Magus Questions


Rules Questions


So I just started playing a Magus in our game and have gotten to level 3.
Now we have hit a few speedbumps with how some of the class mechanics work and how they interact with core mechanics.

If you hold a touch spell and don't discharge it, can you discharge the spell with any melee attack? Like an attack of oppurtunity?
Or would the only way to deliver the spell be by discharging the spell with the normal standard action touch attack (Which could be converted into a weapon attack via spellstrike)?

Another issue is a couple of my group think the ability to critically hit a spell on a weapon critical hit using spellstrike is incredibly overpowered. Getting upwards of 60 or more damage at level 4 with good rolls. Anyone have an opinion on that?

And lastly, is the Magus a strength or dexterity favored class? Another thing I'm simply looking for an opinion on.


Viscereal wrote:


If you hold a touch spell and don't discharge it, can you discharge the spell with any melee attack? Like an attack of oppurtunity?
Or would the only way to deliver the spell be by discharging the spell with the normal standard action touch attack (Which could be converted into a weapon attack via spellstrike)?

That thing is debatable, so your DM must make a judgment call until we get a FAQ response on this.

Viscereal wrote:


Another issue is a couple of my group think the ability to critically hit a spell on a weapon critical hit using spellstrike is incredibly overpowered. Getting upwards of 60 or more damage at level 4 with good rolls. Anyone have an opinion on that?

It's ok. During the playtest we weren't sure if you were getting the weapon multiplier/threat range or not but in the final version of the magus it was decided that it's ok to have the weapon's threat range (but not multiplier), so my opinion is that it was an informed decision.

Viscereal wrote:


And lastly, is the Magus a strength or dexterity favored class? Another thing I'm simply looking for an opinion on.

Now that's not a rules question but i will answer as best as i can.

If you want a dervish dance magus then you only need STR 13 (for power attack) and so it's a DEX focuesed class.
If you don't want a dervish dance magus but you want a STR magus then STR should be your primary focus but you can't ignore DEX because at low levels the magus doesn't have access to medium/heavy armor so it's easier to kill.
If you want to make an INT magus (most of them are hexcrafters) then it becomes an INT focused class.
So my answer is that it depends on what kind of magus you want to play and at what level the campaing is to going to end.


Ok.
To elaborate on the holding a touch spell question.
If I was allowed to discharge a touch spell I have held on any melee attack.
Then I could cast and hold a touch spell for one turn, move into position.
Then on the following turn do spell combat which would look like this.
Melee attack with -2 hit
Spellstrike with held touch spell
Spellstrike with the spell granted by spell combat with a -2 hit.

So I would get to do two attacks and two spellcasts in one turn at level 3.
I don't think that's how its supposed to work.
My argument was that all spell strike does is change the delivery method for touch spells into [Range: Melee Attack].
So you couldn't use a held touch spell on an opportunity attack because you cant cast spells as opportunity attacks. Correct?

Scarab Sages

Viscereal wrote:

So I just started playing a Magus in our game and have gotten to level 3.

Now we have hit a few speedbumps with how some of the class mechanics work and how they interact with core mechanics.

If you hold a touch spell and don't discharge it, can you discharge the spell with any melee attack? Like an attack of oppurtunity?
Or would the only way to deliver the spell be by discharging the spell with the normal standard action touch attack (Which could be converted into a weapon attack via spellstrike)?

Yes, you can.

From PRD:
"Holding the Charge: If you don't discharge the spell in the round when you cast the spell, you can hold the charge indefinitely. You can continue to make touch attacks round after round. If you touch anything or anyone while holding a charge, even unintentionally, the spell discharges. If you cast another spell, the touch spell dissipates. . . . . If the attack hits, you deal normal damage for your unarmed attack or natural weapon and the spell discharges. If the attack misses, you are still holding the charge."

Viscereal wrote:
Another issue is a couple of my group think the ability to critically hit a spell on a weapon critical hit using spellstrike is incredibly overpowered. Getting upwards of 60 or more damage at level 4 with good rolls. Anyone have an opinion on that?

Ugh, my GM is of the same opinion, yet somehow none of the hardcore posters here seem to think it unbalanced. The Magus can spike some serious damage. Without these spikes, the Magus really doesn't keep up with other melee classes--who all have better hp's, better BAB, and an unlimited amount of swings at their highest damage output compared to the limited resources of a magus relying on spells for most of his damage. At 3rd level, you have 18-20 chance to crit with weapon as opposed to a 20, so an extra 10%. That is more than counterbalanced by the fact that you're losing spells by having to cast defensively--DC: 15 + (2*spell level).

Viscereal wrote:
And lastly, is the Magus a strength or dexterity favored class? Another thing I'm simply looking for an opinion on.

Dex needs Dervish Dance, but then outpaces STR builds early on. STR starts to pull ahead mid levels.

Check for the posts on these boards and the excellent guide to the Magus by Walter here

Scarab Sages

Viscereal wrote:

Ok.

To elaborate on the holding a touch spell question.
If I was allowed to discharge a touch spell I have held on any melee attack.
Then I could cast and hold a touch spell for one turn, move into position.
Then on the following turn do spell combat which would look like this.
Melee attack with -2 hit
Spellstrike with held touch spell
Spellstrike with the spell granted by spell combat with a -2 hit.

So I would get to do two attacks and two spellcasts in one turn at level 3.
I don't think that's how its supposed to work.
My argument was that all spell strike does is change the delivery method for touch spells into [Range: Melee Attack].
So you couldn't use a held touch spell on an opportunity attack because you cant cast spells as opportunity attacks. Correct?

Yes, but then you would be pretty much done for the day. Hope it's dead ;)

Also, if your first swing missed you would lose that held spell when you cast the next spell using spell combat. Or you would just have to skip your casting that round and have taken -2 for nothing. Not to mention you're casting the second spell defensively. There are trade-offs built into how the magus operates.


Viscereal wrote:


If you hold a touch spell and don't discharge it, can you discharge the spell with any melee attack?

You can discharge it with a melee weapon via spellstrike, an unarmed strike, a natural weapon or a touch attack.

Viscereal wrote:


Like an attack of oppurtunity?

Yes, via a melee weapon using spellstrike, an improved unarmed strike, a natural weapon or a touch attack. Of course you have to threaten with the appropriate attack to do so. That would be why 'improved' is showing up with the unarmed strike there.

Viscereal wrote:


Another issue is a couple of my group think the ability to critically hit a spell on a weapon critical hit using spellstrike is incredibly overpowered. Getting upwards of 60 or more damage at level 4 with good rolls. Anyone have an opinion on that?

It is very strong. Its not on par with a fighter done out strong, but it is strong. The magus delivers spikey damage, so its flashier than others.

I recall in 3.5 seeing a 3rd level barbarian deal 60 damage on a crit then cleave into another an crit for a second 60 damage. It's the nature of low level crits on real melee builds.

Viscereal wrote:


And lastly, is the Magus a strength or dexterity favored class? Another thing I'm simply looking for an opinion on.

I'd say it's DEX favored if you are playing at levels 1-12 (which I look towards for PFS). Honestly I believe the same is true at higher levels where the REF save, mobility, DEX skill boosts and most importantly INIT boost will matter over carrying capacity and STR skills. But by leaps and bounds its better before level 13.

-James

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