Notice in the list of feats is `Improved Initiative` and then wasn't sure if they go on my turn or not.
This might get interesting when your Animal Companion is your mount.
I let animal companions, familiars, summons, etc go on the PC's initiative. Makes things easier for everyone involved :)
I generally have animal companions and familiars go at the same time as the PC. However, if the player wants to have their companion or familiar go on their own initiative, I generally allow it so long as it's not disrupting the flow of combat.
Yes, basically most groups either have very detailed initiative or group initiative.
If the DM rolls for each creature on it's own then the players usually roll for their pets separate as well.
If the DM only rolls for the ogre, the hag, then all the 6 orcs as one unit, then each player usually rolls for everything they control at one time using the main character as the base. And in this case Improved Initiative is a poor choice for your pet. :)
Actualy animal companions have their own initiative but its very common that they play on your turn. It's up to the player and the DM to choose if the companions play on your turn or not. In case the companion's is a pet and its initiave is higher than yours it can play before you but you can not act on its turn. If the companion is your mount it can play before you and get you closer to the action or drop you(if flying) but even in that case you act on your initiative not before (this actually is very good if you want to take the full-round attack action).
So pets can play either on their turn or on your own but you can never act on theirs
|
I have player's roll initiative for an animal companion, since traditionally you tell it what to do and it does it to the best of it's abilities. It has an initiative score after all.
You use handle animal on your turn and then on it's initiative it acts. If you don't tell it to do anything and it knows the defend trick, it protects you. If it gets attacked it fights back unless commanded otherwise.
The number of times I've run into druids (and some rangers) who don't even bother to read how the handle animal skill works and seem to think they've got a familiar instead of an animal companion...ugh it gets to be too much at times.
The number of times I've run into druids (and some rangers) who don't even bother to read how the handle animal skill works and seem to think they've got a familiar instead of an animal companion...ugh it gets to be too much at times.
Ahh I so agree.
I have a PC druid in the game I'm GMing. Hes only been playing tabletop RPGs for about a year now, and this is his first druid. Although the druid has a Domain instead of an animal companion, he does like to summon stuff. He summoned a Tiger once, and then wanted it to do a particularly detailed maneuver (attack then move away from the target to a specific square, I think) so I asked him to make a Handle Animal check, since he couldn't speak a language the Tiger could understand.
He had no ranks in Handle Animal. As an 8th level druid. And we all laughed at him.
I think its an important skill for anyone with an animal companion to have. Animal Companions are not familiars and are not extensions of their master's person, and the Handle Animal skill is necessary to get the animal to do what the master wants. Its also necessary to train the Animal Companion to learn tricks (aside from the free bonus tricks for being an Animal Companion). I'll let a Druid starting with an animal companion have one thats already trained. But a Ranger getting one at 4th, or someone replacing an animal companion will have to take the time and make the checks to have the animal trained properly.
Rangers don't need as much HA as a druid does, since they aren't summoning and don't need to control strange animals as often. Basically, a Ranger needs enough to control his AC. Its a DC 10 to get the AC to do something hes trained to do (DC 12 if it has any lethal or nonlethal damage), so with the +4 for being the AC and a +3 class bonus on the skill, it only takes a few ranks to get to where that check can't fail. And if the Ranger can make the DC 10 without chance of failure, it can take 10 to train the AC to learn any of the tricks. The Druid needs much more though, as when it summons untrained animals in order to direct them to do more than just attack the Druid must use the HA skill to 'push' the animal, which requires a DC 25 (or 27 if its injured) check. Or the Druid would have to be under the effects of a speak with animals spell.
As to the OP's question: technically animal companions should go on their own initiative count. However, it can make things easier to have the AC go on its owner's initiative. And its not uncommon for a player to have its AC hold until its owner's turn, or vice versa, to get things lined up properly. But generally an animal companion should do whatever trick it was last commanded to do until it gets new instructions, so even if it wins initiative it should still follow its previous orders unless something overrides that, such as a fear effect, until the owner gives new commands.
(I'd make an exception for an AC being used as a mount. In that case I'd go by the rules for Mounted Combat using the Ride skill, so long as the animal was trained for such, and it would go on its riders initiative.)
I do think it adds to the verisimilitude of the game when an AC acts on its own initiative and performs tasks after its been instructed, on a different initiative count from its owner.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
He had no ranks in Handle Animal. As an 8th level druid. And we all laughed at him.
Did you, as DM, discuss this with him before hand? You said it's his first druid and that he's been playing for only a year.
When I have a player take on a class they haven't played, especially when they are still relatively new, I make sure I cover important points with them so that situations like that don't happen.
I also go over my players' character sheets every time they level to make sure that they are doing their math right and to help them if they are trying to accomplish something but I don't think they are going to get there with their skills, feats, classes, etc.
I would rather prevent humiliating one of my players.
He had no ranks in Handle Animal. As an 8th level druid. And we all laughed at him.Did you, as DM, discuss this with him before hand? You said it's his first druid and that he's been playing for only a year.
When I have a player take on a class they haven't played, especially when they are still relatively new, I make sure I cover important points with them so that situations like that don't happen.
I also go over my players' character sheets every time they level to make sure that they are doing their math right and to help them if they are trying to accomplish something but I don't think they are going to get there with their skills, feats, classes, etc.
I would rather prevent humiliating one of my players.
It wasn't a humiliating experience for him, it was a funny one. We don't play our games like that.
And I've helped him out in numerous ways, often giving him a chance to think about something he wants to do before he actually does it so that he can work through it a little bit, whereas I won't give such leeway to the more experienced gamers. e.g. pulling out a scroll while swimming, casting a spell while threatened, etc..
He made his druid as a replacement character for one that had died, and he made it during a gaming session, so no chance for me to review it in depth beforehand. He thought since he didn't have an animal companion because he took a domain instead that he wouldn't need the skill. Now he knows better and has been putting ranks into it.
|
Generally I have the player roll 2 initiatives and try to get them to keep in mind that the druid directs the companion as part of his turn. So if the companion gets initiative it should act like a well trained animal responding, not as if it were directed.
For eidolons and familiars or intelligent companions they can act on their own.
It wasn't a humiliating experience for him, it was a funny one. We don't play our games like that.
And I've helped him out in numerous ways, often giving him a chance to think about something he wants to do before he actually does it so that he can work through it a little bit, whereas I won't give such leeway to the more experienced gamers. e.g. pulling out a scroll while swimming, casting a spell while threatened, etc..
He made his druid as a replacement character for one that had died, and he made it during a gaming session, so no chance for me to review it in depth beforehand. He thought since he didn't have an animal companion because he took a domain instead that he wouldn't need the skill. Now he knows better and has been putting ranks into it.
Fair enough. I've had and seen DMs and groups pretty much treat the new guys as if they should be born with an understanding of the game. I'm glad that I misunderstood the situation. My apologies.
I used to do the "act on the same turn" route that others have mentioned. But with the advent of summoners, I'm moving to the two initiative route. Familiars should also get a second initiative, but they seldom participate in combat -- so I don't bother.
Yes, handle animal and the "defend" trick are important. If the animal's initiative beats yours and he is set to defend the front-line fighter, he will automatically attack. Otherwise, you must use a free action on your turn to order him to attack -- and typically the animal companion would delay until your turn if he beat your initiative (except for the defend trick).
Also, the animal companion is technically controlled by the GM. The druid can give the animal companions commands -- but the druid can't actually determine the exact behavior of what the animal does. This is also true of other external creatures.
I use a separate initiative for an animal companion, but often I have the animal delay if it acts before its master.
|
I've always ruled animal companions delay until their owner's initiative unless the owner has specifically trained it to react in a way to surprising combat. Once that occurs they're now acting instantly after the druid.
I have players that typically get scout companions anyway. Trapspringer the owl is fairly effective.
I've never taken GM control of an animal companion. I wouldn't take GM control of a player's sword or armor. It's their class feature, let them play it.
Granted I do require that I know what tricks an animal companion knows. If it doesn't know attack, it doesn't know attack. Simple as that.
Notice in the list of feats is `Improved Initiative` and then wasn't sure if they go on my turn or not.
This might get interesting when your Animal Companion is your mount.
Ask your DM before you pick the feat :) My Druid's DM does not allow separate initiative, which is fine (only slightly annoying that my +0 dex hinders the cat's +3).
On the flip side, *you* taking Improved Initiative affects you both.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Nice job with the 7 year Thread-Necro.
;P
