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In a campaign I am currently involved with, the party has a Cleric with the Animal domain who has an advanced crocodile as an animal companion. This creature has an ability called 'death roll' that I cannot seem to find any information on. I'm sure it will be fleshed out further in the Bestiary, but having this information now would be quite helpful to that player.
Can any of the Paizo staff shed some light on this mystery? Thanks.
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Little-known Fact: crocodiles in Golarion mastered the ancient Thassilonian techniques for baking tasty breakfast pastries that explode 2d4 rounds after they're eaten.
You read it here first.
(Incidentally, welcome to the Paizo boards. If Lilith comes around and offers you cookies, hers will not explode.)
Why not just use the SRD croc, convert it to Pathfinder (basically Perception, CMB and CMD) then apply the advanced template to it from the preview bestiary. Bestiary should be out in a month.
I'm sure the details of the death pastry will be revealed soon enough.
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Purely because the PF advanced croc already has those abilities, AS WELL AS sprint and death roll. Sprint is well-documented in other sources, but death roll is not. If the croc gets the ability, the player wants that ability. Simple as that.
And As DM you can tell him until I see it in writing you wait... simple as that.
--Vrock the boat!
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If only I was DM! I'm merely a player in this game, but the player of the cleric is currently debating if Pathfinder is worth converting over to (he currently runs a popular 3.5 game). Naturally I want to give him the best impression possible, as I've done everything in my power to convert those I game with to the new PF ruleset.
But having a book that talks about rules that aren't yet available is not giving him the right impression! I think its great that Paizo included the Druid animal companion information in the book, but I wish that all pertinent information was included as well. What does exist a nice reference, but without detailing the abilities, it seems incomplete.
... I think its great that Paizo included the Druid animal companion information in the book, but I wish that all pertinent information was included as well. What does exist a nice reference, but without detailing the abilities, it seems incomplete.
Death Roll (Ex): If a crocodile has successfully used its improved grab ability and dragged its opponent into the water it may attempt a death roll. The crocodile rolls his CMB at a +5 bonus and if successful does automatic bite damage to the target. In addition the target must succeed on a DC14 Fort save or become dazed for one round. The save DC is Constitution based.
Obviously its not official, but it seems pretty close to a what a death roll is suppose to do. =) Should at least hold you over until the official book comes out next month.
The Death Roll performed by real world Crocs is a means to rip large chunks of flesh from a creature (such as a person's limb). The crocodile grabs with thier mouth and then rolls to tear flesh from the target.
I would allow a croc to grapple with a bite. The next round they can attempt a CMB check to automatically deal triple bite damage with the death roll.
Death Roll (Ex): If a crocodile has successfully used its improved grab ability...
I know that much is correct, that is how all of the Improved Grapple secondary abilities work.
A minor villain, Gaedren Lamm, in Curse of the Crimson Throne(Chapter 1) has a Croc for his animal companion and I believe they MIGHT actually detail this special attack. I do know our DM mentioned that being grappled by the Croc for longer than the initial round was a BAD thing. Sharks may or may not have something similar, the 3.5E SRD doesn't say.
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I know that much is correct. A minor villain, Gaedren Lamm, in Curse of the Crimson Throne(Chapter 1) has a Croc for his animal companion and I believe they MIGHT actually detail this special attack. I do know our DM mentioned that being grappled by the Croc for longer than the initial round was a BAD thing. Sharks may or may not have something similar, the 3.5E SRD doesn't say.
Death Roll (Ex): If a crocodile has successfully used its improved grab ability...
They don't detail it there, but they mention that it will drag you down into the water and start drowning you.
Hopefully a Paizo person can come along and give the official skinny.
Creative Director
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Death roll is a new ability we gave crocodiles in the PFRPG Bestiary, due out in October. One of the things we really tried to do with several animals and vermin was to try to give them some more interesting abilities and attacks, based on how those creatures perform in real life.
The crocodile's death roll essentially consists of it grabbing a foe and then tucking in its legs and rolling rapidly, twisting off arms and legs and tearing the heck out of whatever it's grabbed on to. If I remember how the ability works right, it essentially inflicts bite damage again (kind of like constriction) and subjects the victim to a trip attempt.
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Thanks for the response James! Combining a few responses, it seems the best way to handle it is that if a Croc succeeds on a bite attack it basically gets the grab ability, in that it does both bite damage as well as tripping automatically. As long as it can hold the grab, the target is both prone as well as takes automatic bite damage every round.
That makes it measurably better than a wolf, though with its speed it is more limited than a wolf. I like it.
Thanks again to everyone who responded. I think we have enough to go off of to satisfy the player until the Bestiary is released.
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Death roll is a new ability we gave crocodiles in the PFRPG Bestiary, due out in October. One of the things we really tried to do with several animals and vermin was to try to give them some more interesting abilities and attacks, based on how those creatures perform in real life.
The crocodile's death roll essentially consists of it grabbing a foe and then tucking in its legs and rolling rapidly, twisting off arms and legs and tearing the heck out of whatever it's grabbed on to. If I remember how the ability works right, it essentially inflicts bite damage again (kind of like constriction) and subjects the victim to a trip attempt.
How dare you apply real world logic to my fantasy game! In my campaign, "death roll" means crocodiles can play snare drums to kill their prey. ;)