Leveling

[Lefty X]

Per page 30:

1)Select new class level. You must already qualify for this based on previously gained abilites, etc.
2)Apply Ability Score increase due to Character Level gain.
3)Integrate all of that classes' abilities from that level and roll for hit points.
4)Add new skills and feats.

Question: Does the "feats" in step 4 refer to both those from class gains and Character Level gain? ie, if my character just made 7th level fighter and I want to use my odd numbered Character Level feat to get a feat with +7 BAB is it legit?

Thanks ahead of time.

[Abraham spalding]

Yes since you have a BAB of +7 at the time you gained the feat (due to the fact that the class level you gain first gives you another point of BAB).

Think about it this way: A first level fighter can take a feat with a BAB requirement of +1. Why? Because they already have a BAB of +1!

[Jabor]

Yes, it refers to both ordinary feats from character-level progression as well as bonus feats from class levels in classes which grant them.

[Frogboy]

I've always played this way too, although, I never really knew if it was correct or not.

[Dennis da Ogre]

FWIW prestige classes you have to meet the prereqs before you take the class and you don't get the +X BAB/ whatever until after you level. So A feat with a +7 BAB could be taken by a 7th level character (assuming full BAB) a prestige class with +7 BAB prereq can't be taken until 8th level because you have to meet the prereq before taking the class.

Not really pertinent but I thought worth mentioning because it's a touch confusing.

[Zurai]

For what it's worth, I don't think it really matters all that much which order you follow the steps in as long as "Choose which class to advance in" is #1. I've always allowed players to spend skill ranks before taking feats, in the case of feats that require X ranks in a skill, and spend feats before taking skill ranks, in case of cross-class skills in 3.5, on the same character (for example). Hell, the same level. It really doesn't materially affect the game and it makes leveling up less of a pain in the ass if you don't have to worry about following a rigid step-by-step process.

[Frogboy]

Dennis da Ogre wrote:

FWIW prestige classes you have to meet the prereqs before you take the class and you don't get the +X BAB/ whatever until after you level. So A feat with a +7 BAB could be taken by a 7th level character (assuming full BAB) a prestige class with +7 BAB prereq can't be taken until 8th level because you have to meet the prereq before taking the class.

Not really pertinent but I thought worth mentioning because it's a touch confusing.

This I certainly follow. Otherwise, you'd actually be using your PrC to meet the prereqs to take the PrC. It would be kind of a paradox.

[Brian Carpenter]

Lefty X wrote:

Per page 30:

1)Select new class level. You must already qualify for this based on previously gained abilites, etc.
2)Apply Ability Score increase due to Character Level gain.
3)Integrate all of that classes' abilities from that level and roll for hit points.
4)Add new skills and feats.

Is the ability score increase a +1 to a single ability score? I can't find the answer to this question in the rulebook.

[ZappoHisbane]

Frogboy wrote:

Dennis da Ogre wrote:

FWIW prestige classes you have to meet the prereqs before you take the class and you don't get the +X BAB/ whatever until after you level. So A feat with a +7 BAB could be taken by a 7th level character (assuming full BAB) a prestige class with +7 BAB prereq can't be taken until 8th level because you have to meet the prereq before taking the class.

Not really pertinent but I thought worth mentioning because it's a touch confusing.

This I certainly follow. Otherwise, you'd actually be using your PrC to meet the prereqs to take the PrC. It would be kind of a paradox.

Note that this is a change from 3.5. While you still had to have all skill and BAB prerequisites before entering the PRC, you could take a required feat at the same time as your first level in the PRC.

[James Risner]

Brian Carpenter wrote:

Is the ability score increase a +1 to a single ability score? I can't find the answer to this question in the rulebook.

Yes

ZappoHisbane wrote:

Note that this is a change from 3.5. While you still had to have all skill and BAB prerequisites before entering the PRC, you could take a required feat at the same time as your first level in the PRC.

No, in 3.5 you had to have all the pre-reqs for a class before taking the class.

But you are thinking of the rule in 3.5 that you can take two feats in the same level that have each other as pre-reqs. Like taking a feat that requires Power Attack in the same level that you take Power Attack.

[kyrt-ryder]

James Risner wrote:

Brian Carpenter wrote:

Is the ability score increase a +1 to a single ability score? I can't find the answer to this question in the rulebook.

Yes

ZappoHisbane wrote:

Note that this is a change from 3.5. While you still had to have all skill and BAB prerequisites before entering the PRC, you could take a required feat at the same time as your first level in the PRC.

No, in 3.5 you had to have all the pre-reqs for a class before taking the class.

But you are thinking of the rule in 3.5 that you can take two feats in the same level that have each other as pre-reqs. Like taking a feat that requires Power Attack in the same level that you take Power Attack.

Actually, what he's referring to is the leveling process, or at least how both he and I viewed it in 3.5.

You see, as I remember (and I could be wrong) you applied all benefits of natural levels (Ability score increases and natural level feats) before selecting a class. Ergo if a class required... spring attack, and you took spring attack with your 6th level feat, you could take the class that required spring attack because you qualified for it based on the natural leveling process.

[James Risner]

kyrt-ryder wrote:

Actually, what he's referring to is the leveling process, or at least how both he and I viewed it in 3.5.

Not how I remember it, book page number?