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Much of the time, RPGs tend to fall into the rut of the classic Good vs Evil archetype, but there are often situations when two good-guys (or two bad-guys) come into conflict with each other due to opposing goals or motivations:
For example:
Lawful Evil wizard (sorcerer), Venger vs. Chaotic Evil Dragon, Tiamat.
or
Neutral Good superhero, Tony Stark/Iron Man vs. Lawful Good superhero, Roady Rhodes/War Machine as potrayed in Iron Man 2.
Anymore anyone would care to share?
I thought this would be a good exercise, especially for DMs, to broaden out perspective on potential character adversaries in a campaign.
Lawful evil Hitler/Nazi Germany vs. Neutral Evil Stalin/Soviet Union.
Lawful evil Hitler/Nazi Germany vs. Neutral Evil Stalin/Soviet Union.
A person on Earth is hard to give an alignment to, several million of them with various factions, policies, beliefs, etnicities, social pressures, etc. Mean that its nearly impossible to give alignments to. Nazi Germany did some terrible things, but it wasn't all bad guys. So I don't think you can call an nation any one alignment. And government policy =/= nation.
Nazi Germany did some terrible things, but it wasn't all bad guys.
Okay, so now I gotta know; what kind of good things did Nazi Germany accomplish?
If Adolf Hitler and the Third Reich aren't the personification of Evil, who or what is?
In Les Misérables by Victor Hugo :
Lawful Neutral police officer Javert vs Chaatic Good redeemed prisoner Jean Valjean.
Was Potter mentioned in the other thread?
Harry Potter (CG) vs. Tom Riddle (CE)
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Nazi Germany did some terrible things, but it wasn't all bad guys.Okay, so now I gotta know; what kind of good things did Nazi Germany accomplish?
If Adolf Hitler and the Third Reich aren't the personification of Evil, who or what is?
Nazi scientists were the first to point out the link between smoking and cancer, I believe.
Nazi scientists were the first to point out the link between smoking and cancer, I believe.Nazi Germany did some terrible things, but it wasn't all bad guys.Okay, so now I gotta know; what kind of good things did Nazi Germany accomplish?
If Adolf Hitler and the Third Reich aren't the personification of Evil, who or what is?
In general, they created much of the base data modern medicine uses today. Diagrams they made of the human body, many through autopsies and vivisections, are some of the most detailed ever made. Their research is still used in many modern medical textooks. Similarlly, they discovered benneficial and harmful uses to many drugs because to their use of human test subjects. Their different ethical standards allowed them to perform reseach that would not be allowed elsewhere in the world, but the entire world has reaped the bennefits of this research.
Likewise, they advanced other industries. Atomic research was advanced greatly, allowing for modern atomic power plants. Many US researchers on the Manhattan project were defectors who started their reseach paid by Nazi Germany. Volkswagon and BMW were created with funding by the German state, and they advanced production line technology greatly.
Nazi Germany did many terrible things, but they also did many things that have shaped our world for the better.
Nazi scientists were the first to point out the link between smoking and cancer, I believe.Nazi Germany did some terrible things, but it wasn't all bad guys.Okay, so now I gotta know; what kind of good things did Nazi Germany accomplish?
If Adolf Hitler and the Third Reich aren't the personification of Evil, who or what is?
In general, they created much of the base data modern medicine uses today. Diagrams they made of the human body, many through autopsies and vivisections, are some of the most detailed ever made. Their research is still used in many modern medical textooks. Similarlly, they discovered benneficial and harmful uses to many drugs because to their use of human test subjects. Their different ethical standards allowed them to perform reseach that would not be allowed elsewhere in the world, but the entire world has reaped the bennefits of this research.
Likewise, they advanced other industries. Atomic research was advanced greatly, allowing for modern atomic power plants. Many US researchers on the Manhattan project were defectors who started their reseach paid by Nazi Germany. Volkswagon and BMW were created with funding by the German state, and they advanced production line technology greatly.
Nazi Germany did many terrible things, but they also did many things that have shaped our world for the better.
Boom! Exactly. This doesn't vindicate their policies, or mitigate the wrongs they did perpetrate. But nothing is black and white, certainly not on such a scale. There is plenty of good and bad about the USA, plenty of people on Earth consider them alternately the bad and good guys. And truth is their neither, similarly other nations and empires throughout history. The nazis didn't invent genocide or ethnic cleansig, they just did it with an appalling modern efficiency, the scale was much larger. Again not a vindication, not even a little bit. WWII is one the incredibly few wars that the world is genuinely a better place because the side that won did.
Sneaks stealthily into thread and carries it back to it's original location.
Boom! Exactly. This doesn't vindicate their policies, or mitigate the wrongs they did perpetrate. But nothing is black and white, certainly not on such a scale. There is plenty of good and bad about the USA, plenty of people on Earth consider them alternately the bad and good guys. And truth is their neither, similarly other nations and empires throughout history. The nazis didn't invent genocide or ethnic cleansig, they just did it with an appalling modern efficiency, the scale was much larger. Again not a vindication, not even a little bit. WWII is one the...Nazi scientists were the first to point out the link between smoking and cancer, I believe.Nazi Germany did some terrible things, but it wasn't all bad guys.Okay, so now I gotta know; what kind of good things did Nazi Germany accomplish?
If Adolf Hitler and the Third Reich aren't the personification of Evil, who or what is?
In general, they created much of the base data modern medicine uses today. Diagrams they made of the human body, many through autopsies and vivisections, are some of the most detailed ever made. Their research is still used in many modern medical textooks. Similarlly, they discovered benneficial and harmful uses to many drugs because to their use of human test subjects. Their different ethical standards allowed them to perform reseach that would not be allowed elsewhere in the world, but the entire world has reaped the bennefits of this research.
Likewise, they advanced other industries. Atomic research was advanced greatly, allowing for modern atomic power plants. Many US researchers on the Manhattan project were defectors who started their reseach paid by Nazi Germany. Volkswagon and BMW were created with funding by the German state, and they advanced production line technology greatly.
Nazi Germany did many terrible things, but they also did many things that have shaped our world for the better.
Vagrant Poet's Lawful Nuetral attitude vs Loaba's Nuetral Good attitude.
Chaotic Good Super Hero Wolverine vs Chaotic Good Superhero Hulk
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Toronto, April 1, 1990.
Wrestlemania VI.
Hulk Hogan LF (Lawful Face)
vs.
The Ultimate Warrior CF (Chaotic Face)
note: For anyone not familiar with sports entertainment terminology, a "babyface" (or "face" for short) is a good guy, while a "heel" is a bad guy.
I figure professional wrestlers should count since they're fictional characters and not actual real Earth people.
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Neutral Good Iron Man vs Lawful Good Captain America during the Civil War.
Just saw this one. I disagree on BOTH alignments, actually. Tony Stark, at least during the course of Civil War, worked his way from Lawful Neutral to Lawful Evil. I'd say that Cap is fairly consistantly portrayed as Neutral Good, albeit with lawful tendancies.
[/thread necromancy, lesser]
Nazi Germany did some terrible things, but it wasn't all bad guys.Okay, so now I gotta know; what kind of good things did Nazi Germany accomplish?
If Adolf Hitler and the Third Reich aren't the personification of Evil, who or what is?
they had some pretty strict animal rights laws
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_welfare_in_Nazi_Germany
even evil loves puppies.
The superhero references stand out to me because I am less refined, or cultured... whatever. In general though, this thread only serves to stoke the coals of my hatred for the alignment system. My players can't unwrap their heads from the idea that their characters are not bound to those two letters on their character sheet (meaning we get every one of Lawful Stupid's ugly cousins).
One guy even thinks that in order to play a true neutral character you should have to flip a coin when you have to make decisions, that it's the only way to be "unbiased." Ugh... [/rant]
On topic contribution...
Harry/Ron/Hermione (NG/CG at the time) vs Neville Longbottom (LG at the time)
The Blood Wars!
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Adolf Hilter was a sick sick man. Keep in mind before the war broke out Hilter was Time Magazines person of the year. He modernized his nation and took it out of the depression. If Hitler didn't kill any minorities in his camps (jews, gays, salvs and many others) would be be frowned upon? Look at the conquerers of the past, A lot of historic heros cleansed populouses. I am by no means defending Hitler (he is disgusting), but history is always recorded by the winner.
Interesting side fact about Hilter and his stupidity, When he invaded the USSR and took over Ukraine, the Ukrainians look at Hitler as a liberator. The Ukranians suberb cold weather fighters offered Hitler a 1 million man army to help attack the USSR with. What did Hitler do? why he killed most of them, GG R-tard.
I used to play with a guy who played a 1ed druid (had to be NN). If the group got unbalanced (too many good or too many evil characters) he would start to kill the other pc's until the balance was restored.
E vs E is easy, good vs good is harder. G vs G, IMHO, can often have conflict over methods or personality or perceived reality. But since good people should seek peaceful solutions before resorting to violence (unless violence isthe problem), their conflicts can often be resolved through talking or negotiation.
The movie "Rustlers Rhapsody" is a parody of good vs good.
Obama (LN) vs. Palin (Lawful stupid) :P
Don't a lot of Gygax's early world settings indicate several wars between the elves(CG) and the dwarves(LG). I do agree that while disagreements sometimes involving violence or prohibiting one another from acting are likely to occur amongst "good" aligned people there is often less escalation to warfare/murder (the harry potter example being a good one).
There is also the comic book chestnut of the BBEG makes the two good guys seem at oods with one another to keep them off his trail.
I have, playing a LE mercenary, teamed up with the LG party members to stop a CG character from certain actions. Granted the LG players did not agree to my initial suggestion of cutting her Achille's Tendon to prevent her from running ever again.