First, who am I?
I GM;
Smerg's Star Wars over 1000 game posts
Smerg's Dresden Files over 400 game posts
I started the Star Wars in September and Dresden Files in October.
I also play in a couple of other games that you can find by checking my Aliases.
I am familiar with many systems as I have used dozens over the years (over 30 years of gaming as player and GM).
If you choose to play then you are choosing to play with someone who will keep posting and playing as long as the players keep posting and playing.
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Second, the concept pitch;
Different travelers stop at (Manor, Abbey, Sea side resort) for the night. A couple hours after sunset, you are awoken by dogs barking. You look out your window to see a couple of people at the gate to the compound below.
The dogs handler is shooing the dogs away and looking to see what the people at the gate when you see him suddenly pull back with blood spraying.
A caretaker and a cook rush forward to tend to the wounded kennel keeper. You can see them giving first aid but it doesn't appear to be in time. The people gathered around start to wail and the dogs sniff around whining at the lost of their master.
The cook just holds the limp form of the dog handler while the caretaker shouts loudly at the people who still stand at the gate. Several more people emerge from the buildings to see what is the commotion and what has happened to the dog's handler.
Suddenly, the dogs start to pull away from their master barking and before the cook can realize it the limp form in her arms suddenly lunges forward to bite her. You see her scream as the dog handler chews into her throat.
People rush forward to separate the pair and soon others are screaming and complaining of various bites.
Welcome to the Apocalypse. How do you survive?
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This is the initial pitch but I am quite comfortable with designing the game around the players. If players want a modern Zombie horror then I am good with that too.
I will adjust and finalize the scenario around the players.
Generally, the starting location will be a place where there are plenty of people to turn into zombies and players will start out without much in the way of weapons. Players will have plenty of opportunities to find and convert common items to weapons until they get better equipped.
Influences for story will be movies like Resident Evil & 28 Days Later, games like Steve Jackson's Zombies, and anime like High School of the Dead.
Players will be at the start of the Apocalypes with the wave of people turning into Zombies. The first goal will be to get to a place they can survive. Later goals may to find a cure or to set up a colony of people that aren't infected.
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Rule system
I would like to use a d20 system. I have access to several but the system will likely be a 'hack' as I don't feel that a straight system like d20 Modern would give the right 'feel'.
I like Star Wars SAGA Edition rules but I'm not sure how comfortable people are with this system. The starting hit points are 'higher' in this system then I would like for the proper feel of 'fear' for zombies that often do 1d6 slam attacks. Players will start with more then the hit points of a 1st level DnD/Pathfinder character.
I like how Pathfinder cleaned up some of the d20 rules and gave things like CMB and CMD to simplify grapple checks (important in Zombie horror). I also prefer the Pathfinder AoO rules more then the Star Wars SAGA edition rules.
Player hit points will represent 'bruising' type of damage until the players get down to 10 hp or less at which point there will be a chance to catch 'Zombie disease'. This catching 'Zombie disease' is a pretty much a staple of the fiction with people often saying they're fine when they are beginning to change.
I am willing to work with people interested in play because I know some people would like to try out the new Ninja, Samurai, and Gunslinger classes for Pathfinder.
If you have some thoughts on system then I am willing to listen and work with the players.
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What I need is to get a group of five or six people interested in Zombie horror and giving me their input on what they want for system and setting (in FIASCO this would be the selection of Playset).
When I have enough people then I'll move this to a OOC post thread to create/finish making characters.
As I promised, here I am.
Obviously, I favor a modern setting and a mash-up/hack system does interest me, but if that turns others off I don't have a problem with more a more fantasy/standard Pathfinder game.
I actually really like the mechanic of zombie-ism not being catching until a certain HP. Still there, but not quite as gritty as straight-up having a chance to catch it whenever you come in contact with whatever. As far as HP values go, I wouldn't mind slightly high and going the game-y 'there's super, more-dangerous zombies around'. I also had a reason for stating this that I forgot, but I recall some homebrew zombies that had a bonus for attacking en-masse. That makes the 'normal' type appropriately scarier in mob form than alone.
I would think d20 Modern would work alright so long as expectations were managed, but you likely have more experience than I do so I'll leave that to you. I'll have to ruminate on hacking together SAGA and Pathfinder, but I do like the idea.
I am interested also, but put all others before me in priority. If you need me I am here though. Also, Sounds interesting, I would prefer more modern also.
Four recruits already, that is Awesome.
I'll pitch out a few Zombie Settings to get your feedback though add in any that you like too. Basically, this will determine where you were and what you were doing when the Zombie Apocalypse started.
1> War Zombies. You are soldiers in a War. Games like Wierd Wars II did WWII and Deadlands did Civil War. Delta Green has done things like Afghanistan and movies like Dead Snow have had Zombie Nazis. Personally, starting out with machine-guns when the Zombie Apocalypse starts seems to me to be a bit of a by-pass to the horror. Still, it is an option.
2> Zombies on a Plane. This is like Snakes on a Plane but all those people in back of the plane are hoping to get upgrades to First Class. A failure on this type of scenario doesn't leave many options for running and if the pilot and co-pilot turn to Zombies then you might not be making it out alive. A very do or die scenario.
3> Zombies at Sea. A big luxury cruise ship has plenty of people to turn to zombies. If you are in big sea or ocean then there is also not very far to run. Not as lethal as Zombies on a Plane but still highly dangerous and if you get off the ship then you can never be fully sure on what Zombie infected coast that you might wash up on to.
4> Zombie high school. You were all high school students when things went bad. You might consider tossing the Chemistry Text but as a first weapon it might be the thing that saves you from the zit faced freshmen chewing on your arm. Plenty of shops, chemistry labs, and athletic gear to arm yourself before heading out into the wider city. There are also plenty of people with good athletic skills to keep running when needed.
5> Zombie Lab. Scientists in a lab when something goes wrong. None of you are likely cleared for knowing what is really going on and if you are cleared for that information then you know what will happen if you tell anyone. Usually there is a count down on this scenario as you have only so long before someone tries to 'thermally contain' the problem. [ed: hmmm...I should trademark 'thermal containment']
6> Suburbia Zombies. You wake up one morning to sounds of screaming and crashing of vehicles. You look out the window and see people screaming, sirens going off and you realize that you got out of the wrong side of bed. It looks like breakfast is going to start with a side of you.
7> Zombie Tiki. Somehow you and a group of friends found an object and during a ceremony or party have incurred a curse upon you and the surrounding city. Dead are crawling up out of the graves and it won't end until you're dead.
8> Zombie Base. This is a bit like War Zombies but you start as regular soldiers on a base when the Zombie plague begins. This can be further refined if the base is somewhere isolated like an Arctic location or small island base.
9> Zombie Vacation. You were at a resort when the Zombie plague broke out. You now find yourself with waiters that won't leave without a tip and cocktails made a bit too bloody.
Anyways, choose something that you like and I'll put it together.
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Four recruits already, that is Awesome.
I'll pitch out a few Zombie Settings to get your feedback though add in any that you like too. Basically, this will determine where you were and what you were doing when the Zombie Apocalypse started.
1> War Zombies. You are soldiers in a War. Games like Wierd Wars II did WWII and Deadlands did Civil War. Delta Green has done things like Afghanistan and movies like Dead Snow have had Zombie Nazis. Personally, starting out with machine-guns when the Zombie Apocalypse starts seems to me to be a bit of a by-pass to the horror. Still, it is an option.
2> Zombies on a Plane. This is like Snakes on a Plane but all those people in back of the plane are hoping to get upgrades to First Class. A failure on this type of scenario doesn't leave many options for running and if the pilot and co-pilot turn to Zombies then you might not be making it out alive. A very do or die scenario.
3> Zombies at Sea. A big luxury cruise ship has plenty of people to turn to zombies. If you are in big sea or ocean then there is also not very far to run. Not as lethal as Zombies on a Plane but still highly dangerous and if you get off the ship then you can never be fully sure on what Zombie infected coast that you might wash up on to.
4> Zombie high school. You were all high school students when things went bad. You might consider tossing the Chemistry Text but as a first weapon it might be the thing that saves you from the zit faced freshmen chewing on your arm. Plenty of shops, chemistry labs, and athletic gear to arm yourself before heading out into the wider city. There are also plenty of people with good athletic skills to keep running when needed.
5> Zombie Lab. Scientists in a lab when something goes wrong. None of you are likely cleared for knowing what is really going on and if you are cleared for that information then you know what will happen if you tell anyone. Usually there is a count down on this scenario as you have only so long before someone tries...
Oooh! I vote for Zombie High School!
Ooh, choices. I'm giving feedback on all of them just so you know where I stand in general with each idea. If you need a straight up vote, let's call it Suburbia Zombies.
My top two are Suburbia and Tiki (Tiki actually reminds me of the original Evil Dead but that's probably because that's the last 'zombie' movie I watched). I prefer something a bit more open-ended rather than a point-defense or being 'stuck' somewhere (though almost all of these would work smashingly as intro scenarios to a bigger open-ended game).
Zombies at Sea is a runner up - a ship gives you plenty of hidey-holes and an area to explore without being quite so open ended. This just seems neat overall.
Zombie Lab is a good one, though not to burst your bubble, I think The Walking Dead (the AMC TV series) might have used the term thermal containment. :)
Almost everything else is in the 'OK sure' category in that I wouldn't mind it (military is a different feel, but not necessarily a bad one, especially if you play up the isolation).
I have to say that Zombies on a Plane is the only one that just doesn't jibe with me. It might work as some sort of introductory scenario (manage to get the plane landed, and oh what's that shambling up the runway!?), though, I guess.
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All that said, my core desire is for things to be fairly open, with multiple paths to our goals. I also like the idea of each character coming into the game with a defined goal of some sort. A big influence on my thinking is Kruelaid's Z-Day game (which I think a couple of our recruits might recognize, hehe).
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Ruleset.
I am familiar with and have access to the rules for D&D 3.5, Pathfinder and d20 Modern (well, only the SRD for d20 Modern, but I can get by with that). I am not familiar with any edition of Star Wars, but I’m sure if someone can explain the pertinent details to me I can pick it up.
Setting.
I was playing in a d20 Modern zombie apocalypse pbp (the afore mentioned Z-Day) that appears to be on permanent hiatus. As such, I wouldn’t mind doing a fantasy zombie thing as a point of difference (as per your original premise), rather than modern zombie thing, but either is ok really.
Scenario.
If going ‘fantasy’ I like War Zombies, Suburbia Zombies (or Big City Zombies), Zombie Tiki, Zombie Base, or Zombie Vacation (or Zombie Tavern or Zombie Abbey or whatever).
If going modern I like Zombies at Sea, Zombie High School (or Zombie University), Suburbia Zombies (or Big City Zombies), Zombie Tiki or Zombie Vacation.
Zombie Suburbia (or City) are probably the most open ended, long term options, although many of the others (high school, tiki, even base, vacation or sea) could morph into this scenario if everyone chose it.
Characters.
Another thing we should probably decide on is what type of characters? Highly trained professionals (soldiers, cops, adventurers etc), every day Joes (high school students, office workers, peasants etc), or somewhere in between (‘ordinary’ people who just happen to have various skills that will come in mighty handy during a zombie invasion, with perhaps a few professionals thrown in).
To some extent the choice of scenario may determine this, but others are not so clear cut.
are divine casters allowed?
i was thinking of a miko apprentice (Oracle of Lore) who basically serves as a walking encyclopedia and has basic healing ability. in addition to being fairly excellent at cooking/cleaning. but does not have the ability to blast hordes of zombies with a single burst of radiant light. i don't even think oracles of lore can channel energy at all.
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are divine casters allowed?
i was thinking of a miko apprentice (Oracle of Lore) who basically serves as a walking encyclopedia and has basic healing ability. in addition to being fairly excellent at cooking/cleaning. but does not have the ability to blast hordes of zombies with a single burst of radiant light. i don't even think oracles of lore can channel energy at all.
Although the comment is not duplicated in this thread, in the original discussion Smerg specified no divine casters and no magical healing.
I’d say it probably depends on what setting and scenario we end up going with. In a ‘realistic’ (apart from the hordes of the hungry dead) modern setting or even a gritty fantasy setting there’s not likely to be any divine casters. If we go with the fantasy equivalent of War Zombies I could see an argument for allowing divine casters (god bombs being the fantasy equivalent of a hand grenade).
It looks like ideas gaining traction are the Zombie Suburbia, Zombie High School, and Zombie Tiki.
And generally, I would not favour Divine casters for a Zombie Apocalypse game but I agree if the game were more a Zombie War in a Fantasy setting then it would possibly exist.
All good points Mothman.
I do agree character choice and development should follow the setting. Ideas like a Zombies at Sea have more ability to include a wider variety of character backgrounds under the universal umbrella of they were all taking a cruise. An idea like High School can have variety but the characters will mostly be students. Zombie Suburbia has some limitations on character choice as you will generally only find certain types of people with jobs to support living in such a neighborhood.
ZebulonXenos, I agree the players should start with a goal or find a goal for themselves. When you have a world spanning problem, you have to limit the focus to something manageable and more than just survive. A just survive scenario quickly boils down to a bunker of waiting for the next thing to 'knock' on the doors.
In the debate of Modern verses Fantasy, I'm fine with running either version. Fantasy can include Steampunk like in Deadlands. The only thing that I would balk at is Sci-Fi (not because Zombies in space is not a genre of Zombies but I just don't see myself enjoying wacking Zombies with lasers and fusion grenades).
In most versions of Zombie Apocalypse if it was a Modern setting then I would likely have a rule for failing technology as the days of the apocalypse continue. Various systems in society will start to fail like Cell phone towers and gasoline supplies making the usage of such systems or items dependent on those systems more of a 'chore' with each day.
I'm not sure if your still trying to figure out what system to use but the last Zombie game I played in(It was a modern setting that the DM allowed for basically any logical background) We used the World of Darkness system and it seemed to work out pretty well for us. Just putting that out there.
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I could certainly be tempted by this :-)
If you went with a Modern setting, I like the idea of the 'Zombies at Sea' plan, as it will definitely support a wide variety of character types. Failing that, I could also get behind the 'Zombie Vacation', 'Zombie Base', or 'Zombie High School/University' (the University option would again provide a wide variety of character options).
As for a rules set, I am at least somewhat familiar with D20 Modern, but I have no background at all with WoD :-/
I always fancied the idea of a modern zombie game with the starting premise that the players are in the same tube car travelling the central line in London. The train halts and after an initial message the radio goes silent. The players must make their way to the surface and boy several of the other passengers seem to be coughing quite a lot.
The players emerge into the middle of one of the largest cities on earth with no weapons and no gunshops for miles.
You might also want to look at the All Flesh Must be Eaten system as its designed specifically for zombie games.
Okay, so we have enough people that are interested in play that the idea is a definite -- GO!
People have majority voted that they would like Modern setting. Maybe, at some point, I can do an 'Ashe' in King Arthur's Court at some point to put some fantasy in the game at a later point.
Rules, it seems people are most familiar with d20 Modern. I'll use that as the starting point for the 'Zombie Apocalypse Hack' while incorporating some of the Star Wars SAGA Edition (SWSE) rules.
Why incorporate SWSE rules? In my opinion, SWSE has better talent trees then d20 Modern that are better built for fast encounters, SWSE has a better way of implementing the skill system, and SWSE has a better multi-class system.
Dan E, I looked at 'All Flesh Must Be Eaten' but it uses the point buy Unisystem which I am not a fan of.
I'll some more later on today.
The only thing that I would balk at is Sci-Fi (not because Zombies in space is not a genre of Zombies but I just don't see myself enjoying wacking Zombies with lasers and fusion grenades).
Doom RPG! That actually gives me a few ideas for a one-off (miners unleash something terribly dead; converting mining lasers to weapons; sealing it off with explosives). But I digress.
I actually liked AFMBE, but d20 Modern is definitely a better starting point. I agree with your analysis of the SAGA stuff and I'm interested as to how it'll be hashed together.
Zombies at Sea is actually starting to grow on me - just land the liner in some port town (big, little, whatever) once that scenario's done and the adventure continues. But I'll quit talking and let it congeal for you.
Okay, let's go with Zombies at Sea. We'll use a cruise ship as the starting point for the Apocalypse and that will give several options for how you 'land' the ship. I'll look and see what I can find this weekend as the basis for maps and such for a cruise ship. I'll try to get some dimensions from which any other plans can be developed.
Players will have to come up with a reason for being on the ship. Vacation is the most common but the ship will have a variety of crew, entertainers, shopping clerks, casino dealers, athletics coaches, instructors, kitchen staff, and other such personalities.
Do people want a 'theme cruise' like a Disney cruise, Halloween Cruise, or a Sci-Fi cruise?
What part of the world would you like your cruise ship to be in? Would you like an Alaskan cruise, Caribbean Cruise, Mediterranean Cruise, Indian Ocean Cruise, Hawaiian Cruise, or other?
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Character Generation will be using a 15 buy Pathfinder Standard Fantasy point purchase or you can roll 3d6. The aim is for 'average' people.
Language: I'm going to suggest that everyone choose English as one of their languages. This will give everyone a 'common' language. The majority of the crew will speak English though there may be some that work in parts of the kitchen, cleaning staff, or machinery that do not speak English. If you choose to not have English then it will be up to the player to work around the bluff and sense motive checks to communicate.
Race: Everyone is human and gets +1 Trained Skill and +1 Feat.
I'm using from SWSE the four classes of Noble, Scoundrel, Scout, and Soldier.
I found this hack of the SWSE system that lists the four classes.
Nobles have talents that help co-ordinate people and have 6+Int in Trained skills.
Scoundrels have talents that help with trickery and have 4+Int in Trained skills.
Scouts have talents that help with survival and awareness and have 5+Int in Trained skills.
Soldiers have talents that help with combat and have 3+Int in Trained skills.
Only certain classes can learn certain skills as 'Trained'.
Unlike in d20 Modern, SWSE does not use skill points to purchase skills. At first level in SWSE you pick the skills that you are 'Trained' in using which gives you a +5 modifier to rolls with that skill. Attribute bonuses apply to all skills.
All characters can use all skills but some 'functions' of skills require you to be 'Trained' in the skill to use. All characters can 'Use Computer' skill but only someone 'Trained' in Use Computer can hack a computer to improve their system access.
Skills for choosing will be;
Acrobatics, Deception, Endurance, Gather Information, Iniative, Athletics (Jump & Climb), Knowledge, Mechanics, Perception, Persuasion, Pilot, Ride, Stealth, Survival, Swim, Treat Injury, and Use Computer.
We'll use that as the starting point.
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Sounds good I would lean towards a themed cruise. Halloween would definitely be appropriate, and at least initially, could make identifying 'real' zombies difficult :-)
I do have a couple of questions, though:
1)Are those four classes the only classes that you will be using (if so, where can I find the full data for those classes - the link you provided lists modifications to the base classes, and does not explain the talent trees)?
2)With regard to weapon proficiencies - will they be modified? I imagine that the average modern-era human scoundrel would not have proficiency in, say, the hand crossbow, short sword, or short bow, but might be proficient with hand guns.
3)Other than using the classes, and the rules for skills, from SWSE, will the rest of the rules set be as per d20 modern? For example, will you be using the 'Occupation' rules?
As for a general character concept, I was leaning towards a somewhat shell-shocked EMT or Combat Medic on some mandated rest/vacation following a particularly traumatic last rotation.
1> The hard problem is that Star Wars is a licensed product and WotC chose not re-new their license with Lucas. The game SWSE officially can not be sold now by WotC. That is the tangle with licensed products. I have to be careful on how much I 'quote' or reference to the rules.
All the classes follow a basic format that at first level you get a feat and a talent. Every Even numbered level you get to choose another feat. Every Odd numbered level you get to choose another talent.
Classes provide a one time bonus to one or two of the Saves. I'll go over this in a bit more detail in another post. After first level, all saves increase at the rate of 1/2 your level so you don't need to read a chart to figure out what your saving throw for a particular save might be.
Classes also have different amounts of starting hit points. SWSE uses the equivalent of three times maximum hit die roll for the class plus a bonus for Constitution (though this is not tripled). I'll probably choose to go with double as this will give players a value above ten which gives them a slight area of protection from the risk of contracting 'Zombie Plague'. Scoundrels and Nobles use d6, Scouts use d8, and Soldiers use d10 for levels above first.
Many game shops still have copies of the SWSE core book but I will work to see what I can do in additional posts to cover information.
If you have an idea for a talent or a feat then let me know and I can steer to something that might exist or that could be created with a bit of tweaking of the rules.
The talent trees are a similar idea to d20 Modern but they tend to be better than d20 Modern which often have talents that are little better than feats. Again, if there is a talent in d20 then there is likely something like it in SWSE which was a later development of the idea by WotC.
2> Yup, I'll work on that later tonight.
3> I had not thought on the Occupation rules. Given that there are no 'Races' to give bonus to starting characters then I am fine with people choosing an Occupation from d20 Modern.
I will use SWSE rules for AC which is that a player either uses their Character Level (called Hero Level in SWSE) or the AC bonus the armour provides. A large shield would be +2; so, it would be a help to a level 1 character but a level 2 or higher character can generally get the same advantage by just being wise enough to 'duck'. I think this reflects the 'no armour' style of most Zombie fighters.
SWSE also does not have a separate AC listing but combines AC with Reflex. Reflex serves as the Save and AC for most attacks in Melee and Ranged. Fortitude is used when something like Acid or Flame is used and it is more a 'resistance' then an actual attack. Will is still the mental defense.
I plan to borrow from Pathfinder the idea of Combat Maneuver and Combat Maneuver Defense. This system works much more quickly and easily for Grapple contests and Bull Rushes which are a main stay of Zombie fiction.
4> Bluff is covered by the Deception skill.
Diplomacy is covered by Persuasion skill.
Sense Motive is covered by Perception skill and Will defense (success on Deception and Persuasion skills is usually determined by comparing to the Will defense of the target.)
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Attribute rolls look good.
I have no preference on a theme, and I think the tail-end of a Caribbean cruise would be good (I'd find it slightly easier to roleplay the post-cruise if it were in America, but maybe that's just my bias, heh. Alaska might work but overall something more urban would be better I think).
I've got a few different concepts tumbling around my brain. I'll have to think on which to go with (and may pick based on what I think would have some interesting interactions with other folks' characters). Most likely somebody quick and either tough or smart depending. (I am staunchly a point-buy guy so I'll be using that for my stats.)
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I have no preference on a theme, and I think the tail-end of a Caribbean cruise would be good (I'd find it slightly easier to roleplay the post-cruise if it were in America, but maybe that's just my bias, heh. Alaska might work but overall something more urban would be better I think).
...and what about us poor Australians that are interested in this? ;-)
@Smerg: Thanks for answering my questions. I managed to find a copy of the Star Wars RPG (Saga Edition) Core book, and have had a look through it to try to clear things up.
As a follow-up on the subject of weapon/armor proficiencies, how about just giving each of the four classes the Weapon/Armor proficiencies they receive in SWSE, but restricting them to the weapon/armor tables from D20 Modern (e.g. a 'Noble' gets all Simple Weapons + pistols/hand-guns)?
A Couple of further questions:
1)Which rules set should we look at for feats (D20 Modern or SWSE)?
2)Do you intend to use, carte blanche, the SWSE combat rules (other than using the CMB/CMD rules from Pathfinder)? From what I can tell, they are largely identical to the D20/4th Ed system, with one glaring exception: The 'Condition track' (From what I can tell, it will be less relevant to a zombie game, where there are not too many concussion grenades)? If you do not intend to use it, what do Scouts get to replace the 'shake it off' feat with (maybe Extra Second Wind?)?
I ask, because I am interested in running a Scout/EMT :-)
EDIT: On the subject of hp, what rules set were you planning to use for zombies? Standard Pathfinder zombies do 1d6+4 on a successful hit, so that means if we use 2xMax HD + Con Modifier for first level, Nobles and Scouts are guaranteed to risk 'zombie plague' whenever they are hit, Scouts have a 50% chance of risking it, and only soldiers are guaranteed to not risk infection after a single hit (two, on the other hand...).
If that is the feel you are going for, that's fine - I just wanted to check how deadly you were wanting to make this :-)
I've got a few ideas brewing in my noggin so I'll give the dice a roll and see what I get!
Oh my... xD
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12
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8
Hmm... this will make things... interesting xD I'll need to do some thinking on what I want to make with these stats.
The SWSE proficiencies by class are good.
Just a note on armour. Most armour will be light. Most SWAT teams will be wearing 'light' armour. The only heavy armour is Bomb Disposal Ordnance suits. The grading on armour has more to do with bulk and weight.
1> Most feats are repeated in both sets of books. SWSE has a few feats that are useful to use and if the feats are repeated the SWSE version will be used instead of the d20 Modern (unless there is something that seems reasonable that you especially want out of the d20 Modern Feat). There aren't too many 'broken' feats but SWSE does reduce some of the paths of feats that you need to get certain feats. If you are being a Medic then there is a feat (not in the core SWSE book) that allows you to use Treat Injury on yourself without taking a -5 penalty. There is also Surgical Expertise which allows you to do surgery to treat a wound in 10 min instead of an hour.
2> The condition track is more common in regular SWSE where it is 'common' for damage to be measured in multiple d8s and d10s of damage. I have a Wookiee character that on a critical recently did 51 points of damage (2d10+12 x2 on critical adds up fast). I'll think that I will keep the condition track as a rule in the background but I don't think that I will get much use for it as most people have a Fort (10 min) that the time of damage that would trigger it will kill.
I am fine with the substitution of Extra Second Wind for Shake it Off.
I am planning on a few advantages for the players to help with their hit points initially.
The first thing that I'm planning is that when there are zombies attacking and the players are with NPCs then the zombies will distribute their attacks to the NPCs first and any left over will go to the Players. This is pretty common in Zombie fiction that the 'heroes' are the last to be bitten if a zombie pops out of a closet and an extra is standing near by.
The second thing is that I will likely start the first zombies with d3+1 damage or d4+1 damage (freshly minted zombies taking some time to get their full zombie strength). Damage and danger will crank up as players become 'aware' and gain skill.
I won't use the 'Zombie Plague' rule while players still have their Second Wind (or Tough as Nails or Extra Second Wind) available to them. When those resources are expended and the player then comes to their last 10 hit points will I start checking for 'Zombie Plague'. I will put damage in spoiler tags for the players to know their own health but I ask that they keep the total health damage secret from the other players. I think it will be better if you are never 'sure' if your companion might be infected by that last encounter or not.
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Just as a final topic, how lethal do people fell a Zombie Apocalypse game should be?
Classes and Weapon Proficiencies
Noble and Scoundrel - Simple and Pistols
Scout and Soldier - as above and Rifles
It takes a feat to learn Advanced Melee Weapons, Heavy Weapons
Everyone's favourite anti-Zombie weapon the Chainsaw is an Advanced melee Weapon.
Heavy Weapons covers all the heavy machineguns, flamethrowers, and missile launchers.
Grenades are a 'simple' weapon.
Non-proficiency in a weapon is a -5 penalty.
Firing into Melee without Precise Shot feat is a -5 penalty.
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Daveth the dice rolls look fine.
Well, I have a general preference for low lethality - death should generally not be the result of anything but the worst of bad luck, and 'random encounters' should give the characters a fighting (or fleeing) chance, and generally telegraph their difficulty fairly clearly. Everything else is based on hopefully informed decisions - if characters decide to go into a high-risk area for high reward, well, the risk should be there. If they make mistakes (stupid or not), things should go the way they should.
I'm a little torn with emulating zombie fiction - there is an element of the heroes being the ones who have Plot Armor and luck out time and again that encourages low lethality - on the other hand, dying like animals is a central part of the genre. I think the really important part is communication - as long as the players have a general idea of the danger level of their plan, they can make their own decisions. Being clever is also a big part of it. Also being fairly fluid on adding replacement PCs is always a plus.
Overall, I'm more open to death in a zombie game - but I'd prefer deaths to be the result of player error or heroic last stands, not dying like plain ol' zombie fodder chumps.
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I personally prefer relatively low lethality - I will admit that I do tend to get attached to my characters.
I agree that there should be some element of risk - after all, it is very much genre appropriate, and I agree as long as we clearly have the relative risk of a situation telegraphed to us, I have no problems with that - for example, running into a room filled with zombies wielding nothing but a crowbar should be suicidal, but taking out a single zombie (or even situations where there is one per PC) should be relatively doable - for 1st level characters, it is quite genre appropriate to take on small groups of zombies, and run like hell from large groups.
I think that barring unlucky dice rolls, or player suicidal courage or stupidity, PCs should have a healthy chance of survival - NPCs, on the other hand, should be substantially more unlucky. However, rather than simply treating NPCs as 'red shirts', I favor the idea of (at least some) NPCs having useful skills or knowledge key to PC goals (for example, on the ship, an engineer crucial to repairing the ship, a steward with knowledge of where the supply rooms are, or a pilot who knows how to run the ship), to give the PCs incentive to try to keep people alive.
Regarding the 'zombie plague' mechanic, I am fine with people risk contraction when reduced to less than 10hp; from an aesthetic point, how are you planning to handle it? I am a fan of 'zombie bites' being the sine qua non of transmission risk, so how about all hp greater than 10 representing some sort of 'dodge' bonus / bruising resistance? Just my thoughts on the subject :-)
Fair enough.
I can understand players being attached to characters and not wanting 'Bad GM deaths' due to lack of explaining the situation and failure to offer options for players to guage their risks.
1 to 1 encounters will happen but there will likely be several 2 to 1 and more encounters if you get some weapons arranged.
Zombies and NPCs will usually drop pretty quick.
Hit points above your 'base' 10 will represent more fatigue and near escapes then actual scratches and bites.
Generally, that is the way of characters in such stories. They get tired and 'burnt out' and make a mistake that gets them bit.
Hopefully, there will be a few cases where I can have players be 'out of sight' of each other for long enough to have something happen that they might not want to report to the others. hehe.
Okay,
I need to stock the boat with a few 'interesting' things.
How does this look for Setting.
There is rock climbing, trampoline, Casino, theatre, several pools, kids game area, art gallery, art auction, several restaurants, 11 decks for passengers, over 2000 passengers and over 1000 crew.
Obviously I'm coming late to the discussion, but here's my two cents.
First off, there's a manga/anime called Highschool of the Dead that you might be interested in. It sets itself apart from the zombie herd because instead of the usual Romero cast of idiots who bicker all the time until someone does something stupid, killing everyone, HSotD follows a bunch of teenagers who generally get along and do sensible, reasonable things to survive. I can't overstate what a refreshing change that is.
The anime is available subtitled online and the first volume of the manga has just been released here in the U.S..
Second, I don't think you should worry so much about having a Cleric. If your zombies are the result of a plague then the Cleric's ability to repel/destroy undead shouldn't be an issue.
Obviously I'm coming late to the discussion, but here's my two cents.
First off, there's a manga/anime called Highschool of the Dead that you might be interested in. It sets itself apart from the zombie herd because instead of the usual Romero cast of idiots who bicker all the time until someone does something stupid, killing everyone, HSotD follows a bunch of teenagers who generally get along and do sensible, reasonable things to survive. I can't overstate what a refreshing change that is.
The anime is available subtitled online and the first volume of the manga has just been released here in the U.S..
Second, I don't think you should worry so much about having a Cleric. If your zombies are the result of a plague then the Cleric's ability to repel/destroy undead shouldn't be an issue.
I actually mentioned HotD (High School of the Dead) under 'influences' in my first post but you are correct it is a fun Zombie story with the group working as a team.
I've only watched the Anime but there were still plenty of 'foolish' people and people acting as the 'real' monsters. The school teacher that gathers a harem of girls, the police that fail to shoot because they 'do not get the idea of a zombie horde', the average people the 'lord' like figure protects and have demonstrated the need to kill the zombies and many more.
The anime is good demonstration on building up items (like the nail gun with sites) till they could acquire better weapons.
With people settling on Modern Zombie Horror, I don't think there will be a problem with Clerics for this game.
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Well, I certainly hope that we will be able to work as a team - that is one of the main advantages that humans have over mindless undead, after all... :-/
The cruise ship you have selected looks fine to me.
That 'personal first aid' feat that you mentioned certainly looks interesting; should I just call it that, or is there 'proper' a name I should use?
Another quick question: How should we handle starting equipment?
Another quick question: How should we handle starting equipment?
Bikinis and thongs for everyone!
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Alright, I have a confession to make; I am a rules guy. I wouldn’t call myself an optimiser by any means, but when creating a character I like to know exactly what all my options are and put together a character that I am confident best fits my concept in terms of what it can do. When playing the game I frequently refer to the rules, making sure that what I plan for my character to do is legal and that I am getting the most out of my feats, skills etc.
I’m struggling a bit here. We’re using a sci-fi based ruleset, modified to fit fantasy, with bits and pieces of a modern based ruleset and a fantasy based ruleset to play and make characters for a modern game. While each of the rulesets uses the same base mechanic, there are subtle differences. To make matters worse, I don’t have access to the primary set of rules (Star Wars Saga), and I can’t really justify buying them and have no desire to find a pirated copy.
I know from previous experience that if the rules are not clear and accessible to me (and, in the case of a pbp, if there is not an online srd or similar that I can refer to) I won’t enjoy the game as much as I otherwise should.
I don’t want to be the guy who drops out of the game after 35 posts. As such, I think it is fairer to everyone if I bow out now, it will give you guys a chance to recruit another player if you prefer. Good luck with the game, my personal issues with rules aside it sounds like a hell of a lot of fun, and thanks to Smerg for volunteering to run this and giving us so much choice of scenario. Feel free to have an NPC named in my honour ruthlessly torn apart by zombies in the first scene ...
That's a shame, Moth, but I know exactly where you're coming from. I'd be equally resistant if I didn't happen to have a copy of SAGA for unrelated reasons. (There's also the fact I love experimenting so this is practically an ideal situation for me, in particular.) Happy trails.
Also that particular ship sounds perfect. Rock climbing really stuck in my head, so I'm thinking I'll have some sort of athletic trainer/director guy.
I'm sorry to hear that Mothman.
I do suggest that you try to learn more of the SAGA system rules if you can. They really do have some good points to offer over standard d20.
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Starting Equipment should follow what you would normally be allowed to carry and what you would bring with you on a cruise ship.
I do want each person to choose some sort of item (picture, locket, necklace, watch, etc) that is a symbolic representation of their nature and or goals. This is not a weapon or in most cases a useful tool, it is something to pull out and show to others as you tell a story.
Examples;
This is my father's watch, he gave it to me when ...
This is picture of my baby girl, she's six now but I like to keep this picture of her because ...
My wife made this wallet for me. She said she wanted me to always keep ...
Ideally the item should be a source of several stories of the character's past. You don't need to have the stories at the start of the game but at some points when players have a down time, bonding moment, it will be a chance to share these stories with each other.
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Players may also choose one other item that is a 'functional' tool that they can choose related to their life or work.
This my be a cell phone, first aid kit, pocket knife, lap top computer, PS2 hand held game player, kindle reader, shoe polish kit, a few recreational reading novels, a musical instrument, rattan kendo sword, or any of the other things people might take with them because of hobbies and interests. Bigger items will need to be kept in Suites (like kedo swords and musical instruments) when not in active use.
Technology items like cell phones will work fine to start the campaign but over time may find problems working as it gets harder to power batteries and find still operating Wi-Fi, cell towers, and internet. These items are more powerful when operating because they have a great amount of flexibility.
Right. Luke_Parry here. I have put together the 'crunch' on my character (all details listed on his profile), and will update it with his Appearance/Background/Equipment shortly.
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@Shuriken Nekogami:
Appraise and Profession do not exist as skills under the rule set we are using (Smerg listed all of the skills we could select from in an earlier post).
http://www.d20resources.com/modern.d20.srd/
You could, however, take the 'Religious' Starting Occupation (giving you a +1 on History and Theology ('Religion') knowledge rolls :-)
Otherwise, it looks like an interesting character :-)
darn, my post dissapeared. gotta retype it.
japanese high school student who tends her grandfather's shrine. wears a lucky amulet passed down the family for generations, does Akido on the side and managed to earn enough for her summer cruise off the commisions from selling trinkets at a festival a matter of weeks before.
Attributes
Str 12
Dex 14
Con 12
Int 12
Wis 12
Cha 12
Feats; Weapon finesse/improved unarmed strike
Stats, (Treat as Noble)
Occupation (Reliigous)
Trained Skills
Perception
Acrobatics
Persuasion
Knowledge (History)
Knowledge (Theology)
Treat Injury
Atheletics
Linguistics
Functional Tool is a stationary set consisting of notebooks and pencils, pages occasionally used as improvised ofuda.
Hit Die
D6
Good Saves are will and hopefully reflex too.
Right. Luke_Parry here. I have put together the 'crunch' on my character (all details listed on his profile), and will update it with his Appearance/Background/Equipment shortly.
This looks good for a character.
darn, my post dissapeared. gotta retype it.
japanese high school student who tends her grandfather's shrine. wears a lucky amulet passed down the family for generations, does Akido on the side and managed to earn enough for her summer cruise off the commisions from selling trinkets at a festival a matter of weeks before.
Attributes
Str 12
Dex 14
Con 12
Int 12
Wis 12
Cha 12Feats; Weapon finesse/improved unarmed strike
Stats, (Treat as Noble)
Occupation (Reliigous)
Trained Skills
Perception
Acrobatics
Persuasion
Knowledge (History)
Knowledge (Theology)
Treat Injury
Atheletics
Linguistics
Functional Tool is a stationary set consisting of notebooks and pencils, pages occasionally used as improvised ofuda.
Hit Die
D6
Good Saves are will and hopefully reflex too.
Linguistics is not a skill and usually is handled as a feat. Each selection of the feat gives additional languages equal to your 1+Int bonus (minimum of 1 additional language).
Instead of Linguistics, I would suggest the skill of Initiative.
Nobles are +1 Reflex Def and +2 Will Def.
This would give your character 10 base +1 Class +1 Hero Level +2 Dex = 14 Reflex.
If you do Aikido on the side then there are a couple of Feats that might be good.
Dodge - gives +1 Reflex Defense
Martial Arts I - Increase damage die for Melee attacks by one size and get a +1 bonus to Reflex Defense
Acrobatic Strike - get +5 to hit on next attack against opponents that you tumble past
Improved Defenses - get +1 to all your defenses
Running Attack - move both before and after you make an attack
Trip - knock an opponent prone that you have grappled
The rest is good.
female, a monster, ugly, bald, old, heavily armored, angry, in profile (or otherwise not facing the camera), not human, ugly, a doofus, or posessed of extremely questionable fashion sense. (Yes I said ugly twice). I'm pretty sure there are at least a half dozen ways to be Valeros, as well, if you were ever so inclined. There's also a few totally sweet wizards, but that never seems to help me.
Oh, here's an option! Can I start out as a zombie?
I swear, the avatar selection here is almost enough to make me exclusively crossplay sexes.
I went with a Soldier if only to differentiate myself from Geoff (I'm assuming we don't literally mean 'military guy' here, merely someone tough that knows his way around a fight better than the average guy). I will also take the opportunity to gush about SAGA handling this stuff better than d20. I never did like the Strong and Tough heroes; the Soldier has a very nice array of talents, though.
I'm assuming we're using the class skills listed in the fantasy document and expanding them as appropriate from the selections under our chosen Occupation. I also assume we're using a mix of d20 Modern and SAGA feats (using the better where it overlaps?)
That said, I picked Blue Collar (guy's day job is/was an auto mechanic and general gearhead... any similarities to Aran purely coincidental).
Skills: Choose three of the following skills as permanent class skills. If a skill the character selects is already a class skill, he or she receives a +1 competence bonus on checks using that skill. Craft (electronic, mechanical, or structural), Climb, Drive, Handle Animal, Intimidate, Repair, Ride.
I'm interpreting that as getting Mechanics as a trained skill (Repair, Craft), +1 Pilot (Drive), and +1 Athletics (Climb). Also, I couldn't recall offhand if an INT bonus gives you an extra language in d20M; he currently has Spanish listed. If I'm getting my rules crossed here I'll probably just drop it all together.
Also do we get +2 to an ability for being human? I assumed no (and amused myself by winding up with the Elite Array). I'm not quite sure how Geoff's stats work out with or without it (though maybe that's sleep dep's fault).
Talent and feats aren't picked yet, but will likely be focused towards guns (I meant to play that up in the background more than I did), with maybe a little melee or 'tough' type feats thrown in.
I think that's all my mechanical stuff. The actual character is included within but I'll let that speak for itself. The background does show that I went back and forth between 'survivalist' and, uh, whatever you call the current background. Details towards the end are obviously malleable as we decide on the setting.
In fact, I think it's prudent to mention the major caveat of I should have been asleep an hour or two ago. I definitely missed a couple of significant elements, so I may do a substantial overhaul but I think this hits the core of what I was going for originally. If I do make any major changes, it'll probably be gearing more towards 'woodsy type'.
edit: haha, I totally forgot my 'treasured item'. I am just going to say Work in Progress and go to sleep now.
** spoiler omitted **
I swear, the avatar selection here is almost enough to make me exclusively crossplay sexes.
I went with a Soldier if only to differentiate myself from Geoff (I'm assuming we don't literally mean 'military guy' here, merely someone tough...
Yup, usually Soldier is a general group of 'tough guys'. Since Treat Injury is a class skill for several classes, you could be a surgeon that is from Noble, Soldier, or Scout classes representing your 'style' of life and medicine.
A tough blue collar type works with the class.
I listed a specific set of 'skills' that cover most things which are drawn from the SAGA list of skills. If there is a specific skill not on the list then let me know and I'll decide whether it has a place on the list or not (it might be covered by an existing skill and there is no need to fragment the list into further skills that people need to 'know').
I allow people to pick their Int bonus in additional languages.
It is a no on the +2 to attribute as that is a Pathfinder rule (not in d20 Modern or 3.5). I have allowed Occupations rule to make up for the lost benefit of Races.
The character looks fine as a first pass but I reserve the right to go over it in more detail when it is finished.
For Smerg** spoiler omitted **
I understand.
The game seems to be coalescing with people and interest; so, it should take off fine. It is better to make these choices early then a few dozen posts into the game.
does Martial arts I effectively replace improved unarmed strike?
If so.
make my feats Martial Arts I and running attack
and i shall take initiative instead of linguistics since there is appearantly no equivalent to decipher script.
How do we Determine Hit Points?