Improved shield bash makes it so i keep my shield AC but can I use shield bash in addition to my regular attack without having two weapon fighting?
level 4 fighter
Nope. If you use two weapons then it is assumed that you are TWF'ing.
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I have a player in my current campaign who is running a specialized shield-fighter: the character is a Fighter with the TWF feat, and he uses a spiked shield as his primary weapon, with a light weapon in his off-hand. I actually didn't realize that the shield was in his primary hand at first. It seems a little silly to me (Gee, I could hit the bad guy with this perfectly serviceable axe in my hand... but no! I will whack him with my mighty shield!) but he likes it and I suppose it's more interesting than classic sword-and-board.
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Improved shield bash makes it so i keep my shield AC but can I use shield bash in addition to my regular attack without having two weapon fighting?
level 4 fighter
Your 4th level fighter has a BAB of +4, so only has one attack. He can gain an additional attack by fighting with two weapons. Doing so will incur penalties on both attacks. When your fighter has a BAB of +6, he can make two attacks. Such attacks can be mixed between weapons held without incurring penalties for fighting with two weapons; those penalties apply when gaining attacks beyond those due to BAB.
The shield description includes: "You can bash an opponent with a light shield, using it as an off-hand weapon." Some interpret this as saying that a shield can never be used as a primary or only weapon. Others are fine using a shield as primary or only weapon. Check with your GM for his interpretation.
I have a player in my current campaign who is running a specialized shield-fighter: the character is a Fighter with the TWF feat, and he uses a spiked shield as his primary weapon, with a light weapon in his off-hand. I actually didn't realize that the shield was in his primary hand at first. It seems a little silly to me (Gee, I could hit the bad guy with this perfectly serviceable axe in my hand... but no! I will whack him with my mighty shield!) but he likes it and I suppose it's more interesting than classic sword-and-board.You can't use a shield as a main hand weapon.
From prd:
shield-bash-attacks
By RAW you're correct but it's his game and he's obviously allowing it so why does it matter?
By RAW you're correct but it's his game and he's obviously allowing it so why does it matter?I have a player in my current campaign who is running a specialized shield-fighter: the character is a Fighter with the TWF feat, and he uses a spiked shield as his primary weapon, with a light weapon in his off-hand. I actually didn't realize that the shield was in his primary hand at first. It seems a little silly to me (Gee, I could hit the bad guy with this perfectly serviceable axe in my hand... but no! I will whack him with my mighty shield!) but he likes it and I suppose it's more interesting than classic sword-and-board.You can't use a shield as a main hand weapon.
From prd:
shield-bash-attacks
Sometimes people allow things because they just don't know the rules are against it. There is nothing wrong with pointing things and I did not read that post as Bhrymm telling anyone they were "doing it wrong". It was more like "did you know about this".
edit:removed a period in the middle of the sentence.
Sometimes people allow things because they just don't know the rules are against it. There is nothing wrong with pointing things and. I did not read that post as Bhrymm telling anyone they were "doing it wrong". It was more like "did you know about this".By RAW you're correct but it's his game and he's obviously allowing it so why does it matter?I have a player in my current campaign who is running a specialized shield-fighter: the character is a Fighter with the TWF feat, and he uses a spiked shield as his primary weapon, with a light weapon in his off-hand. I actually didn't realize that the shield was in his primary hand at first. It seems a little silly to me (Gee, I could hit the bad guy with this perfectly serviceable axe in my hand... but no! I will whack him with my mighty shield!) but he likes it and I suppose it's more interesting than classic sword-and-board.You can't use a shield as a main hand weapon.
From prd:
shield-bash-attacks
I kinda did read it like that. I guess I'm prone to reading that as "you're doing it wrong" cause a few of the people I play with tend to rules lawyer (when they themselves are wrong) and constantly tell me I'm playing it wrong. Sorry.
You can't use a shield as a main hand weapon.
From prd:
shield-bash-attacks
So what am I missing in your reference:
Shield Bash Attacks: You can bash an opponent with a heavy shield. See “shield, heavy” on Table: Weapons for the damage dealt by a shield bash. Used this way, a heavy shield is a martial bludgeoning weapon. For the purpose of penalties on attack rolls, treat a heavy shield as a one-handed weapon. If you use your shield as a weapon, you lose its AC bonus until your next turn. An enhancement bonus on a shield does not improve the effectiveness of a shield bash made with it, but the shield can be made into a magic weapon in its own right.
Where does that say you cannot use the shield as primary?
There used to be language saying a shield's attack was an off-hand weapon because they assumed you would just use your weapon as the primary attack. It may or may not still be in the book somewhere, but it is not a rule that you have to use it in your off-hand, but the rules assume certain things when they are written.
There used to be language saying a shield's attack was an off-hand weapon because they assumed you would just use your weapon as the primary attack. It may or may not still be in the book somewhere, but it is not a rule that you have to use it in your off-hand, but the rules assume certain things when they are written.
Got it. Checked my 1st printing book and it's there. Checked the errata 1.4 and its gone:
Page 152—In the Armor Descriptions, in the Shield, Heavy; Wooden or Steel entry, in the Shield Bash Attacks section, in the first sentence, delete “using it as an off-hand weapon.” Repeat this change to the Shield, Light; Wooden or Steel entry.[/QUOTE}