
Scintillae |
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I've reached the point where I'm making meta-puns that I guarantee no one but me will ever notice.
Case in point: I wrote a ten-sentence quiz for active/passive voice, all related to The Little Mermaid because it's easier to write on a theme. It was only when I went to print the document that I realized I'd left the font as Arial.

Tacticslion |

Tacticslion wrote:...Uuuuuuuughh.
2:28 AM, here.
The neighbor is not being noisy - there isn’t really anything loud.
But I can feel the vibrations of that ginormous truck in my friggin’ bones. Alos inner-ear canal, and my ear tubes partially clogged with back drain. The floor is vibrating. The rhyth of the DAGGUM ENGINE.
Bzzzzt. Bzt. Bzt. Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt. Bzzzzzt. Bzt. Bzt. Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt. Bzzzzzt. Bzt. Bzt. Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt. Bzzzzzt. Bzt. Bzt.
Over and over again. I don’t know how long, but I woke up realizing the rhythm has invaded my sleep tonight for a very long time - fragments of numerous dreams disturbed or even shattered by it.
Like, there is literally nothing reasonable to get mad at them for.
“Hey, you know, you can’t actually hear any noise, but the vibrations are driving my inner ear insane. Yes, right, I understand that I’m a dozen yards away, at closest, and, as noted, I can’t actually ‘hear’ anything. But, see, the floor of my house vibratesfsintly to the rhythm of your engine cylinder. Right. Only slightly. Yeah, it’s funny, our AC makes the house shudder far, far more when it hits overdrive. Right, so an extremely slight vibration from your vehicle parked in its driveway that I can feel through the floor and in my bones has been disturbing my sleep for hours. Yeah, it’s even fainter than the electrical hum - you know the barely audible ringing sound that only exists when a place has power (or electricity is running over large cables), and you can’t even notice is most of the time? Yeah, so anyway, that thing. Do you mind... not doing whatever reasonable thing you were on your own property with your own property? Thaaaaaaaaaaaanks.”
There is nothing reasonable about such a request. The family is half “nightlife” people due to jobs in the nursing profession, anyway.
It also seems that literally no one else is bothered by this - everyone else in my house has slept through the whole thing, and my wife doesn’t make the little tale-tell faces or
Oh, man, yeah! Scents can be rough. It’s been useful being that sensitive, but sometimes it totally sucks. I can’t really sit near bars at all because I get nauseated.
Of course for whatever reason I’ve habituated to some scents and not to others - tuna bothers the daylights out of my wife, but I like it, so... I’unno.

NobodysHome |
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But this morning I was reading a very simple investigative report; there weren't any opinions, just, "And on this date these items were ordered," and so forth.
And someone vehemently, honestly believed it was "fake news"; that the facts presented weren't actual facts, but things made up to make the subject of the article look bad as part of a political agenda.
GothBard put it really well: It must be wonderful when any fact you don't like is "fake news".
But for me, it's beyond my comprehension: How can you possibly just dismiss anything you don't like as "fake"?
Just... mind-boggling.
(And yes, I've read up on the psychology behind the phenomenon, but I'm a 50+-year-old white male; I should be one of the least open-minded creatures on the planet. Yet I consider myself better than such people in accepting news I may not care for.)

Tacticslion |

Tacticslion wrote:...Uuuuuuuughh.
2:28 AM, here.
The neighbor is not being noisy - there isn’t really anything loud.
But I can feel the vibrations of that ginormous truck in my friggin’ bones. Alos inner-ear canal, and my ear tubes partially clogged with back drain. The floor is vibrating. The rhyth of the DAGGUM ENGINE.
Bzzzzt. Bzt. Bzt. Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt. Bzzzzzt. Bzt. Bzt. Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt. Bzzzzzt. Bzt. Bzt. Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzt. Bzzzzzt. Bzt. Bzt.
Over and over again. I don’t know how long, but I woke up realizing the rhythm has invaded my sleep tonight for a very long time - fragments of numerous dreams disturbed or even shattered by it.
Like, there is literally nothing reasonable to get mad at them for.
“Hey, you know, you can’t actually hear any noise, but the vibrations are driving my inner ear insane. Yes, right, I understand that I’m a dozen yards away, at closest, and, as noted, I can’t actually ‘hear’ anything. But, see, the floor of my house vibratesfsintly to the rhythm of your engine cylinder. Right. Only slightly. Yeah, it’s funny, our AC makes the house shudder far, far more when it hits overdrive. Right, so an extremely slight vibration from your vehicle parked in its driveway that I can feel through the floor and in my bones has been disturbing my sleep for hours. Yeah, it’s even fainter than the electrical hum - you know the barely audible ringing sound that only exists when a place has power (or electricity is running over large cables), and you can’t even notice is most of the time? Yeah, so anyway, that thing. Do you mind... not doing whatever reasonable thing you were on your own property with your own property? Thaaaaaaaaaaaanks.”
There is nothing reasonable about such a request. The family is half “nightlife” people due to jobs in the nursing profession, anyway.
It also seems that literally no one else is bothered by this - everyone else in my house has slept through the whole thing, and my wife doesn’t make the little tale-tell faces or
It always makes me happy when someone else can hear it. My family mostly thinks I’m nuts or just “hearing things” - I’ve gotten used to it, but the puns of a tv on without anyone on it just.... aaaaagggghhhh.
I’m sorry you also have to suffer, but it’s nice to know that others can in fact hear it!

Tacticslion |
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Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
If I lay flat on my back, and suck in as much air as I can, and hold my breath, I can usually float juuuuust high enough that my nose and eyes (a little closer to my eyes than mid-temple) are out of the water, but a straight line below is under the water line. If I leave my back uncomfortably arched, I can actually breathe, and you can watch my body bob up and down each time I do so, though after a short time, the bob becomes so intense that I go below the water line anyway.
My father is about the same. It was a joke for a long time.
My wife floats rather well, like you, but our Eldest seems to have taken more lessons from me in that regard.

Freehold DM |
2 people marked this as a favorite. |

Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
despite stereotypes, I love to swim.

NobodysHome |
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Woran wrote:despite stereotypes, I love to swim.Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
Er... there's a stereotype about swimming?!?!?!
I can't even imagine...

Vanykrye |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |

Freehold DM wrote:Woran wrote:despite stereotypes, I love to swim.Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
Er... there's a stereotype about swimming?!?!?!
I can't even imagine...
Yeah, the stereotype is that blacks can't swim. I have no idea how that one came about.

Scintillae |
2 people marked this as a favorite. |

NobodysHome wrote:Yeah, the stereotype is that blacks can't swim. I have no idea how that one came about.Freehold DM wrote:Woran wrote:despite stereotypes, I love to swim.Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
Er... there's a stereotype about swimming?!?!?!
I can't even imagine...
My cynicism wants to blame segregated pools and beaches.

Vanykrye |
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Vanykrye wrote:My cynicism wants to blame segregated pools and beaches.NobodysHome wrote:Yeah, the stereotype is that blacks can't swim. I have no idea how that one came about.Freehold DM wrote:Woran wrote:despite stereotypes, I love to swim.Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
Er... there's a stereotype about swimming?!?!?!
I can't even imagine...
Mine wants to blame "blacks are poor and live on the streets of large cities where there are no places to swim" lines of thinking.

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It always makes me happy when someone else can hear it. My family mostly thinks I’m nuts or just “hearing things” - I’ve gotten used to it, but the puns of a tv on without anyone on it just.... aaaaagggghhhh.
I’m sorry you also have to suffer, but it’s nice to know that others can in fact hear it!
Old TVs are the worst!
That high pitched whine is just... ugh.

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Woran wrote:Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
If I lay flat on my back, and suck in as much air as I can, and hold my breath, I can usually float juuuuust high enough that my nose and eyes (a little closer to my eyes than mid-temple) are out of the water, but a straight line below is under the water line. If I leave my back uncomfortably arched, I can actually breathe, and you can watch my body bob up and down each time I do so, though after a short time, the bob becomes so intense that I go below the water line anyway.
My father is about the same. It was a joke for a long time.
My wife floats rather well, like you, but our Eldest seems to have taken more lessons from me in that regard.
Super weird. I can just lay flat on my back and have my face and belly (and boobs) stick out. No effort. I just need to relax my body in a certain way.

Vanykrye |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |

Tacticslion wrote:It always makes me happy when someone else can hear it. My family mostly thinks I’m nuts or just “hearing things” - I’ve gotten used to it, but the puns of a tv on without anyone on it just.... aaaaagggghhhh.
I’m sorry you also have to suffer, but it’s nice to know that others can in fact hear it!
Old TVs are the worst!
That high pitched whine is just... ugh.
I need you to come by my office. I used to have a person that constantly complained about a high pitched whine coming from a digital VOIP phone (with PoE). I never heard it. Ever. I need more data points.

Freehold DM |
2 people marked this as a favorite. |

Tacticslion wrote:Super weird. I can just lay flat on my back and have my face and belly (and boobs) stick out. No effort. I just need to relax my body in a certain way.Woran wrote:Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
If I lay flat on my back, and suck in as much air as I can, and hold my breath, I can usually float juuuuust high enough that my nose and eyes (a little closer to my eyes than mid-temple) are out of the water, but a straight line below is under the water line. If I leave my back uncomfortably arched, I can actually breathe, and you can watch my body bob up and down each time I do so, though after a short time, the bob becomes so intense that I go below the water line anyway.
My father is about the same. It was a joke for a long time.
My wife floats rather well, like you, but our Eldest seems to have taken more lessons from me in that regard.
attaches underwater parts to bike, cycles to woran

NobodysHome |
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NobodysHome wrote:oh it's there. Very popular among surfers and people in the navy, in my experience. But these are strange groups.Well, the good news is it never even made it to the West Coast. I've never heard that one. Ever.
Yeah... two groups that punk rockers ALWAYS hung out with...

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Scintillae wrote:Mine wants to blame "blacks are poor and live on the streets of large cities where there are no places to swim" lines of thinking.Vanykrye wrote:My cynicism wants to blame segregated pools and beaches.NobodysHome wrote:Yeah, the stereotype is that blacks can't swim. I have no idea how that one came about.Freehold DM wrote:Woran wrote:despite stereotypes, I love to swim.Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
Er... there's a stereotype about swimming?!?!?!
I can't even imagine...
Over here the stereotype is just that Americans in general cant swim.

NobodysHome |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |

Tacticslion wrote:Super weird. I can just lay flat on my back and have my face and belly (and boobs) stick out. No effort. I just need to relax my body in a certain way.Woran wrote:Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
If I lay flat on my back, and suck in as much air as I can, and hold my breath, I can usually float juuuuust high enough that my nose and eyes (a little closer to my eyes than mid-temple) are out of the water, but a straight line below is under the water line. If I leave my back uncomfortably arched, I can actually breathe, and you can watch my body bob up and down each time I do so, though after a short time, the bob becomes so intense that I go below the water line anyway.
My father is about the same. It was a joke for a long time.
My wife floats rather well, like you, but our Eldest seems to have taken more lessons from me in that regard.
Women have, er, "natural flotation devices" that work wonders... in many ways...

Freehold DM |
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Woran wrote:I need you to come by my office. I used to have a person that constantly complained about a high pitched whine coming from a digital VOIP phone (with PoE). I never heard it. Ever. I need more data points.Tacticslion wrote:It always makes me happy when someone else can hear it. My family mostly thinks I’m nuts or just “hearing things” - I’ve gotten used to it, but the puns of a tv on without anyone on it just.... aaaaagggghhhh.
I’m sorry you also have to suffer, but it’s nice to know that others can in fact hear it!
Old TVs are the worst!
That high pitched whine is just... ugh.
I hear it on rare occasion.

A. Ziraphale |
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Woran wrote:Now check for a guest named Aziraphale. If they were both at the same time, prepare for apocalypse.gran rey de los mono wrote:Actually, it appears that we have had guests named Crowley 16 other times in the past few years.Dun dun duuuuuuuuuuuun
Vile slander! I have been to many places, and the world has never yet ended. Harumph!

NobodysHome |
4 people marked this as a favorite. |

*SIGH*
It really is inevitable.
I'm at work. Someone doing a presentation for us lists themselves as, "So-and-so, Ph.D."
I prepare for 5-10 minutes of useful information in a 90-minute borefest.
There's just something about people who insist on putting the Ph.D. after their names even when it's totally irrelevant to what they're doing now.

Tacticslion |

Well, the good news is it never even made it to the West Coast. I've never heard that one. Ever.
I've never heard it, either, and I've lived in various parts of the South East most of my life (with a notable stint in Eastern Europe).
Believe it or not, I actually love pools. I just can't float.

Tacticslion |

Tacticslion wrote:It always makes me happy when someone else can hear it. My family mostly thinks I’m nuts or just “hearing things” - I’ve gotten used to it, but the puns of a tv on without anyone on it just.... aaaaagggghhhh.
I’m sorry you also have to suffer, but it’s nice to know that others can in fact hear it!
Old TVs are the worst!
(EDIT: And the fuzz-crack static just crawls up my neck and hair. Eruff.)
That high pitched whine is just... ugh.
Indeed!
Tacticslion wrote:Super weird. I can just lay flat on my back and have my face and belly (and boobs) stick out. No effort. I just need to relax my body in a certain way.Woran wrote:Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
If I lay flat on my back, and suck in as much air as I can, and hold my breath, I can usually float juuuuust high enough that my nose and eyes (a little closer to my eyes than mid-temple) are out of the water, but a straight line below is under the water line. If I leave my back uncomfortably arched, I can actually breathe, and you can watch my body bob up and down each time I do so, though after a short time, the bob becomes so intense that I go below the water line anyway.
My father is about the same. It was a joke for a long time.
My wife floats rather well, like you, but our Eldest seems to have taken more lessons from me in that regard.
Yeah, that sounds much like my wife. Dad, I, and Eldest are just weird, I suppose!

Tacticslion |
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I need you to come by my office. I used to have a person that constantly complained about a high pitched whine coming from a digital VOIP phone (with PoE). I never heard it. Ever. I need more data points.
I don't know what a VOIP phone (with PoE) is, in specific, but there are a number of techs that make more or less noticeable whines. It really depends on a bunch of things, but it's related to various electric forces, and I've found that people who notice it tend to notice different things.
Over here the stereotype is just that Americans in general cant swim.
Hey! I beat several of my less-flotation-challenged-fellows when I swam in Europe! I had my PADI certification! I lead snorkel groups in the Bahamas!
And my wife was on the swim team and can rather own me in a pool!
Dang it, Euroooooooooooooooooooooooooope~!
*shakes fist*
EDIT: I haaaaaad to add more self-justification. It wasn't funny enough with just the two. Also the yelling and fist shaking. That just makes it better, I think.

Vanykrye |
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Vanykrye wrote:I need you to come by my office. I used to have a person that constantly complained about a high pitched whine coming from a digital VOIP phone (with PoE). I never heard it. Ever. I need more data points.I don't know what a VOIP phone (with PoE) is, in specific...
Voice Over IP
Power over EthernetThere's no dedicated power line coming from the wall, and there are no analog phone lines like days of old. The only thing these phones have is a network cable going into them, with an LCD display. It's effectively nothing more than a computer circuit board with a handset attached.

Drejk |
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Tacticslion wrote:Super weird. I can just lay flat on my back and have my face and belly (and boobs) stick out. No effort. I just need to relax my body in a certain way.Woran wrote:Tacticslion wrote:Interesting. I float with no effort at all.
Steven King memes aside, I suppose I should clarify, as editing doesn’t seem o be allowed me right now... the “we” in “We just sink.” is mooooostly my father and I. Though my Eldest seems to have a tendency to do so as well.
If I lay flat on my back, and suck in as much air as I can, and hold my breath, I can usually float juuuuust high enough that my nose and eyes (a little closer to my eyes than mid-temple) are out of the water, but a straight line below is under the water line. If I leave my back uncomfortably arched, I can actually breathe, and you can watch my body bob up and down each time I do so, though after a short time, the bob becomes so intense that I go below the water line anyway.
My father is about the same. It was a joke for a long time.
My wife floats rather well, like you, but our Eldest seems to have taken more lessons from me in that regard.
I could do that as a child. I couldn't do that anymore as a teenager. I haven't swum for the last 20 years so I can't really tell how my body would behave in water now.

Drejk |
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*SIGH*
It really is inevitable.
I'm at work. Someone doing a presentation for us lists themselves as, "So-and-so, Ph.D."
I prepare for 5-10 minutes of useful information in a 90-minute borefest.
There's just something about people who insist on putting the Ph.D. after their names even when it's totally irrelevant to what they're doing now.
It reminds me of a RPG meeting two or three years ago...
Some guy was spouting quite a bullcrap (it looked as if he was obsessed with GM duty being "punishing" players for whatever they do, as it was his answer to dealing with whatever issues at table as mentioned during the discussion, including not doing things that GM wants them to so it clearly ventured into rather toxic direction). He argued that he knows what he is speaking of, because he is "experienced" role-player with over ten (or maybe fifteen, I don't remember at the moment) years of practice. Me and my friends looked at each other, and laughed about him being just out of being a rpg novice, having, between us, around 100 years of experience, with 20+ per head.
And I still consider myself at mid-level as a roleplayer (ok, I admit claiming some bonuses for being published freelancer) - having worked professionally with people who actually play as long as I live gives me a different perspective.

Tacticslion |

Tacticslion wrote:Vanykrye wrote:I need you to come by my office. I used to have a person that constantly complained about a high pitched whine coming from a digital VOIP phone (with PoE). I never heard it. Ever. I need more data points.I don't know what a VOIP phone (with PoE) is, in specific...Voice Over IP
Power over EthernetThere's no dedicated power line coming from the wall, and there are no analog phone lines like days of old. The only thing these phones have is a network cable going into them, with an LCD display. It's effectively nothing more than a computer circuit board with a handset attached.
Oh, yeah, those things. They can make that sound. I don't always notice, though, because they're usually near computers and that's plenty of humming-whine anyway.

Limeylongears |
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I'm listening to what claims to be a compilation of 60/70s Japanese 'erotic music'
I've got to say, the combination of twangy Shadows style guitar, 1001 Strings and some warbly lady doesn't get me particularly hot & bothered, but takes all sorts, &c.

captain yesterday |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |

So, as you can imagine I am a bit of a trap connoisseur in Fortnite Save the World.
What is my favorite 3 trap combo you ask?
Broadside (cannons)
Soundwall (blasts disco music, forcing zombies to dance)
Tar pit (a tar pit).
So, they dance into the tar pit and are still dancing when they get obliterated by cannonballs at close range, and if they somehow survive that the cannonballs ignite the tar.

Drejk |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |

I'm listening to what claims to be a compilation of 60/70s Japanese 'erotic music'
I've got to say, the combination of twangy Shadows style guitar, 1001 Strings and some warbly lady doesn't get me particularly hot & bothered, but takes all sorts, &c.
You are not sixties enough.

Freehold DM |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |

I'm listening to what claims to be a compilation of 60/70s Japanese 'erotic music'
I've got to say, the combination of twangy Shadows style guitar, 1001 Strings and some warbly lady doesn't get me particularly hot & bothered, but takes all sorts, &c.
i have a new ringtone.

Ambrosia Slaad |
10 people marked this as a favorite. |

Thanks all for the hugs, everyone. :)
We went through several doctors who were lazy, malcompetant, and/or dumb and largely unconcerned with her continuing deterioration until we found a local ALS specialist... who confirmed it wasn't ALS. He referred us to a neurosurgeon who was pretty certain her spinal stenosis was the root cause. Unlike the other docs, he moved quickly and competently with tests & follow-ups, and got her scheduled for the surgery yesterday.
She went into surgery just before noon and was in there for almost three hours, which was over an hour longer than was expected. Doc came out afterward and said the compression/narrowing on her spinal nerves was even worse than the scans showed. And there was also a bone spur to remove. He said it took so long because her bones were like "reinforced concrete" and took much longer to saw through than anticipated. He said this is likely why other than the fractured wrist why she didn't break any of her bones from those falls.
She was recovering well last night, and they had her sitting up in bed today. Not feeling any pain or discomfort yet. She recover there through Sunday, then Monday (assuming she continues progressing) they'll move her into the physical therapy wing. She'll be there for two weeks (the limit her HMO will pay for) scheduled for 3 hours of physical therapy a day. Which... no offense to Mom, but she's a very emotionally-manipulative patient, and I'm glad they're the ones who are going to make her do the therapy and it isn't me (or Dad). But she's got to put in the painful, exhausting work to claw back every bit of ground she can get back. I'm mentally putting together a "This is your miracle; don't waste it/don't disrespect God" speech to appeal to her deep Catholic guilt.
Got to sleep in an extra hour and a half this morning, which felt physically fantastic but not nearly enough. Dad and I are both exhausted physically and emotionally, and I hope we're ready when she is released to come home again.
Edit: So drink your milk and take a daily calcium citrate + vitamin D3 supplement to make your bones like reinforced concrete.

Tacticslion |

More Amby hugs!
I’m sorry to hear of the difficulties, but I’m grateful for the good news of her bone strength! That seriously is a blessing in old age, even if it’s a pain.
Appealing to Catholic guilt is good - see if you can work in a Saint’s life story or perhaps add in the cautionary tale of, I wanna say, King Josiah’s fall after his miracle (and the subsequent removal of his status as king), or some similar Biblical reference.
(And if she gives you grief about Paul’s “what good is buffeting the air?” feel free to point right back that Moses made the Israelites swallow bitter water, Jesus made lepers go wash and/or show the priests and obey the law and the woman was only healed after she had visited doctors and followed their advice before coming to Him and the blond man who could now see needed to get a job after becoming sighted. Miracles come with stuff you gotta work put attached, and though that cost might be small or large (varying by miracle) you’re expected to do your part. Or something I’unno, you’ll know what works better.)