Goblin Alchemist


Advice

Liberty's Edge

I've got a friend who's interested in a Goblin Alchemist. He normally only plays full-BAB bruisers, but he really likes the idea of playing a Goblin who hurls bombs.

Unfortunately, I don't know a whole lot about Alchemist - I know the rules, but I don't know builds or combat strategies.

5th level, standard wealth, 20 point buy; we're in an adventure path, so one trait is tied up. Advice?

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

General advice: Go pick up Advanced Feats Secrets of the Alxhemist from Open Design. Even if you don't use their feas, there's also discussion on how to build Alchemists and three sample builds, one of which is the Carpet Bomber.

For an Alchemist, you need hifh Int fpr more bombs and high Dex for better ranged atacks.

For discoveries, Precise Bombs is a must. Nothing kills fun like being caught in your zupposed ally's attack. Force Bomb is also very useful, primarily if you expect to encounter a lot of icorporeal creatures, and to it those annoying things immune to fire. Infusion is almost a rerquirement. but proably less for for a dedicated pyromaniac.

Feats I'm not sure on but anythig focusing on splash attacks or Extra Bombs/Extra Discovery can't be bad.

Make sure you have lots of vials of acid and alchemists fire (and maybe some liquid ice fr variety) as you can easiky run your bombs down.

EDIT: And go for it as it sounds like a fun idea.

Liberty's Edge

Rough build suggestion:

Str: 8 (0), Dex: 18 (5), Con: 12 (2), Int: 18 (13 + 1 from 4th level), Wis: 12 (2), Chr: 6 (-2)

That'll give him survivability and a fair amount of focus on his area of specialty. Also, manic goblins with explosives are an appropriate group to possess low Charisma. Alternately, for a less optimized, but possibly more fun approach, he could drop Wis to 8 and raise Chr to 10, making common sense not his strong suit.

Feats: Any one he likes (possibly one of these two again, or something more flavorful), Extra Bombs, Extra Discovery.

Feats aren't really a needed focus for the Alchemist, but Extra Discovery is really nice.

Discoveries: Explosive Bomb, Infusion, Precise Bombs,

That'll give him a fair focus on bombs. But honestly, Infusion is just too good not to take. Alchemist extracts are pretty cool when they use them, but notably awesome when they can use them on others.

He'll want Acid, Frost, or Shock bombs as his 6th level Discovery, since being only able to use Fire damage is...limiting. But Precise and Explosive will let him inflict some real havoc without being a detriment to the party.

Extracts:

Almost any. Alchemists have a damn good list, actually. I particularly reccomend Shield (since it's on top of your normal, fairly good, AC).

Actually, a Shield spell plus a Dex Mutagen (the only kind this character should carry) can give a +8 to AC for one fight. And that's on top of a base 19 or so. AC 27 is a nice thing to have.

Maybe grab Cat's Grace as well to help duplicate the effect without the mutagen (only to 25...but still).

Equipment: Mithril Chain Shirt (for the added Dex minimum...gotta make the most out of that Mutagen), Masterwork Light Crossbow (for when he occasionally runs out of bombs), Cloak of Resistance +1, Headband of Intellect +2, other items as he wishes. Dex boosting stuff is a possibility, but he has other ways to do that, and the Headband comes with a free skill.


i am the player considering this character, i would have to say one thing is that i wouldn't want to be an all ranged character, i would want to be able to handle melee combat.

i don't need to focus on melee and the bombs are my favorite part of the alchemist but i would probably bring my str up i would prefer to have my str and dex close to the same score.


Ogre has a nice guide to the class with various build options on his site: http://pathfinder.ogrehut.com/. I've found it to be a nice starting point.

A few misc. considerations: when focusing on bombs, the choices seem to be either the stink bomb route or the explosive route - the former tends to focus on inflicting status conditions, while the latter is more of a straight up blaster. As a secondary weapon, one can also focus on splash weapons like acid flasks - they're fairly cheap if you craft them yourself (easy to do for an alchemist), and the added damage from your intelligence modifier given from the throw anything feat is a nice touch.


You almost need point blank and precise shot as your first two feats if you're going bomb spec. Missing with the touch attacks is hard, but the possible -8 (-4 from shooting into melee, +4 to the opponents ac from the soft cover) is one of the few ways that can happen.

I don't like the smoke bombs. They're in the party's way almost as much as the enemies, and can really frustrate the other players at the table.

Damage and status effects aren't mutually exclusive. Frost bomb, explosive bomb, and force bomb can stagger, set people on fire and knock them prone.

Liberty's Edge

northbrb wrote:

i am the player considering this character, i would have to say one thing is that i wouldn't want to be an all ranged character, i would want to be able to handle melee combat.

i don't need to focus on melee and the bombs are my favorite part of the alchemist but i would probably bring my str up i would prefer to have my str and dex close to the same score.

You're a Small character with a Strength penalty and without any flat damage enhancers for melee (Sneak Attack being the classic example). You are not going to be good at melee unless you focus on it to an extreme degree to overcome those limitations (which is not what you say you want). Alchemists as a whole can be quite good at melee, but a Goblin alchemist isn't going to be unless that's pretty much all he does.

So a bomb-focused Goblin Alchemist who's actually good at melee? Not really gonna happen.

If you take Weapon Finesse you'll be able to hit, but that takes up a valuable Feat slot and, frankly, you'll be doing a d6 of damage at most, more likely a d4. Still, if you just want vague competence, I'd go with my build above, but drop Wis to 10 to raise Str to 10 and pick up Weapon Finesse (and maybe trade Extra Bombs for Point Blank Shot, Big Norse Wolf makes a point that, long-term, you're gonna want Precise Shot eventually).


northbrb wrote:

i am the player considering this character, i would have to say one thing is that i wouldn't want to be an all ranged character, i would want to be able to handle melee combat.

i don't need to focus on melee and the bombs are my favorite part of the alchemist but i would probably bring my str up i would prefer to have my str and dex close to the same score.

I am currently playing a Goblin Alchemist. On of the most fun characters I have ever played. Took a lot of insperation from the movie "Labyrinth" as well as other stories.

I went with a generalist approach. I took Weapon Fineses and focused on Dex and Int. Feral Mutagen + Dex Mutagen doesnt equal alot of damage but all three attacks hit most of the time so the damage does add up. Once I get high enough I can do a Dex/Str mutagen and that will help. Also you can take the Extract: Bull Strength.

My build is by no means optimized my goblin's abilities are pretty scattered, I even function as the party rouge.

But this is one of the funnest characters I have ever played.


Deadmanwalking wrote:

Rough build suggestion:

Str: 8 (0), Dex: 18 (5), Con: 12 (2), Int: 18 (13 + 1 from 4th level), Wis: 12 (2), Chr: 6 (-2)

Wait, aren't 8s worth -2 in the Pathfinder point buy system? *is confused*


I actually wanted to play a Goblin Bomberman as well. Just a fun character concept.

Goblins aren't overpowered, but the do get the benefit of full movement. Remember, you can always tell the player that people will at most try to kill him on sight and at the least spit in his ale.

Goblins aren't the most trusted of races probably lol.

I'd say that Goblins are closer to par with humans than half orcs racially. -2 to Strength and Charisma, +4 Dex, Darkvision 60ft, Fast:30ft movement, small race benefits.

Alchemists are pretty strong vs groups.... so make sure you throw a few Big Baddies at them once in awhile. They are also have very reliable damage because their bombs are touch attacks... so it doesn't really matter what their Dex bonus is... chances of missing = low.

Liberty's Edge

Biichama wrote:
Deadmanwalking wrote:

Rough build suggestion:

Str: 8 (0), Dex: 18 (5), Con: 12 (2), Int: 18 (13 + 1 from 4th level), Wis: 12 (2), Chr: 6 (-2)

Wait, aren't 8s worth -2 in the Pathfinder point buy system? *is confused*

The racial ability modifiers (-2 str, +4 dex, -2 cha) have already been factored in.

The suggested scores at level one without racial modifiers work out to: Str 10 (0), Dex 14 (5), Con 12 (2), Int 17 (13), Wis 12 (2), Cha 8 (-2).

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