Hey,The CommaMaster is tossing around this idea for a new class. The idea is a full caster whose main class feature is a familiar-like golem whose abilities increase with the character's levels. The CommaMaster is thinking of it as a base class but He's open to prestige ideas. All opinions are appreciated by the CommaMaster.
problem is i don't have the APG yet. I'll look at the Smmoner once I do. Thanks for the thoughts.
problem is i don't have the APG yet. I'll look at the Smmoner once I do. Thanks for the thoughts.
Why not look it up on the SRD site? LINK
problem is i don't have the APG yet. I'll look at the Smmoner once I do. Thanks for the thoughts.Why not look it up on the SRD site? LINK
Hey i just looked that up thanks for the link A. (I didn't even know what SRD was)
Cool class,probably use alot of the ideas,I especially like the customization with evolution points and being able to use them on the PC.
Has anyone played a summoner yet? If so,what'd ya think?
I'll probably drop the BAB to 1/2 and up the spells to full progression,probably in line with a sorcerer. Sort of a combo between a summoner with a hardier creature and a sorcerer without a bloodline. Make him more of a stand-behind-the-meatshield-and-blast type of caster.
Not sure about the spell list. As sorcerer or as summoner or custom? Thoughts?
I don't have any advice for you at the moment, but I just wanted to say, this is my most desired new class. I very much hope to see a construct focused class from Paizo.
I don't have any advice for you at the moment, but I just wanted to say, this is my most desired new class. I very much hope to see a construct focused class from Paizo.
Thanks for the post Blue. So far I'm working out "bases" for the Golem (calling it that for lack of a better word,not an actual golem as presented in the Bestiary) similar to the bases for the eidolon. So far I have a flier base(homonculous) a stealth base (iron cobra,might need to scale back it's power,get rid of poison) and i want to use the Dread Guard from Monster Manual 2 as a brute base. I think my MM2 is 3rd edition though,not even 3.5 so will have to convert.
I'll probably drop the BAB to 1/2 and up the spells to full progression,probably in line with a sorcerer. Sort of a combo between a summoner with a hardier creature and a sorcerer without a bloodline. Make him more of a stand-behind-the-meatshield-and-blast type of caster.
Not sure about the spell list. As sorcerer or as summoner or custom? Thoughts?
Doing that without modifying the "Eidolon"/Golem would probably result in a fairly broken class, as the Eidolon as is is a fairly powerful melee combattant already. If you make the "Summoner"/Golem Mage better at being a blaster/spellcaster, you basically have a fighter and a wizard in one person (with more hp than either). And dropping the BAB to ½ isn't a balancing act if you give the Summoner access to a lot of attack spells...
Just my two cents.
Good points,probably should do a custom spell list with less focus on blasting and more focus on buffing and repair wounds spells.
The whole reason why the summoner is fair is because the spell progression is weak. Think of the creature as a part of the character. Imagine a dusk blade who could let go of his sword and let it fly out in front of him, doing all the cutting while he sits back and watches. That is the summoner.
If you give him full spell progression, you are going to have to make the creature a lot weaker to make it fair, and then there isn't any point. You will actually want the creature to be stronger than the Eidelon because it is harder to replace (can't call a golem out of thin air.
True,and lowering the BAB isn't much of a balance (see Bruno's post). Should keep summoner spell progression with lowered BAB and custom spell list with a repair ability built in,similar to the summoner's built in summon monster ability. Spell list should focus on transmutations and other buffs,with only low level or single target blasts.
also,problem with having construct at first level. The cheapest construct is the homunculus,and it costs 1,000+ gp. Hard to justify at first level.
You can make what you want just by playing the Summoner straight up. You just start with a humanoid eidolon and make it "rocky". "fleshy" or "metally" according to taste.
And you reset it's qualities at every level up. So your first level eidolon could be a medium or small humanoid figures that approximates a homuculous in all but name and the higher ranking eidolons can be your Large, Huge, Golem like feature that's extremely customisable.
Works for mechanics,not for flavor. The summoner would still be a Summoner,first and foremost,even if his eidolon was "golemy". He still casts Summon Monster 1-9 a certain number of times per day even though he only gets sixth level spells. That being said,your right about it being very customisable.
Just curiosity here,what makes the eidolon so great? I mean,any caster could create a golem at mid or high levels and get the same effect of a mindless fighter that obeys all commands,right? I think there's probably something i'm missing that gives the summoner the advantage over the wizard in this regard (aside from the massive cost to the wizard)
Just curiosity here,what makes the eidolon so great? I mean,any caster could create a golem at mid or high levels and get the same effect of a mindless fighter that obeys all commands,right? I think there's probably something i'm missing that gives the summoner the advantage over the wizard in this regard (aside from the massive cost to the wizard)
Write up a level 10 large size biped maxxing out number of attacks send it against an iron golem. You have a fair battle even without the summoner there casting buffs and the golem is CR 13.
Just curiosity here,what makes the eidolon so great? I mean,any caster could create a golem at mid or high levels and get the same effect of a mindless fighter that obeys all commands,right? I think there's probably something i'm missing that gives the summoner the advantage over the wizard in this regard (aside from the massive cost to the wizard)Write up a level 10 large size biped maxxing out number of attacks send it against an iron golem. You have a fair battle even without the summoner there casting buffs and the golem is CR 13.
I don't have my books with me right now,but assuming that the eidolon trashes the golem,why specifically would he do so? What specific advantages does he have? Or are his ability scores and attacks just that much better?
I don't have my books with me right now,but assuming that the eidolon trashes the golem,why specifically would he do so? What specific advantages does he have? Or are his ability scores and attacks just that much better?Just curiosity here,what makes the eidolon so great? I mean,any caster could create a golem at mid or high levels and get the same effect of a mindless fighter that obeys all commands,right? I think there's probably something i'm missing that gives the summoner the advantage over the wizard in this regard (aside from the massive cost to the wizard)Write up a level 10 large size biped maxxing out number of attacks send it against an iron golem. You have a fair battle even without the summoner there casting buffs and the golem is CR 13.
If the eidolon were to go by itself it's like a 50-50 fight, mostly determined by how well the eidolon rolls on its attacks and whether they remebered to get the magic attack evolution to bypass the DR. Their strength is that since their attacks are natural attacks, they do not incur significant penalties to hit for attacks beyond the first. It's rather easy to get all of their attacks at full BAB opposed to the usual cumulative -5 for each past the first. The raw DPR, good combat manuever evolutions, and the ability to become large and get reach on opponents for the AoO's.
I think i've hit a dead end with the idea of having a construct as a familiar. Probably gonna scrap the idea and move on.
I think i've hit a dead end with the idea of having a construct as a familiar. Probably gonna scrap the idea and move on.
In complete warrior, they had constructs that you could take using the Improved Familiar feat.