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Reading, new Pathfinder Paladin i've come up to the conclusion that he only needs Charisma ability and can ignore the rest of its abilities.
Charisma adds to Saves, so he can ignore Dex, Con and Wis for increase them.
Charisma is used for spells now, so he has no need of Wisdom.
When Smiting comes the better part.
Char add to AC and attacks. So he can ignore Dex and Str and still be rather competent.
So, it feels a bit like 3.5 Druid using Beast shape in means of ignoring stats.
Adding it to his healing capabilities a Paladin is rather powerfull, mainly against solo evil enemies.
You still need STR to hit and wound things and CON to have some reasonable amount of HP as a front-line fighter.
Not to mention to wander around in full plate and use Power Attack :)
Bad idea. The paladin is best with high strength and charisma, decent constitution and dexterity depending on the armour you prefer. Never forget that your smitings are limited. Sure, against the big bad dragon you will do fine. When hacking your way through groups of enemies you will quickly become a liability. And never forget that Smite Evil is exactly what the name implies. It's not Smite Slaadi, Smite Dumbass Who Stands in My Way or Smite Monster That Tries to Eat Innocents Because It's Hungry. It smites EVIL only. So building your character around an ability that only works against opponents who are specifically evil and that can only be used against seven enemies a day on level 20 is a really bad idea, unless you want to stand in the back and heal whenever the conditions aren't optimal.
I have played a paladin to the end (1-20).
Charisma is your best. But Makes Sure STr and Con are Good as well. You dont want to use your smite on lousy evil monster, who should be dead anyay. Plus its smites evil only as already told.
Er, congrats on making a character with no AC, no health, and no damage or attack options.
But, uh, I suppose you sure can smite two or three monsters a day if they're evil! Right"?
Er, congrats on making a character with no AC, no health, and no damage or attack options.
Oh, right, I forgot, low strength also means that you can get problems with wearing heavy armor. And the AC bonus from smite evil only works against the target of the smite, so all its friends will be happy to hit you. :D
Reading, new Pathfinder Paladin i've come up to the conclusion that he only needs Charisma ability and can ignore the rest of its abilities.
Charisma adds to Saves, so he can ignore Dex, Con and Wis for increase them.
Charisma is used for spells now, so he has no need of Wisdom.
When Smiting comes the better part.
Char add to AC and attacks. So he can ignore Dex and Str and still be rather competent.
So, it feels a bit like 3.5 Druid using Beast shape in means of ignoring stats.
Adding it to his healing capabilities a Paladin is rather powerfull, mainly against solo evil enemies.
Congratulations! You have built a character that can easily outperform commoners. And against a few enemies each day, he can even come close to the warrior NPC class!
The only problem is that the other party members, who can east warriors for breakfast, will pity you. If you can live with that, you're a great party mascot!
Strength is still important. Charisma and level might add to attacks/damage when smiting, but you only get to smite one creature at first, and later it will be a few more. If your GM only ever throws a single one-critter encounter at you each day, you can do okay. Okay, in this case, means that you're still worse than a fighter (who performs at the same level all day long). If there are more enemies than that, then you can as well sit those out, because your performance will be pathetic.
No, strength remains important for melee (and for strength-based skills, and carrying capacity) all the time. Your smite bonuses are just that - bonuses. It's what the paladin gets on top of the normal melee bonuses everyone gets. Fighters get feats and weapon training, barbarians get rage, rangers get favoured enemies and bonus feats, paladins get smite. If you leave strength at 10 or so, you will only get your special bonus to these attacks. The fighter will get his special bonus AND his strength. He will be the better warrior than you. And a paladin is supposed to be on par with a fighter when smiting, maybe even better!
Dexterity is no less important than before. Of course, to the standard palain, dexterity was never that important: Dex saves are the worst saves, anyway, the fighting style isn't too dependant on winning initiative, AC is gained mainly with armour, and other applications of dexterity don't matter to the archetypical paladin, either.
Of course, if you play an archer paladin, or a two-weapon paladin, or a finesse paladin (I played a paladin-duelist recently. Very nice!), you need dexterity as much as a fighter or other warrior with the respective style would need: You might need it to get the right feats, the AC boost (especially for enemies you don't smite), the initiative bonus, or just to get your basic attack modifier (like strenght for a strength-based warrior).
Constitution stays just as important for a paladin as for everybody else. Fortitude is already good, I give you that, but can it hurt to have even better fortitude? Of course not. And it definitely helps to have more HP! Especially if you don't go for the dizzying hights of AC a smiting paladin can have - and again, you will not always be smiting.
Intelligence - well, paladin abilities don't really boost anything int-based, and most paladins have no need for intelligence, and wouldn't have even without their charisma-fueled powers.
Wisdom - yes, wisdim isn't as important to paladins as it used to be, with charisma now governing paladin magic and paladins getting strong will saves. But since you already need charisma, strength and constitution (and at least a small bonus in dex), I think that was made so paladins don't have to stretch too thin.
Agree with the rest. Currently playing a pally and about the only dump stat for me is Int. For sure you want to focus on Cha but don't forget the other stuff.
Smite is great...just make sure you don't waste it because you don't realize that you don't really need to Smite a hell hound or manticore (because you made Int your dump stat and there isn't a wizard around to tell you any better).
M
Me I would never dump int. Wis yes, but int no. Paladin has a great list of class skills so I want all the skill points I can get.
As for str I agree with KaeYoss. Waht he didn't tell you is....you will need Power attack. So now tell you: You need Power attack!
No str no Power attack.
Me I would never dump int. Wis yes, but int no. Paladin has a great list of class skills so I want all the skill points I can get.
As for str I agree with KaeYoss. Waht he didn't tell you is....you will need Power attack. So now tell you: You need Power attack!
No str no Power attack.
That and STR stacks with your smite bonus hit/damage as well as working all day long and increasing your CMB/CMD.. STR is your friend as a melee pally. CHA/STR both could be your primary but the other should be your secondary stat.
Of course you need strength to hurt someone! Otherwise I could only hurt one person a day? Where's the fun in that?!
Why is the Paladin Stupid?
Ups. I though this thread was in PFRPG messageboard.
I've moved the tread. You can also flag a post as 'Thread is in wrong forum.'
You still need STR to hit and wound things and CON to have some reasonable amount of HP as a front-line fighter.Agree with CON for HP, but smiting he can ignore STR and rely in CHA and his Paladin level.
Ups. I though this thread was in PFRPG messageboard.
Aside from the fact that a paladin can smite a limited number of targets and times per day? You still need your basic stat to hit. You need dex to fill out armor, and you need strength to fill out your damage. A paladin without strength will be outclassed all the time, even when smiting.