I am wondering if it is a good enough direction to sink feats into. We have a melee based paladin, an archery ranger, a alchemist and me the nature oracle. I do not know if we can use the ultimate magic yet so some of the buffing feats might not be available.

Grand Lodge

zmanerism wrote:
I am wondering if it is a good enough direction to sink feats into. We have a melee based paladin, an archery ranger, a alchemist and me the nature oracle. I do not know if we can use the ultimate magic yet so some of the buffing feats might not be available.

The oracle was good to go as it was when APG came out. If UM isn't available, don't sweat it.


zmanerism wrote:
I am wondering if it is a good enough direction to sink feats into. We have a melee based paladin, an archery ranger, a alchemist and me the nature oracle. I do not know if we can use the ultimate magic yet so some of the buffing feats might not be available.

I find the Nature oracle to be better at the weird buff type caster. Sure you can take Friend to the Animals and Augment Summoning to be a pretty good summoner for more battlefield chaos/control.

But taking Nature's Whispers to defend yourself, Spirit of Nature to keep yourself moving and Transcendental Bond to keep in touch with the party and eventually drop touch spells on them from a distance makes you an unpredictable target. And Undo Artifice can really mess things up when you start using it on weapons, armor or later magic items that your enemies have or want to use. Really lets you mess with the battlefield in ways that you wouldn't necessarily expect from the divine caster.

Grand Lodge

I would not recommend it. Oracles have so few spells known, that summon nature's ally and monster summoning would take your first two spells known each time you gain a new level of spells. If you are human, it's not quite as bad, but you're still going to be exceedingly weak.


sieylianna wrote:
I would not recommend it. Oracles have so few spells known, that summon nature's ally and monster summoning would take your first two spells known each time you gain a new level of spells. If you are human, it's not quite as bad, but you're still going to be exceedingly weak.

That's not an issue:

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/oracle wrote:
Friend to the Animals (Ex): Add all summon nature’s ally spells to your spell list. You must still select these spells using your allotment of spells known. Animals within 30 feet of you receive a bonus on all saving throws equal to your Charisma modifier.


you do note in the quote it says You must still select these spells using your allotment of spells known

add to class list that means you can learn them ectra, not that you auto get them like cure or inflict spells


meowstef wrote:

you do note in the quote it says You must still select these spells using your allotment of spells known

add to class list that means you can learn them ectra, not that you auto get them like cure or inflict spells

Yes, quite right. I did miss that. I guess it's a bigger issue than I thought. :)

Grand Lodge

Jarl wrote:
Yes, quite right. I did miss that. I guess it's a bigger issue than I thought. :)

I like the Oracle class (I have an Oracle 7 and an Oracle 4 / Barb 2 in PFS, and an Oracle 4 in a home game). But a Sorcerer is closer in power to a Wizard than an Oracle is to a Cleric. Slow spell progression, limited spells known, and the weak Cleric spell list makes Oracle a relatively weak class.

Grand Lodge

Jarl wrote:
meowstef wrote:

you do note in the quote it says You must still select these spells using your allotment of spells known

add to class list that means you can learn them ectra, not that you auto get them like cure or inflict spells

Yes, quite right. I did miss that. I guess it's a bigger issue than I thought. :)

As you level up though you can trade out the earlier Summon spells, like when you get to level 4 and learn SM2, you can trade out SM1 for a new 1st level spell.


very very good point. Thanks for the reminder


I think an oracle summoner is a great idea! Summoning is one of the most versatile methods of inflicting damage upon your enemies while reducing damage to your allies and self. Just don't forget that each of the classes plays very differently when dealing with specialized summoning. A wizard/cleric is pretty much the sum of her prepared spells, and a summoner (AGP) is all about making her extraplanar ally the best it can be. As an oracle you'll have full access to both summoning lists, and a plethora of class bonuses to back you up:

Bonded Mount: a horse is decent, but a small oracle can snag a wolf or boar.
Erosion Touch: with two feats you become the most amazing Sunder maneuver specialist in the game. As well as the best lockpicker. And trap disarmer. And escape artist. YMMV.
Natural Divination: An incredible bonus to a single save, skill check, or initiative that waits up to 24 hours for you to use it? Score.
Nature's Whispers: Dump dexterity and use your CHA for armor. Oh my god.
Speak with Animal: Grab this one, and then every 3 levels pick the best summon for roughly your level. You'll have the ability to communicate with your favorite summons at will!
Transcendent Bond: Communicate with your allies as per telepathic bond. Fantastic!

Don't forget that you're working with a spontaneous version of the cleric list, so feel free to stock up on party-wide buffs like bless, badger's ferocity, nap stack, prayer, and blessing of fervor (aka Haste 2.0).

Because your main focus is bringing extra players to the battlefield, you've got a lot of flexibility when it comes to what other spells you'd like. If anyone ever looks at your oracle and says "you're just not as good as a cleric" you're doing it wrong. Or they're being a jerk.

Grand Lodge

Sean FitzSimon wrote:
Nature's Whispers: Dump dexterity and use your CHA for armor. Oh my god.

Unfortunately, "Nature's Whispers" only affects Armor Class. If it worked like the Lore mystery "Sidestep Secret" and also affected your reflex saving thow, then it would be bearable.

But since Dexterity determines your 1) Initiative; 2) Reflex Saving Thow; 3) CMD and 4)Ranged attack bonus - Nature's Whispers is pretty much useless.


Nature's Whispers also affects CMD. You can fix Initiative with a feat. You can get around poor ranged attack bonus.
Low reflex is probably the most acceptable low save, so it's a tradeoff, but not a bad one.

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