What is the maximum # of rounds that should be used to cast 1 min duration self-buffs?
When players use 10 min/lvl buffs, how does the gm know when they wear off?
The first question is a value judgment and must be made on a case-by-case basis. You need to determine how long the spells last and decide how much of your magic you want to expend right then.
For the second question, the GM can tell you how much time has passed. It's up to the caster to know the duration of his/her spells and note when they wear off. Many actions have standard times for performance, such as searching, performing, and so on.
I'm not sure what you are asking in the first question. It takes just as long to cast a spell as the book says it does. The duration of the spell has nothing to do with it's casting time, and vice versa.
As far as long duration buffs, you simply ask how long in advance of the combat your players cast their spells. Alternately you can determine how long the spell is supposed to last and simply tell the players how much time passes between their various actions. When traveling, you can use the base speeds of the characters to determine how long it takes them to get from point A to point B and just tick them off. This is where DM adjudication comes into play when it comes to other actions. Just inform your players when 10 minute increments of time tick off until the duration runs out.
My first question was very poorly worded.
Rewording: How many rounds at the start of combat should a player use to cast short duration self-buffs?
I've heard from the boards that a typical adventuring day should be 4 encounters of about 4-5 rounds on average. If it takes 4 rounds for the Battle Cleric to buff himself to be useful, he's no longer useful. The rest of the party can take out the BBEG before the cleric is ready. A good scout could allow the party several rounds before the initiative roll to prep buffs, but those aren't the encounters I'm referring to.
General advice is not to buff in combat. Every round you buff is a round you're not contributing to battle. That's why you buff just prior to combat whenever possible, so your first round will consist of moving into position and/or attacking the enemy.
General advice is not to buff in combat. Every round you buff is a round you're not contributing to battle. That's why you buff just prior to combat whenever possible, so your first round will consist of moving into position and/or attacking the enemy.My first question was very poorly worded.
Rewording: How many rounds at the start of combat should a player use to cast short duration self-buffs?
I've heard from the boards that a typical adventuring day should be 4 encounters of about 4-5 rounds on average. If it takes 4 rounds for the Battle Cleric to buff himself to be useful, he's no longer useful. The rest of the party can take out the BBEG before the cleric is ready. A good scout could allow the party several rounds before the initiative roll to prep buffs, but those aren't the encounters I'm referring to.
However, if your buff is on other party member(s) then you are contributing in that round and later also. Bardsongs, Haste, Mass whatever. Self buffing however, i'd basically try to stop with 1 round.
I’m all for self-buffs in combat when it is for a specific reason related to the encounter. The number of rounds ‘acceptable’, depends on the specifics… If I had to put a hard cap on it? 3 rounds. If you need more than that, you should just flee, go down in a blaze of glory, or play dead IMO.
What I’m against is a character build that assumes spending a round (or more) self-buffing most fights. The whole action economy problem is not just an issue on the mechanical level. I find it disrespectful to the rest of the party.
Regardless of whether you are buffing to be competent or buffing to become uber, I don’t like it. The way I see it you are either not pulling your weight in combat. Which can be cool if you contribute in other ways which you cannot do if you waste your time and resources trying to be something you’re not. OR You are breaking the ‘don’t be a dick’ rule. People don’t want to ‘fight for their lives’ for a couple of rounds while you buff up. Just so you can then step in and ‘pwn’ every random encounter. It is a waste of everyone’s resources. I’m not insisting on perfect efficiency or most optimal tactics, just that you treat the other PCs like your team, not your minions.
-
Keeping track of the buffs is a judgment call based on the approximate time spent resting, traveling, searching and discussing, ect. As a GM I take note when they sneak, take 20 on skill checks, spend time debating what to do or delay in some other way once any 10min/level buffs are cast and between encounters. It is not that different than just keeping up with the time of day in game. I try to be more accurate when 1 or 10min/level buffs are involved, but still only do a rough estimate erring on the side of the players.
As a player I just keep tract of when I cast the buff and at the beginning of the encounters after that ask the GM, ‘how long since X’ and mark off the duration then or when we rest or whatever. Post-its on the front of your character sheet work for me.
However, if your buff is on other party member(s) then you are contributing in that round and later also. Bardsongs, Haste, Mass whatever. Self buffing however, i'd basically try to stop with 1 round.General advice is not to buff in combat. Every round you buff is a round you're not contributing to battle. That's why you buff just prior to combat whenever possible, so your first round will consist of moving into position and/or attacking the enemy.My first question was very poorly worded.
Rewording: How many rounds at the start of combat should a player use to cast short duration self-buffs?
I've heard from the boards that a typical adventuring day should be 4 encounters of about 4-5 rounds on average. If it takes 4 rounds for the Battle Cleric to buff himself to be useful, he's no longer useful. The rest of the party can take out the BBEG before the cleric is ready. A good scout could allow the party several rounds before the initiative roll to prep buffs, but those aren't the encounters I'm referring to.
Definitely agree here. Forgot to mention that I was talking about self-buffs.