just spells per day, and caster lvl.
I have a quick question. when i start taking levels in the msyteic theurge, what stacks and what doesnt? For example in order to determine you spells per day, you add you wizard level to your mystic theurge level.
What else stack? or is it only the spell casting,
Thanks
Well, you also add your Cleric level.....but you knew that.
I assume you are referring to the Domain granted powers and school special abilities. I believe it has been established that those are strictly tied to class level (i.e. Wiz/Clr). James Jacobs and others have said that these classes 'now have reasons to stay single classed', so these are the reasons. Otherwise, you're back to the old 3.x "why in hell would you be a 12th level wizard?!?" thing.
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Thanks. That is what i suspected. I just wanted some confirmation. Is there anything like the feats "practiced Spell caster" and "obtain Famiiar" in Pathfinder? I know they exist in 3.5, but this character is a pathfinder organized play character and I don't think i am free to dip into 3.5 closed content D&D source books. I know that a home game would be different.
Thanks
Thanks. That is what i suspected. I just wanted some confirmation. Is there anything like the feats "practiced Spell caster" and "obtain Famiiar" in Pathfinder? I know they exist in 3.5, but this character is a pathfinder organized play character and I don't think i am free to dip into 3.5 closed content D&D source books. I know that a home game would be different.
There is a "Magical Knack" trait that adds +2 caster level to a single class (limit of HD).
You could also talk to your DM about using Magic Rating (search for Magic Rating in the link), which lets caster levels stack together from different classes. I find that the best (and well balanced) solution.
No "obtain familiar" option, but you could take an arcane bond item instead of familiar, the strongest benefit of that continues to go up with your caster level.
Edit: For the record, you do get domain spell slots and specialty school slots (a change from the Beta version).
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Thanks. That is what i suspected. I just wanted some confirmation. Is there anything like the feats "practiced Spell caster" and "obtain Famiiar" in Pathfinder? I know they exist in 3.5, but this character is a pathfinder organized play character and I don't think i am free to dip into 3.5 closed content D&D source books. I know that a home game would be different.There is a "Magical Knack" trait that adds +2 caster level to a single class (limit of HD).
You could also talk to your DM about using Magic Rating (search for Magic Rating in the link), which lets caster levels stack together from different classes. I find that the best (and well balanced) solution.
No "obtain familiar" option, but you could take an arcane bond item instead of familiar, the strongest benefit of that continues to go up with your caster level.
Edit: For the record, you do get domain spell slots and specialty school slots (a change from the Beta version).
Per
http://nethys.karuikage.net/traits.htm"Magical Knack" is not legal for organized play.
Let me resurrect this thread.
I have a Druid3/specialist wizard3/MTx
can i?
1. still swap out druid spells for SNA of any level or just spell levels 1 and 2 (my spell levels gained as a druid)
2. If I take a domain, do I get the domain spell slot for each level of MT, and the extra domain spell known, or just spells levels 1 and 2? (My spell levels gained as a druid)
3. Do I gain the specialists wizard extra spells slot per day for each level of MT, or just levels 1 and 2? (Spell levels gained as a wizard)
4. I know domain powers based a cleric levels (druid levels) and not caster levels will not advance.
5. I know that none of the other wizard abilities will advance, and druid abilities... I know I dont get 2 spells in my spellbook with MT levels..
thanks
1. yes you can.
2. yes you do.3. yes you do.
4. you are correct.
5. if you have any wizard of druid abilities that depend on caster level they advance, if not (which is more likely) they don't. Now about the 2 free spells, it's not clear in the rules about that but i say give them, it's just too much trouble (finding them and time needed mostly), also the sorcerers gain spells known.
Let me resurrect this thread.
I have a Druid3/specialist wizard3/MTx
can i?
1. still swap out druid spells for SNA of any level or just spell levels 1 and 2 (my spell levels gained as a druid)
2. If I take a domain, do I get the domain spell slot for each level of MT, and the extra domain spell known, or just spells levels 1 and 2? (My spell levels gained as a druid)
3. Do I gain the specialists wizard extra spells slot per day for each level of MT, or just levels 1 and 2? (Spell levels gained as a wizard)
4. I know domain powers based a cleric levels (druid levels) and not caster levels will not advance.
5. I know that none of the other wizard abilities will advance, and druid abilities... I know I dont get 2 spells in my spellbook with MT levels..
thanks
1. yes you can.
2. yes you do.
3. yes you do.
4. you are correct.
5. if you have any wizard of druid abilities that depend on caster level they advance, if not (which is more likely) they don't. Now about the 2 free spells, it's not clear in the rules about that but i say give them, it's just too much trouble (finding them and time needed mostly), also the sorcerers gain spells known.
where did you find the yes answers? I ask, because I see them as class abilities and thus dont go up. Have a soon to be MT in PFS and would love it if this was official and not opinion.
where did you find the yes answers? I ask, because I see them as class abilities and thus dont go up. Have a soon to be MT in PFS and would love it if this was official and not opinion.
Ok, about 1. the ability to spontaneously convert any spell to a summon nature's ally is part of a druid's spellcasting ability and has nothing to do with druid levels, keep in mind that you can only convert memorized druid levels and not wizard spells (not even domain spells but i am not sure about that).
About 2. from the moment you gain bonus domain spells at every level a cleric would have gained and the cleric gains them according to this table every time he gains a level which advances his spellcasting ability.The same logic applies about 3.
These answers can be deducted from the MT's ability to increase your spellcasting level of both classes and in druid's and wizard's spellcasting ability descriptions, the domain thing is deducted from the druid's entry about domains (which directs you ot the cleric) and then the cleric's description about domains.
About 5. you must the DM.
Hope i helped.
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I have a Pathfinder Society Organized Play character that is a Mystic Theurge.
He has 3 levels of Cleric (of Pharasma) with the Healing and Repose Domain.
He also has 3 levels of Wizard (Necromancy specialist).
And finally he has 5 levels of Mystic Theurge.
What has remained at 3rd level and not advanced
Channel Positive energy is at 3rd level ability (turn undead as well)
The Domain abilities for Healing and Repose are at 3rd level
Rebuke death and Gentle rest.
Necromancy: Command undead feat 3rd level
Ability for necromancer Grave touch 3rd level
What has advanced and “stacked” with my mystic theurge levels
My character has gotten +1 level of existing arcane spell casting class and +1 level of existing divine spell casting class. The text says this encompasses spells per day, Spells Known, and caster level.
The text however is silent on weather I can spontaneously cast cure spells.
It is also silent on weather I get to add the two free spells to my characters wizard spell book as I advance or if my progression in Domain spells and Wizard school speciality slots continue.
I have continued to spontaneously cast cure spell I have assumed that that is part of your +1 level of existing divine class. I have also continued to add the domain slot spells, and the specialty school spell slot as well. I have assumed that those things are part of your “spells per day” progression” I have continued to add the two spells to my spell book for free at every level I have advanced in mystic theurge that would be part of your “spells known” advancement as well.
None of the GMs in the PFS games I have played in have either commented nor had a problem with this.
While this isn’t official, it isn’t completely off base.
I would say that your spontaneous casting of Summon Nature’s ally spells would progress with your mystic theurge levels.
I would also say that your access to Domain spells would continue as well.
How ever you are correct that none of your other abilities will advance.
I hope this is helpful.
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Last time Jacobs ruled on this... spontaneous casters continue to gain spells known, but no wizard freebie spells for advancing in a PrC.
5. if you have any wizard of druid abilities that depend on caster level they advance, if not (which is more likely) they don't. Now about the 2 free spells, it's not clear in the rules about that but i say give them, it's just too much trouble (finding them and time needed mostly), also the sorcerers gain spells known.
Further to this, prestige classes don't give the two free wizard spells per level per the FAQ.
I have a Pathfinder Society Organized Play character that is a Mystic Theurge. (snip)
I have continued to add the two spells to my spell book for free at every level I have advanced in mystic theurge that would be part of your “spells known” advancement as well.
None of the GMs in the PFS games I have played in have either commented nor had a problem with this.
My experience is that PFS GMs tend to have a stronger rules basis (both knowledge and willingness to apply) than the average bear. If a wide variety of PFS GMs don't call a player on a questionable rule that comes up at the table, it is a pretty good indication, even if not definitive. However, unless it comes up in discussion, the details about character build that happens behind the scenes, such as what spells are in your spellbook, are never gonna come up at the table. In any case, as cited above, the spellbook additions are not part of prestige class spell progression.
Further to this, prestige classes don't give the two free wizard spells per level per the FAQ.
Thank you for that, i am of the opinion that a wizard should get those 2 free spells but it's good to know the RAW.
If am am an abjurer with banned evocation and illusion, as soon as I
enter MT, I can memorize fireball and major image freely? Are my first
3 wizard levels specialized and all the others not? I can memorize
evocation and illusion spells that are level 3+, but not level 1 or 2?If I am a cleric with the healing and repose domain, and I enter MT,
do I only get domain slots for 1st and 2nd level spells, and not the
rest?It seems really complicated, and a lot to keep track off. I would be
under the impression, and have always played that you do. However, the
opposite of that is if I took the animal companion, It would stop
leveling as soon as a PrC out. If I took a familiar as an arcane bond,
it would stop leveling as a PrC out, but couldn't I use the bonded
object to cast any spell in my spellbook, or just the spells I knew
before I PrC'd out?RAW per srd "A cleric gains one domain spell slot for each
level of cleric spell she can cast, from 1st on up.RAW per srd "Each time a character attains a new wizard level,
he gains two spells of his choice to add to his spellbook." This one
we know is offical.RAW per srd "In addition, specialist wizards receive an
additional spell slot of each spell level he can cast, from 1st on up.
Each day, a wizard can prepare a spell from his specialty
school in that slot."RAW per srd "When a new mystic theurge level is gained, the character
gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in any one
arcane spellcasting class (specialist wizard) he belonged to before he
added the prestige class and any one divine spellcasting class
(cleric) he belonged to previously.thoughts?
When a new mystic theurge level is gained, the character gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in any one arcane spellcasting class (specialist wizard) he belonged to before he added the prestige class and any one divine spellcasting class (cleric) he belonged to previously.
So essentally when a mystic theurge gets new levels he gets to substitute the words cleric and wizard with the word mystic theurge on the above example and citation you provided.
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Aventar, to answer your question, when I have laid out on a piece of paper, the arcane wizard spells my character has memorized I note which spell at each level is in the “necromancy slot” and for the Clerical spells which my character has prepared, I note which spell is in the “domain slot”. I think your Arcane school specialty spell slot, and your domain spell slot are part of your “spells per day” so I think you get them as you progress through Mystic Theurge. I have been adding them to my character as I have advanced. So the short answer I think is yes.
Avenstar, in addition to the character sheet, I have used the “user profile” pages on Paizo’s site, to store a backup of my character online.
If you would like to see my character and how I built him, do a search for Fatum Aedituus Venificus, ( Fatum Aedituus Venificus Im trying to add a link) which is my character’s name, and you can take a look at my character, and some of the mistakes I made when making it, namely choosing Transmutation and Conjuration as “opposition school” to his necromancy.
Howie23 thank you for providing that link. So it seems that a wizard does not get his two free spells as he advances in levels of mystic theurge.
In terms of my PFS character, this is a done deal. Since I haven’t marked in my character’s spell book which spells he got “for free” while leveling, and which ones he added through the purchase of scrolls, and scribing them into his spell book, it isn’t possible for me to correct this mistake. Besides he only has two more scenarios before he hits level 12, and then retires that is unless I get the opportunity to play through the “eyes of the ten” story arc.
Howie23 admittedly, the question of whether my character continued to get either his spell slots for his necromancy specialty, or his domain spells never came up at the variety of tables I played at. I never thought to ask. There are instances that I remember where I said something like “I’m burning a Dimensional Anchor spell for a Cure Critical Wounds spell, or I’m casting another Spectral hands spell, I have another one in my necromancer spell slot, or I’m going to cast a Speak with dead spell, and another player asked, “you have that memorized?” and my reply was “yes in my domain slot, I have the repose domain” or After the true strike spell I cast last round, with the bless spell, in place, I’m going to nail this sucker with an enervation spell. I didn’t stick that spell in my necromancy spell slot for nothing. “ The PFS GMs never batted an eye. Perhaps that is because there is nothing unusual about a Mystic-Theurge unloading a bucket full of spells.
Now in a home game, where I am running the game, I will certainly disregard James Jacob’s ruling about whether a mystic theurge gets his two free wizard spells from leveling. In my opinion, to be fair and balanced, if a sorcerer gets new “spells Known” when he advances in a level of Mystic Theurg, then it makes logical sense that a mystic theurge who was a wizard, gets his two free spells for advancing in levels. In my mind they are equivalent.
I apologize for the long rant.
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Howie23 thank you for providing that link.
In terms of my PFS character, this is a done deal.
You're welcome.
As for the existing character's spellbook, I can see one of two ways that I would handle it were I in your shoes. One would be to either lop off spells from the spellbook based on the max level spells I could have taken, and the other would be to pay for scrolls and scribing cost on the same basis. In PFS, I'm not sure the math works out for that re: PA, but suspect it does.
For example, if character is cleric 3/wizard 3/MT5 at 11th level, what's at question are the 10 spells from leveling up MT5. I would have generally taken 2 2nd, 4 3rd, and 4th level spells for those slots to get the best value. I either get rid of that many spells from my book or I pay for them to be in the book.
I enjoy playing MTs. They provide some synergies that aren't otherwise available at times. I hope you've enjoyed yours to date, as well as the rest of his career.
MYSTIC THEURGE?!
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Howie23 thank you for providing that link.
In terms of my PFS character, this is a done deal.
You're welcome.
As for the existing character's spellbook, I can see one of two ways that I would handle it were I in your shoes. One would be to either lop off spells from the spellbook based on the max level spells I could have taken, and the other would be to pay for scrolls and scribing cost on the same basis. In PFS, I'm not sure the math works out for that re: PA, but suspect it does.
For example, if character is cleric 3/wizard 3/MT5 at 11th level, what's at question are the 10 spells from leveling up MT5. I would have generally taken 2 2nd, 4 3rd, and 4th level spells for those slots to get the best value. I either get rid of that many spells from my book or I pay for them to be in the book.
I enjoy playing MTs. They provide some synergies that aren't otherwise available at times. I hope you've enjoyed yours to date, as well as the rest of his career.
Howie23, yeah I like Mystic Theurges too. Using Spectral hand to deliver cure spells is fun; As is Haste Prayer, Slow, Bless, Bane, and after five rounds if the monster is still up, time to break out the teleport scroll
its also fun to stock up on such utility spells as see invisibility, Dark vision, Invisibility purge, speak with dead, etc. and unusual ones such as heroism, arcane eye, otiluke's resiliant sphere, shadow conjuration etc.
I have enjoyed my character.
I suppose i could rip 10 spells out of the spell book....ack ripping a book blasphemy... and yes I probably took 2 2nd 4 third and 4 fourth level spells. Hmm there are my chronicle sheets, I suppose i could cross reference what scrolls i have purchased with what spells are in the spell book. grrr, Im gonna need to cast a restoration spell on myself to deal with the wisdom and intelligence drain this problem will cause. Its making my head hurt....there is always tomorrow. now where did i put that "modify memory " scroll? hmm i cant seem to find it.
this is a problem for another day.
howie23 thanks for your sugestions
oh Meatrace too funny :)
Last time Jacobs ruled on this... spontaneous casters continue to gain spells known, but no wizard freebie spells for advancing in a PrC.
5. if you have any wizard of druid abilities that depend on caster level they advance, if not (which is more likely) they don't. Now about the 2 free spells, it's not clear in the rules about that but i say give them, it's just too much trouble (finding them and time needed mostly), also the sorcerers gain spells known.
He wasnt ruling on the Mystic Theurge I am willing to bet but PrC's in general. The fact of the matter is that the Mystic Theurge specifically states that spells known are included, it does not state only spells known for the divine side. I would see this as a class feature specific to the Mystic Theurge.