What is the SR of a Paladin's "Celestial" Mount??

[RiTz21]

At 11th level, the Paladin's mount acquires the Celestial template. In the Bestiary Preview #1 (and I assume the Bestiary as well), the Celestial template says that the Spell Resistance for a Celestial creature is:

SR gains SR equal to new CR +5;

So the Spell Resistance of the Mount (for an 11th level Paladin) is "CR+5".... so the Challenge Rating +5.

What VALUE is CR derived from? How can I compute it?

I need the value of "CR" to be able to compute the value of the Spell Resistance!!

Thanks!

RiTz21
http://TheOnlySheet.com

[James Risner]

RiTz21 wrote:

At 11th level, the Paladin's mount acquires the Celestial template.

Ignore the Celestial template (for SR) for the Paladin Mount, use the 3.p rules on page 63 of PRPG Core rulebook (which has a formula.)

[Imper1um]

For ALL Familiars and Animal Companions, it's CR is your HD.

[Jellyfulfish]

Imper1um wrote:

For ALL Familiars and Animal Companions, it's CR is your HD.

You say a class feature (animal companions and familiars) has a CR=Master's HD. Where said master is probably only made of PC levels, so it's CR = effective character level.

So you encounter a level 10 druid and it's animal companion, the Encounter level is calculated as two CR 10 creatures?

I don't get it.

CR=HD obviously doesn't work for multi-class masters either.

[Dragonborn3]

Perhaps it is talking about the mount's CR? What is the Cr of a 12d8 Heavy warhorse?

[Imper1um]

Jellyfulfish wrote:

Imper1um wrote:

For ALL Familiars and Animal Companions, it's CR is your HD.

You say a class feature (animal companions and familiars) has a CR=Master's HD. Where said master is probably only made of PC levels, so it's CR = effective character level.

So you encounter a level 10 druid and it's animal companion, the Encounter level is calculated as two CR 10 creatures?

I don't get it.

CR=HD obviously doesn't work for multi-class masters either.

This is incorrect. If you encounter a Level 10 Druid with a Level 10 Companion, they are considered a CL 10. The reasoning is that Extra Creatures (Read: Summoned, Animal Companions and Split Monsters) do not count as part of the Challenge Rating.

It's all calculated as part of the Encounter. You NEVER Count Summoned/Extra Creatures. It's expected to occur, so it's included in the Challenge Rating. If they don't get the summon off or if the Animal Companion is doing something else, they lucked out and get the CR Still. It's an easier encounter, but it's still the same CR because of it.

As for the HD of the Monster. It's an Animal Companion. Both it's Hit Dice and it's Effective Challenge Rating is your Paladin Level or Character Level. I'm not too sure about the Rules on Multi-classing and Animal Companion advancement. But, if you single class, it's HD and CR is your Character Level, no doubt.

[RiTz21]

James Risner wrote:

Ignore the Celestial template (for SR) for the Paladin Mount, use the 3.p rules on page 63 of PRPG Core rulebook (which has a formula.)

Perhaps you are correct - the Paladin's Mount does NOT gain the Spell Resistance from its Celestial Template at Paladin level 11, but rather when the Paladin gets to 15th level... This should be noted as an exception in the Rules assuming that this is what the Author inferred...

I am tempted to report this as a discrepancy/error! I'll check the Bestiary once I can buy it.

RiTz21
http://TheOnlySheet.com

[James Risner]

Imper1um wrote:

For ALL Familiars and Animal Companions, it's CR is your HD.

He is asking about the Mount's CR, which is defined in the Paladin write up.

As for the Familiar/AC using the formula you suggest, I'm not aware of where that rule exists. Page ref?

Dragonborn3 wrote:

Perhaps it is talking about the mount's CR? What is the Cr of a 12d8 Heavy warhorse?

The Mount's CR is defined in the Paladin writeup as I suggested above.

RiTz21 wrote:

Perhaps you are correct - the Paladin's Mount does NOT gain the Spell Resistance from its Celestial Template at Paladin level 11, but rather when the Paladin gets to 15th level

Unfortunately, there is one other alternate interpretation. It takes the SR of (CR+5) until Paladin 15th level, which is often SR 6.

[RiTz21]

James Risner wrote:

Unfortunately, there is one other alternate interpretation. It takes the SR of (CR+5) until Paladin 15th level, which is often SR 6.

The Mount is an Animal Companion for the Paladin - so for an 11th level Paladin, the Mount has 9 HD...(CRB, Table 3-8, page 52)

Would it truly be a CR1 creature?? How do you come by that conclusion? Is it based on a rule somewhere?

RiTz21
http://TheOnlySheet.com

[James Risner]

RiTz21 wrote:

Would it truly be a CR1 creature?? How do you come by that conclusion? Is it based on a rule somewhere?

I'm in error, but I came to CR 1 by looking up Horse in the Bestiary.

The additional HD would grant additional CR based on the Bestiary rules in the back of the book. So using the A.C. rules for more HD to factor into the CR would be more accurate RAW.

[RiTz21]

How about this: According to the Celestial entry (here) it says:

Quote:

Celestial creatures dwell in the higher planes, but can be summoned using spells such as summon monster and planar ally. A celestial creature’s CR increases by +1 only if the base creature has 5 or more HD.

So by that rule, a "horse" (CR1) for a 11th level paladin would gain +1 to its CR for being 9HD. So with that horse equal to CR2, the Spell Resistance would be 2+5=7!

When the Paladin gets to level 15, the SR of his mount would gain a significant increase as per the RAW.

Does this makes sense? This is the last tidbit I need to implement to release the next update to my Character Sheet Tool!

RiTz21
http://TheOnlySheet.com

[James Risner]

RiTz21 wrote:

So by that rule, a "horse" (CR1) for a 11th level paladin would gain +1 to its CR for being 9HD. So with that horse equal to CR2, the Spell Resistance would be 2+5=7!

When the Paladin gets to level 15, the SR of his mount would gain a significant increase as per the RAW.

Does this makes sense?

Yes, I believe that is both what the rules say (RAW) and what is the intent of the rules (RAI.)

Others may have alternate interpretations.