Could someone illustrate how this ability would play out in combat? What exactly is the process?
Shar Tahl wrote: Could someone illustrate how this ability would play out in combat? What exactly is the process? As currently written:
Round 1: Cast touch spell. Do not make touch attack. Hold the charge.
Round 2: Make a normal melee attack with your weapon and if it hits, add the damage from your touch spell.
With regard to crits, if I recall what Jason said correctly you use the threat range of the weapon, but the spell only gets a x2 multiplier While the weapon damage gets the weapon's multiplier.
Side note: you retain the option of making the normal touch attack with the spell. Spellstrike merely gives you the option of using your weapon to make a normal attack to deliver the touch spell instead.
Additionally, once you get spell combat at 2nd level you would then be able to cast your touch spell and make your melee attack with your weapon in the same round, however you will take a -4 to hit and a -2 on the concentration check you must make as you will not be given the option of not casting defensively if you use spell combat.
Yeah.. I havent counted them all, but there seem to be about 3d30 different versions of how to fix the ability at the moment, so I would not expect it to stay the same. The wording will likely change to make it clear what the ability is supposed to do. As written it´s a bit weak IMO but that could change once we get the complete spell list.
Banpai wrote: Yeah.. I havent counted them all, but there seem to be about 3d30 different versions of how to fix the ability at the moment, so I would not expect it to stay the same. The wording will likely change to make it clear what the ability is supposed to do. As written it´s a bit weak IMO but that could change once we get the complete spell list. That's why I prefaced my breakdown with "As currently written".
It's weak because you are giving up a touch attack to make a regular attack against a higher AC. Casting the spell and making the attack are 2 separate actions (even with spell combat they are still technically 2 separate acts that are part of a full round action). The only time it is ever better than just making the touch attack is if you have a reach weapon, and even that is a trade off. New spells won't change these facts. I hope Jason chooses wisely when (not if) he reworks this ability.
While I agree that the ability is a bit weak, I see to quite good uses of this spell:
The first use of it however is to hold a charge of a touch spell, before entering battle.
Secondly, and most important, is combined with touch spells, that are usable over multiple rounds. Considering spells such as calcific touch or (perhaps?) flame blade, it provides with a rather potent bonus to his normal melee attack. Since these kind of spells grants a touch attack each round I don't think (albeit not being sure) that they require holding any charge. This way you might actually stack a number of touch spells into your melee attacks.
HaraldKlak wrote: Secondly, and most important, is combined with touch spells, that are usable over multiple rounds. Considering spells such as calcific touch or (perhaps?) flame blade, it provides with a rather potent bonus to his normal melee attack. Since these kind of spells grants a touch attack each round I don't think (albeit not being sure) that they require holding any charge. This way you might actually stack a number of touch spells into your melee attacks. A small correction : Flame blade does not grant you a touch attack. It grants you a weapon (a scimitar) which attacks against Touch AC.
In fact, with Spellstrike, you could use the scimitar of the Flame Blade to deliver the additional damage of your Shocking Grasp while still attacking Touch AC :-P
The only time I ever see Spellstrike coming into play is with a reach weapon.
And of course the Magus can't use his main ability when using a two handed weapon, and I'm not sure if you can combine Lunge with Spellstrike.
In other words, your only option is the whip. A weapon the Magus doesn't have proficiency with.
What went into designing this?
HaraldKlak wrote: While I agree that the ability is a bit weak, I see to quite good uses of this spell:
The first use of it however is to hold a charge of a touch spell, before entering battle.
Secondly, and most important, is combined with touch spells, that are usable over multiple rounds. Considering spells such as calcific touch or (perhaps?) flame blade, it provides with a rather potent bonus to his normal melee attack. Since these kind of spells grants a touch attack each round I don't think (albeit not being sure) that they require holding any charge. This way you might actually stack a number of touch spells into your melee attacks.
Using spell strike does not alter the amount of time you can hold the charge of a touch spell.
PRD wrote:
Touch Spells and Holding the Charge: In most cases, if you don't discharge a touch spell on the round you cast it, you can hold the charge (postpone the discharge of the spell) indefinitely. You can make touch attacks round after round until the spell is discharged. If you cast another spell, the touch spell dissipates.
Some touch spells allow you to touch multiple targets as part of the spell. You can't hold the charge of such a spell; you must touch all targets of the spell in the same round that you finish casting the spell.
All this ability does is change the AC you are trying to hit from touch AC (no armor bonus, shield bonus, or natural armor bonus) to normal AC.
PRD wrote:
Touch Attacks: Some attacks completely disregard armor, including shields and natural armor—the aggressor need only touch a foe for such an attack to take full effect. In these cases, the attacker makes a touch attack roll (either ranged or melee). When you are the target of a touch attack, your AC doesn't include any armor bonus, shield bonus, or natural armor bonus. All other modifiers, such as your size modifier, Dexterity modifier, and deflection bonus (if any) apply normally.
ProfessorCirno wrote:
What went into designing this? Delivering a spell through your weapon "sounds cool". Just look at the number of people who think this ability is "maybe a little weak" instead of mechanically flawed. Spells that have a touch attack are written that way for a reason - they would be useless to low BAB, low AC, low hit point casters otherwise. The concept of channeling magical energy through your weapon attack is cool. But the mechanics have to support the implementation, otherwise it becomes a waste of time and resources but you look good doing it.
Oh, and lunge should work with spell strike, or even with a normal touch attack. The problem is you can't get it till 8th level when your BAB reachs +6.
I propose that Spellstrike allows you to make the weapon attack against the touch AC.
Or would that be too powerful ?
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