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I make it no secret of who and what I am, I'm married to my husband, and love him dearly. However my mother is a very right wing conservative christian (which wouldn't bother me so much) but she first off after years of not speaking started contact me again. Anytime I talked with her she would preach (and not in a nice way, a borderline offensive way), or she would call me hateful slurs. Even when she would call and my husband would pick up the phone she would say awful things to him and tell him to put me on the phone. I would constantly tell her to cut it out, finally it got to a point about a month ago I said enough was enough. I told her that with the way she acts toward me and my husband it was impossible to have a relationship, and that until she learned to be less hateful and frankly just plain grow the f@#! up, she would no longer have contact with me. I think me exact words "Have a nice life, and forget my phone number". he now sends emails claiming I'm religiously persecuting her and her beliefs, she still calls (which I promptly hang up). And leaves messages on the phone to make me feel guilty. So I think I'm just going to change my number. Frankly i don't think I have the mental tolerance to deal with her, but yet a small part of me thinks I may be a bit to harsh about the situation what do you think?
Sounds like you did the right thing. What she's doing is abusive and no one should tolerate that especially from family. If she refuses to acknowledge this and continues than you should take actions to prevent it.
Perhaps one day she will learn that you can't change the people you love through hate.
Jeremy, you were not too harsh. Your mother renewed contact with you out of the blue. She then proceeds to sermonize and spew vitriol without cause. You didn't initiate this series of conversations, she did. She also said things to your husband. You showed restraint in letting things run as long as you did, and you took the mentally and emotionally sensible option of cutting from your life a source of mental and emotional stress. You told her to leave you be and attempted to return things to status quo. By calling and leaving messages your mother is reaching the point of harassment.
It's hard, sometimes, to deal with the fact that one's parent (or other close loved one) doesn't see things the same way as you do. It's unfortunately fairly common for loved ones to not understand us or our decisions and to criticize them. And what humans don't understand they have a good track record of attacking in an attempt to destroy. Your doing the right thing. Talk with your friends and family, minus the offender of course, get this all out in the open. And don't forget that your friends are the family you choose, not the one you were stuck with at birth. It really helps to remember that sometimes.
I'd say you did the right thing.
I'd say you did the right thing.
+1
You have set a perfectly reasonable boundary. You have nothing to apologize for. While it can be hard to draw a line like this it simply has to be done sometimes. It always amazes me how some family members think it is OK to say stuff to relatives and in-laws that would almost certainly start a fight if you said them to someone on the street. You are a grown man with your own family now. If she can't come to terms with that your only other option would seem to be allowing her abusive behavior toward your family to continue. I hope no one would expect that.
No you acted the only way you could.
Just being a dittohead on the already obvious sentiments. You did what you could do, Jeremy. Lathiira's last paragraph pretty much sums it up for me.
Yes. I think you were too harsh.
Does your mother have some issues that need to be dealt with, sure. But shutting her out of your life completely doesn't solve anything, it just sweeps the problem under the rug. I would suggest some form of counseling. Just the two of you. Accept the fact that she will never fully approve of your lifestyle, just as you will likely never fully accept hers. But that doesn't mean the two of you can't have some form of relationship. I shut my father out of my life for seven years and regret it every day, though I had very good reason for it. We've mended our fences now, but there is a huge gap between us that we will never be able to get rid of.
Of course this comes from another conservative Christian, so you could safely ignore me and do as you wish.
Contributor
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Yes. I think you were too harsh.
Does your mother have some issues that need to be dealt with, sure. But shutting her out of your life completely doesn't solve anything, it just sweeps the problem under the rug. I would suggest some form of counseling. Just the two of you. Accept the fact that she will never fully approve of your lifestyle, just as you will likely never fully accept hers. But that doesn't mean the two of you can't have some form of relationship. I shut my father out of my life for seven years and regret it every day, though I had very good reason for it. We've mended our fences now, but there is a huge gap between us that we will never be able to get rid of.
Of course this comes from another conservative Christian, so you could safely ignore me and do as you wish.
Not to derail the thread and with respect, Wulfthulu, but it isn't a lifestyle. Pottery barn is a lifestyle. Not having kids is a lifestyle. Taking lots of cruises is a lifestyle, if you see what I mean?
For my part, I'd like to add I think shutting her out pretty much solves the problem of not being emotionally and verbally assaulted and not having to stand by while your spouse is equally assaulted whenever she calls. It solves that problem pretty well.
Jeremy I'd say, no, not too harsh. You did the right thing. For what its worth, this is also coming from someone who didn't speak to his mother for five years (different reasons), there are also mended fences and a huge gap between us, but I don't regret it in the least.
If you wish to help yourself with your guilt or simply hope for a better future, you could consider leaving the door open a crack. "Forget my phone number until you can speak civilly," for example. Then leave your email live. She might surprise you and email when she can speak civilly. Only you can say if its worth it to you.
Of course, this comes for a died-in-the wool social liberal, who has witnessed first-hand the pain caused by close-minded family members to dear friends for years. This makes me harsh toward such abuse, so I may be worth ignoring. Either way, good luck! :)
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Yes. I think you were too harsh.
Does your mother have some issues that need to be dealt with, sure. But shutting her out of your life completely doesn't solve anything, it just sweeps the problem under the rug. I would suggest some form of counseling. Just the two of you. Accept the fact that she will never fully approve of your lifestyle, just as you will likely never fully accept hers. But that doesn't mean the two of you can't have some form of relationship. I shut my father out of my life for seven years and regret it every day, though I had very good reason for it. We've mended our fences now, but there is a huge gap between us that we will never be able to get rid of.
Of course this comes from another conservative Christian, so you could safely ignore me and do as you wish.
The thing is, most psychiatrists are not going to see her problem (religion) as something that can be treated. It is apparent that the only reason she contacted him again was to use him and his husband as a punching bag; maybe she was bored, maybe she feared for his soul, etc. etc. Point is it doesn't matter WHY, all that matters is what she did and is doing. Ask yourself this...if he had married a person of a different race rather than a person of the same sex, and his mother was calling and using racially derogatory slurs rather than sexually derogatory slurs, would your answer be the same?
@ Jeremy--you weren't too harsh...if anything you weren't harsh enough. I know I wouldn't have been able to keep my cool as you did.
@ Jeremy--you weren't too harsh...if anything you weren't harsh enough. I know I wouldn't have been able to keep my cool as you did.
+1
I would probably would have saved some of those 'nice' messages and
1) got her number blocked
2) laid charges
Remember her problems are her problems. And no matter how much you would like to make them your problems you can't. Why would you want to make them your problems? Because then you could fix them. But since they are not your problems only she can fix them.
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Hi Jeremy,
I am a conservative Christian. What you did was harsh. Although, based on what you said, it seems to have been warranted. Their is a name for what she is doing. It is called 'verbal abuse' and by her continuing to call and say these things I think that would be harassment. You should not tolerate that from anyone and it is terribly unfortunate that you have to deal with this from your mother.
Given the situation is what it is, here are my recommendations in order...
All of these need to be handled delicately and politely. Doing so will greatly increase your chances of success.
Explain to your mother that you would love to have a relationship with her on the condition that you will not tolerate any verbal abuse and that you think it would be best to start by the two of you getting together with a councilor. See if the counselor can help the two of you get to a place where you can talk peaceably.
If that is unsuccessful then go to see her pastor and explain the situation to him and ask if he can help. If he is a decent pastor he will help.
If you have had no success to this point you could try asking her to please consider her own sins before she calls you again. Then, when she calls, ask her about it. This one is tough though. If you are a Christian there is a huge biblical significance here. Whatever our sins may be, in the eyes of GOD, they are no better, no different, and no worse than hers. If you are not a Christian then she may just see you as being inflammatory. The hope is that through this statement she will take the time to think about it and come to the realization that she has an obligation to treat you with love.
Lastly, you may need to take legal action. The longer she keeps doing this the greater the chance the police will get involved for any number of reasons.
My prayers go out to you and all your family.
Eric
EDIT: +1 to ignoring me also.
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[S]he now sends emails claiming I'm religiously persecuting her and her beliefs, she still calls (which I promptly hang up). And leaves messages on the phone to make me feel guilty.
This is what makes it obvious to me you've done the right thing. She doesn't see the hypocrisy in telling you how your life is wrong; that she is persecuting your beliefs. You've done nothing wrong, I understand there is the little bit of guilt because she is your mother, but shes the one who is persecuting you. Telling someone to leave you alone is NOT persecution, its being the bigger person in this situation as I see it.
She is trying to force her beliefs down the OPs throat here, I fail to see how anyone can say that HE is being to harsh. Im not religious, and I have no problems with people who are. The self-admitted christans who replied did so respectfully, and with out preaching. Your opinions are no less valid than anyone elses that has replied, so no need to ignore them.
I have problems that come in situations like the OPs mother, who is trying to force her beliefs on someone else who has made it abundantly clear they arent interested. She is belittling her OWN SON and his lifestyle, and from what I can gather from the OPs telling of the situation, has done nothing but hark on this since she reestablished contact.
Fault solely lies with the mother in this particular situation.
he now sends emails claiming I'm religiously persecuting her and her beliefs
Ah yes, the old “If you don’t sit there and put up with me persecuting you for not sharing my beliefs then you are persecuting me” argument. That one never gets old.
For the record, no you weren’t too harsh. If things played out like you said they did and you gave her plenty of warning that this would be the outcome should she continue her verbal abuse then your only other option would be one of cowardice.
Still, she is your mother, and down the road should she figure out that her love for you is stronger than her disagreement with what gender you are attracted too I believe you should be ready to give her another chance.
A mother only a son could love.
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Jeremy, I just wanted to say that I've also had to find a way to make peace with a very critical, controlling mother, and there isn't a right answer. You did what you had to in the moment to protect yourself, and now with a little distance from it, you feel stronger and wonder if you could have done it better. There wasn't a good way to do it, and it had to be done. Please feel some peace within yourself. It will do you good to get a break from her. At some future time, maybe you'll want to connect again. That's what happened to me, and eventually, my mother realized that she was going to have to control herself if she was going to have a good relationship with me.
By the way, I happen to be a very conservative Christian mom. You did okay here. A good therapist could help you make more sense out of it. Take care.
You used some harsh, ugly language (grow the blank up, etc.)in response to ugliness. You could have handled the situation more civilly and diplomatically, but you are also justified in severing relations. That is a separate issue. At this point it really doesn't matter; you have ended a relationship with someone who sounds vile and incapable of being in adult relationships, which is good. However, for your own sake, and as difficult as it is (and I realize how difficult it is), in the future you might want to take a deep breath and consider your choice of words more carefully when you are upset and engaged in an emotionally charged exchange. Talking to people that way is ultimately self-destructive, even if they seem to deserve it. You will respect yourself more, command more respect, and be more effective in relationships if you can refrain from using that kind of language.
Jeremy,
First let me say how sorry I am that your even having to go through this.
You feel guilt over having to cut her out of your life but sometimes we have to do whats best for us no matter what.
My mother was a very conservative christian woman and when I told her she was so understanding it was an incredable relief, aparently I wasn't as discreet as I had thought.
PFLAG is a great resource as are several books in you local christian book store. I would talk to HER pastor and find out if she is getting these ideas from him and if not maybe he can help, after all forgivness is supposedly a big thing for christians.
Which brings me to my next point, don't fall into the trap of "oh I'm being persecuted" by group X, it's real easy to lump everybody into the same group but everytime someone says something about the mean christians I always say that people are people and right or wrong are entitled to their beleifs. I think about all the great friends I have and had that are very devout in their christian faith and they don't hate me anymore now than they did growing up. I know your mother is being a pain and yes you are doing the right thing for you but please don't let this affect your veiws of all christians. Trust me I can point you to a few millitant wiccans if you'd like.
Best wishes to you and if you just wanna rant were here to listen.
Gah, as a person with the Right Ring Conservative Christan label, I hate it when other people with my label think that they have to harass people and shove religion down their throats, lol. I'm sorry that you're having to go through this.
I think your response was probably justified. However, I think there might be ways to handle the situation that would let you be able to stay in contact with your Mother withour her constantly trying to shove her beliefs on you. This of course, assumes that she is reasonable in any way.
If you happen to talk with her again, maybe you should point out that the way she is trying to spread her beliefs is likely to make people (and you specifically) dislike Christians rather than whatever effect she is hoping for. Preaching to people's faces when they aren't in the mood to hear it will just alienate loved ones.
Well, that might not be the best way to explain it to her. I'm just saying that if you can get her to realize that she's the one causing the problems (as opposed to you being intolerant like she seems to believe), then the situation might get resolved rather cleanly. If she can't realize that...well, then you're probably justified in changing your phone number and setting an auto delete on her emails, lol.
Frankly i don't think I have the mental tolerance to deal with her, but yet a small part of me thinks I may be a bit to harsh about the situation what do you think?
Life's too short to put up with s&#! like that, whoever it's from. If she can't be bothered to do anything but harass you and your husband, why should you give her the time of day?
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Frankly i don't think I have the mental tolerance to deal with her, but yet a small part of me thinks I may be a bit to harsh about the situation what do you think?
You are not wrong at all.
However, this is your mother. Even though she may be a [insert naughty word here], she is still your mother. If memory serves me right, your relationship with your father ended poorly even though he (seemed to) want to try to amend things. I don't think that you should have to put up with her crap -- but I don't know that its best to sever all forms of communication with her either. Hang in there and I hope that it works out for you.
I make it no secret of who and what I am, I'm married to my husband, and love him dearly. However my mother is a very right wing conservative christian (which wouldn't bother me so much) but she first off after years of not speaking started contact me again. Anytime I talked with her she would preach (and not in a nice way, a borderline offensive way), or she would call me hateful slurs. Even when she would call and my husband would pick up the phone she would say awful things to him and tell him to put me on the phone. I would constantly tell her to cut it out, finally it got to a point about a month ago I said enough was enough. I told her that with the way she acts toward me and my husband it was impossible to have a relationship, and that until she learned to be less hateful and frankly just plain grow the f&&! up, she would no longer have contact with me. I think me exact words "Have a nice life, and forget my phone number". he now sends emails claiming I'm religiously persecuting her and her beliefs, she still calls (which I promptly hang up). And leaves messages on the phone to make me feel guilty. So I think I'm just going to change my number. Frankly i don't think I have the mental tolerance to deal with her, but yet a small part of me thinks I may be a bit to harsh about the situation what do you think?
Nope; you're just fine. The problems are on her end.
I'm a conservative, militant pagan
So when some liberal white witch pansy gets into your way, do you perform a bold face pagan stomp on 'em? ;) /threadjack
Personally, I would have told her to die in a fire after eating a bag of barbeque flavored dicks. Which is funny on two levels, if you think about it!
I'm going to have to steal that; I did find that funny. :p
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First I'd like to say thanks to all the responses, it feels good to be somewhat reassured. I would have loved the councilor option however i live about 2 days travel from my mom. So that kind of makes it hard to establish such a thing. And secondly I do feel very protective of my husband he's the love of my life and maybe 165 pounds soaking wet, he has also been jumped by a group of thugs in the recent past, so anyone attacking him in anyway really makes me react in a not so nice way. Frankly I don't mind if my mother even held her beliefs to herself and just not preach at me and call me harassing slurs. But any conversation I try to have about anything else gets drowned out by her bitter attitude. Seriously my brother had his first child, her first grand child at the beginning of May, she called and talked about for literally 2 minutes before starting on me, and no amount of trying to change the subject would sway her. I've tried to talk to her pastor before, he seems very disinterested in talking with me. So this was my last option, I'm leaving the continent soon, and I'm seriously just considering having an unlisted number in the UK. Just so I never have to deal with it, after all the BS I've put up with from her (including being kicked out of the house at 17 for being gay, and then having to live on student welfare in a low-class apartment for my senior high school year) I still love the woman, glutton for punishment I guess. Sorry for bothering you guys my friends are out of town for the summer, and my husband is away til august the 12th so I literally had no other outlet.
Your frustration makes all too much sense, sir.
You can at least provide a separate / alternate e-mail address for her to contact you if you want to go that route by keeping your residential and phone number unlisted when you relocate to Scotland.
I'm leaving the continent soon, and I'm seriously just considering having an unlisted number in the UK. Just so I never have to deal with it, after all the BS I've put up with from her (including being kicked out of the house at 17 for being gay, and then having to live on student welfare in a low-class apartment for my senior high school year) I still love the woman, glutton for punishment I guess.
It's better to love someone who doesn't deserve it than to become one of those bitter souls who can't find it in themselves to love anyone. It sounds as though your mother has serious issues, soul-deep pain which she takes out on you.
Your mother's outrageous behavior has to stop before you can have a relationship with her. You have NO moral requirement to be her punching bag, verbal or otherwise. An occasional argument or tactless comment is one thing, but repeated verbal abuse is another.
I think that you would probably regret cutting off all ties, but until she changes her tone, your dealings with her need to be brief, clear, and respectful. In your position, I'd just let her have your Email address.
If you haven't gone to counseling, you might want to consider such. Your history has given you some serious knocks, and you might be more able to deal with your mother's issues with a counselor at your side. If your experiences haven't turned you away from Christianity, a more accepting denomination may offer religious counseling that could allow a way past your mother's rabid dogmatism.
Jeremy, I think you did the right thing. Obviously, your mother is sadly unable to cope with the fact that you are gay. Until she relents and at least tries to accept that fact (and I don´t think the word lifestyle is correct here, as sexual orientation is just part of your core being, not something you choose for some reason ore another), you are probably better off severing all contact to her. Maybe your brother can tell her how you feel about it and why you choose to act like you did, if you have a better relationship to him, or you might write her a letter (like in snail mail, in this day and age real letters are special again). Until she tries to make contact saying that she can accept you now again, I would not allow any contact. It is very sad, as it is family and blood runs thicker than water, but enduring abusive family members never ends good.
Stefan
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So I think I'm just going to change my number. Frankly i don't think I have the mental tolerance to deal with her, but yet a small part of me thinks I may be a bit to harsh about the situation what do you think?
I think that the fact that you feel bad is proof that you are a good person, not an indication that you were wrong.
To me, severing contact is probably the easiest way for you to live a happier life. Others have proposed above solutions that might lead to reconciliation (or at least peace) but would be much harder to implement.
If you want to stay in touch, you can always get a premium rate phone-number over here that you only give out to her and then donate the proceeds to one of the charities over here that promote gay rights :)
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Jeremy, it sounds like you and I have some similar background. My mother used to do the same thing to me and it finally got so terrible that I had to just disappear so she couldn't find me for a while. She eventually found me and attempted to re-build our relationship but that didn't end well either.
There is more to the tale, but I would like to avoid going into too much detail here. I have an acute sense of what you are going through right now. I know how much it hurts to have your own mother, the person who is supposed to love and support you, turn against you in that way.
If you need someone to talk to about this, just let me know and we can get into contact with each other.