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Don't confuse the word "attack" with the type of action that you use to make it/them.
The Table 8-2 on page 183, under Standard Actions, says an "Attack (ranged)" provokes an AoO. Note that it says that it is the Attack, not Action that provokes the AoO. Thus we know that "Ranged Attack = AoO".
Under Standard Actions on page 182 it says "Making an attack is a standard action".
Clearly, this means if you use a Standard Action to fire a Ranged Attack, that Attack provokes an AoO. Note again that the Action does not provoke, it is the Ranged Attack that provokes.
Now, on page 184 it says "A character who can make more than one attack per round must use the full-attack action". We can read all about that action on page 187, and nowhere in the description does it say that we're talking about melee or ranged attacks.
But there is one thing we do know from this text: a Full-attack is made up of "more than one attack per round". That's critical. We are using one action (a Full-Round Action) but we are making more than one attack. The RAW says so. And the only text we have in the RAW that describes "Ranged attacks" says that a ranged attack provokes an AoO. That text does not limit the number in any way. "Ranged Attack = AoO" is all it says.
Back in the chart on page 183, under Full-Round Actions, it says a "Full attack" does not provoke an AoO. Unlike Standard Actions, which clearly listed separate types of attacks (Melee, Ranged, and Unarmed), the Full-Round Actions does not list the attack types. I would say this is an oversight.
However, oversight or not, we have to make a ruling.
Ruling 1 (the lame and incorrect one): Since a full-attack does not provoke (according to Table 8-2), then a full attack with a ranged weapon does not provoke. At all. Oddly enough, this means that firing muore than one arrow is safer than only firing one, or means that anyone who just stands there and declares a full attack, even if they only make one shot, never provokes. Obviously, this is not how this rule is intended to be interpreted.
Ruling 2 (not lame but wrong): Only the first ranged attack of a Full-attack provokes; subsequent attacks do not. While I can see how the RAW might be interpreted this way, there is no text anywhere in the RAW to support this ruling. In fact, the "Ranged Attack = AoO" text in the RAW contradicts this ruling so we must go with either ruling 1 (lame and incorrect) or ruling 3 (correct).
Ruling 3 (the correct one): Each ranged attack of a Full-attack action provokes an AoO. We already know that "Ranged Attack = AoO" because the rules say so. And we know that a Full-attack action is "more than one attack per round". Thus, it is simple math; just use basic substition:
"More than one (Ranged Attack) per round = (more than one) AoO (per round)".
QED.
I agree with the OP, this would have been less argumentative if the attack types had not been omitted from the Full-Round actions on Table 8-2.
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... does a Full Attack Action encompass multiple attack actions OR is it something completely different.
The answer is, no.
This is why:
Provoking an Attack of Opportunity: Two kinds of
actions can provoke attacks of opportunity: moving out
of a threatened square and performing certain actions
within a threatened square.
Moving: Moving out of a threatened square usually
provokes attacks of opportunity from threatening
opponents. There are two common methods of avoiding
such an attack—the 5-foot step and the withdraw action.
Performing a Distracting Act: Some actions, when performed
in a threatened square, provoke attacks of opportunity as
you divert your attention from the battle. Table 8–2 notes
many of the actions that provoke attacks of opportunity.
Remember that even actions that normally provoke
attacks of opportunity may have exceptions to this rule.
Basically what this is telling us is that AoOs are provoked by individual actions actions.
Combat Ref lexes and Additional Attacks of Opportunity:
If you have the Combat Reflexes feat, you can add your
Dexterity modifier to the number of attacks of opportunity
you can make in a round. This feat does not let you make
more than one attack for a given opportunity,
but if the
same opponent provokes two attacks of opportunity
from
you, you could make two separate
attacks of opportunity
(since each one represents a different
opportunity).
Moving out of more than one square threatened by the
same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more
than one opportunity for that opponent. All these attacks
are at your full normal attack bonus.
What this tells us is that a single action can only provoke one AoO. I.e. moving through three threatened squares with a single action only provokes one AoO; Likewise only one ranged attack in a full-attack action provokes an AoO.
The system plays out like this:
- Making 3 ranged attacks with a bow in a threatened square with a full-attack action; provokes 1 AoO.
- Running through an ogre's 6 threatened squares with a single move action; provokes 1 AoO.
- Running through an ogre's 6 threatened squares with a two move action; provokes 2 AoO.
- Moving out of a threated square and into another threatened square with a move action, then casting an acid arrow spell without defensive casting, and then fireing the acid arrow at an opponent; provokes 3 AoO.
Off the top of my head I cannot figure out a way to provoke more than 3 AoOs from a single opponent. (Bear in mind that Combat Reflexes is ussually necesary in order to make more than one AoO)
EDIT: Until now I was also of the mind that an archer making a full-attack would provoke an AoO for each shot made, but after reading it through again and considering the text I think that this is one more subtle change in Pathfinder.
lots of stuff
By your interpretation then, if I make trip attempts with each attack on my full attack, do they each provoke, or only the first?
I say each ranged attack provokes, just like each trip attempt would
lots of stuffBy your interpretation then, if I make trip attempts with each attack on my full attack, do they each provoke, or only the first?
I say each ranged attack provokes, just like each trip attempt would
Yeah, that is true. I missed one thing:
Combat Ref lexes and Additional Attacks of Opportunity:
If you have the Combat Reflexes feat, you can add your
Dexterity modifier to the number of attacks of opportunity
you can make in a round. This feat does not let you make
more than one attack for a given opportunity, but if the
same opponent provokes two attacks of opportunity from
you, you could make two separate attacks of opportunity
(since each one represents a different opportunity).
Moving out of more than one square threatened by the
same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more
than one opportunity for that opponent. All these attacks
are at your full normal attack bonus.
The last part about movement is an obvious exception to the rule presented (emphasis in bold case).
I admit to a brain fart :)
...a number of us played 3.5 and in 3.5 it was quite clear that multiple ranged attacks within a threatened area would provoke multiple AoO's.
My group is still running 3.5 and I was DM for a session this week and this very issue arose. I thought the above interpretation was correct, but my player disagreed vehemently. I ended up bowing to the pressure to both speed game play and not cause a real argument, but the whole thing really stuck in my craw.
I've looked through the PHB, but I cannot find a clear cut ruling on this. Can anyone help me out with backing this up with the RAW? I'd really appreciate it. [/minor threadjack]
Thanks James - that sums up my thoughts. The concept that an opponent could wait until the second shot for the AoO pretty much seals the argument in my mind.
I started a discussion on another thread that raised a question that is best discussed here.
If someone uses a whip to make a trip attack while the target threatens the whip wielder, would that provoke one or two attacks of opportunities?
Some argued that it would provoke two. They said it provokes once because attack with a whip provokes AOOs like a ranged attack. And then it also provokes because making a combat maneuver provokes an AOO.
But it seems to me these are not two separate actions, just two reasons why the attack provokes. If the person had Improved Trip but used the whip to make the attack, they would still provoke due to the rules about whips.
Someone in the above post mentioned casting a spell that has a ranged attack and suggested that would provoke once for the spell and once for the range attack. But it sounds to me like the thrown part of the spell is still part of the spell action and so would not provoke separately from the casting of the spell. Maybe if you used Defensive casting, you could avoid the AOO for casting the spell but then provoke for the thrown part.
So two questions:
1) can using a whip to make a combat maneuver provoke two attacks of opportunity
2) and can casting a spell that requires a ranged touch attack as part of the spell promote two AOOs?
I started a discussion on another thread that raised a question that is best discussed here.
If someone uses a whip to make a trip attack while the target threatens the whip wielder, would that provoke one or two attacks of opportunities?
Some argued that it would provoke two. They said it provokes once because attack with a whip provokes AOOs like a ranged attack. And then it also provokes because making a combat maneuver provokes an AOO.
But it seems to me these are not two separate actions, just two reasons why the attack provokes. If the person had Improved Trip but used the whip to make the attack, they would still provoke due to the rules about whips.
Someone in the above post mentioned casting a spell that has a ranged attack and suggested that would provoke once for the spell and once for the range attack. But it sounds to me like the thrown part of the spell is still part of the spell action and so would not provoke separately from the casting of the spell. Maybe if you used Defensive casting, you could avoid the AOO for casting the spell but then provoke for the thrown part.
So two questions:
1) can using a whip to make a combat maneuver provoke two attacks of opportunity
2) and can casting a spell that requires a ranged touch attack as part of the spell promote two AOOs?
1) you'd provoke twice, each provocation part provokes and doesn't care about what else is provoking. So using a whip provokes and tripping provokes. Each are viewed separately to determine if they provoke, thus they both do.
2)you provoke twice. There's an official FAQ that the ranged attack of a spell is a separate AoO from casting the spell.EDIT: also such old threads really aren't the place for continuing things. Much could have come out to clarify or change things that were said. It's best to search on your own, and then ask in a recent thread or create a new thread.
Chess Pwn is correct, both in his understanding of the rules as well as the bit about casting necrothread.
Yes, let me rest in peace. I need my beauty sleep.
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Yes, let me rest in peace. I need my beauty sleep.
I am still infinitely jealous of you owning that avatar name.
