GM Advice: The alchemist and his abundent supply of breakable items


Advice


So the way the alchemist is gear out he has a lot of very breakable glass hanging off him all around to be ready to toss at any time. Do you as a GM ever have these items break due to impact, spell attacks, or falls? It seems like it makes sense but it s cruel to do to a player.

There is a creature swarm that has a sonic attack that breaks all ceramic and glass that is non magical but I didn't have the heart to nuke all of my PCs potions then.

But is this the risk the alchemist is taking?


j l 629 wrote:

So the way the alchemist is gear out he has a lot of very breakable glass hanging off him all around to be ready to toss at any time. Do you as a GM ever have these items break due to impact, spell attacks, or falls? It seems like it makes sense but it s cruel to do to a player.

There is a creature swarm that has a sonic attack that breaks all ceramic and glass that is non magical but I didn't have the heart to nuke all of my PCs potions then.

But is this the risk the alchemist is taking?

The bombs are part of a nondescript "spell" component pouch. It could be interesting to break those and then describe him macgyvering improvements.

On the other hand, it would be a little cruel to have him blow all of his saved spells from one sonic attack. There's also no mention of what sort of vial the alchemist is using, they could be metal.


I figure that if you are throwing acid flasks and potions that break on contact with a toss then they could break on you as well.

Shadow Lodge

Quote:
But is this the risk the alchemist is taking?

At 99 tables out of a hundred?

No

Does your player expect this to be an issue?
Probably not

Do you limit other classes in similar ways? Do wizards spell components get destroyed when they get wet? Are fighters limited to a realistic number of weapons? Do you drown them often because they can't make swim checks?

I would suggest this is a really bad idea.


Objects on your persons are immune to everything unless specifically targeted, or you roll a natural 1 on a save throw at which point something might be damaged. Most of the spells that specifically target an object in possession only target one at a time and usually don't target magical stuff. Those that do generally allow a save throw and items in possession generally get to be saved by the person that owns them.

Also:

Nothing says these containers are easy to break. The bombs are supernatural -- it could the magic is what causes the container to fly apart -- heck the container might not even break -- the magic contained in it might just be set loose when the alchemist does his supernatural thing. The extracts must be drank -- but that doesn't mean that the containers for them are fragile -- they could be special metal vials designed to last lifetimes.

Now *normal* alchemical items are just like the same ones everyone else uses -- and if you regularly make those break then sure have fun with the *normal* ones -- but the alchemist's class stuff has significant room in the fluff and mechanics to not be so fragile.

Scarab Sages

BigNorseWolf wrote:
The bombs are part of a nondescript "spell" component pouch. It could be interesting to break those and then describe him macgyvering improvements.

I agree with the idea that the "bombs" don't have to be exposed. And if they're not exposed, they don't break or need to roll saves except in extreme circumstances. They're not ioun stones after all (which in older editions were considered "unattended" when they are circling above your head; don't know if they still are in PF).

And you can dull the pain of potions being destroyed by every once in awhile having the destroyed mess of bombs create some new combination that is not part of the normal alchemy progression. For example, maybe a potion that does acid damage is accidentally mixed with a potion that increases your natural armor, with the result being a single potion that does both. Or maybe it acts like a "fire shield" spell, except that it provides an AC bonus while simultaneously doing acid damage to those hit do damage with a melee attack.

If you're creative with such discoveries it can really take the sting out of the loss. Especially if you can make it seem like you had it planned and that it somehow furthers the story or provides some bonus that the party will need in a later encounter. (Doing that on the fly takes practice, though.)

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

j l 629 wrote:
Do you as a GM ever have these items break due to impact, spell attacks, or falls?

Best to avoid things that do nothing except spoil a players fun.


Ogre wrote:

Do you limit other classes in similar ways? Do wizards spell components get destroyed when they get wet? Are fighters limited to a realistic number of weapons? Do you drown them often because they can't make swim checks?

I would suggest this is a really bad idea.

I agree with this.

Unless you are specifically targeting the class abilities of other classes, it seems an unnessary burden to play an alchemist and relatively quickly no one will want to play one.

In my mind it would be the same as constantly trying to steal the wizard's compent pouch, destroy the cleric's divine focus, or have the plate-armored fighter routinely encountering rust monsters. This can be fun and interesting if used very rarely, but can quickly become an annoyance if used routinely.

There are probably better ways to challenge the characters than actively eliminating their basic class abilities.


As a GM (and player) with 20 years of experience, I think there are three key elements to consider.

First, will the player enjoy it? If they will get a kick out of losing all their alchemical items, seeking out a Handy Haversack or some custom magic item as a solution, and rebuilding their stock, then go ahead and give them the story their asking for. If you don't think the player will enjoy it, don't do it.

Second, will it set the player back significantly in overall power level compared to the party? This may happen if the other party members have invested their loot in magic swords and armor, but the alchemist has all of his wealth sunk into alchemical items that you destroy. If this happens, have a plan to replace the wealth.

For example:
One room in an existing dungeon could be an old alchemy lab, long abandoned. While the Wizard/Bard scours ancient tomes found there, and the Fighter/Rogue sorts through an armory of old weapons with a few nice ones hidden in the piles, your recently impoverished Alchemist could scrape together ingredients and use the masterwork facility to build back his stock. Don't forget to make a few of his concoctions blow up and a few others work wonderfully producing extra results, as this gives him a chance to laugh maniacally!

Third, do you plan to do this to everyone? If you really do plan to burn the Wizard's spellbook, rust the Warrior's armor, and kill the Druid's pet, then destroying the alchemical items is more reasonable. You're just running a game with storylines about loss and recovery included, and those can be great storylines. Just make sure to spread the pain out evenly so that the party members stay roughly parallel in power. It can be fun to overcome an obstacle, but it's never fun to feel picked on.

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