This is a request, spun off from the "next 4 core classes" thread, that Paizo reconsider the use of the word "core" for supplementary content.
A specific, consistent core has a great deal of value. First, it creates useful shorthand for a common set of rules elements and assumptions. There is real utility in being able to declare my game core and everyone knowing exactly what that means. Second, it keeps the barrier to entry for Pathfinder Monthly and Pathfinder Moduless minimal, which is good for both those products, and for the Pathfinder brand as a whole. Diluting the meaning of core by calling subsequent content (base-class or otherwise) "core" destroys this value, while serving no useful purpose I can discern.
So, please, Paizo: Make additional mechanics if you must. But keep the meaning of the term "core" what it should be: A reference to the core rules.
Heh, Bugley, you went for a very touchy-feely thread title. :) I guess I'd like to back up and ask, how is Paizo using the word "core"? Is there a single, coherent, "canonical" usage in the Pf role-playing game, and if so, what is it?
I guess my question could be viewed as overly basic, but I'm wired to start from there.
Creative Director
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Heh, Bugley, you went for a very touchy-feely thread title. :) I guess I'd like to back up and ask, how is Paizo using the word "core"? Is there a single, coherent, "canonical" usage in the Pf role-playing game, and if so, what is it?
I guess my question could be viewed as overly basic, but I'm wired to start from there.
We're still figuring that out. Don't get too worked up or freaked out by anything we say, in other words. :-)
Basically: "Core" at this point means "the rules you need to have and have to buy in order to understand and comprehend any Paizo product." That's LIKELY going to only include the PFRPG core Rulebook and the Bestiary, but maybe not. We don't know yet.
We'll probably end up calling the 20-level additional classes "Base" classes or something like that, but we've got a lot on our plates right now and I hope folk will forgive us if we get confusing now and then.
We're still figuring that out. Don't get too worked up or freaked out by anything we say, in other words. :-)Basically: "Core" at this point means "the rules you need to have and have to buy in order to understand and comprehend any Paizo product." That's LIKELY going to only include the PFRPG core Rulebook and the Bestiary, but maybe not. We don't know yet.
We'll probably end up calling the 20-level additional classes "Base" classes or something like that, but we've got a lot on our plates right now and I hope folk will forgive us if we get confusing now and then.
I'll keep my fingers crossed. Would it help if I promised to buy you a cookie? :)
BTW, I'm sure I'm overly sensitive over what WotC did to "core" with 4E; I hope I wasn't overly harsh.
Thanks JJ, I'll try to keep my freaking out to a minimum. :o
I find it really helpful to get these technical terms nailed down tight, but I understand if this is where we are for now.
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Heh, Bugley, you went for a very touchy-feely thread title. :) I guess I'd like to back up and ask, how is Paizo using the word "core"? Is there a single, coherent, "canonical" usage in the Pf role-playing game, and if so, what is it?
I guess my question could be viewed as overly basic, but I'm wired to start from there.
We're still figuring that out. Don't get too worked up or freaked out by anything we say, in other words. :-)
Basically: "Core" at this point means "the rules you need to have and have to buy in order to understand and comprehend any Paizo product." That's LIKELY going to only include the PFRPG core Rulebook and the Bestiary, but maybe not. We don't know yet.
We'll probably end up calling the 20-level additional classes "Base" classes or something like that, but we've got a lot on our plates right now and I hope folk will forgive us if we get confusing now and then.
What you are not going to be inhumanly perfect all the time? I mean what kind of business are you running over there? Obviously not one run but AI androids, i am so disappointed. :D
Yeah i am being a smart ass.
Heh, Bugley, you went for a very touchy-feely thread title. :) I guess I'd like to back up and ask, how is Paizo using the word "core"? Is there a single, coherent, "canonical" usage in the Pf role-playing game, and if so, what is it?
I guess my question could be viewed as overly basic, but I'm wired to start from there.
I'm wired the same way. I'd like for it to specifically mean (PFRPG + PF Bestiary) for the reasons I've mentioned above.
And yeah, I've been really trying to moderate my tone lately. I often come back a monthly later and go "Wow, I'm a Dick(tm)," even when I feel my point was perfectly valid. There's just no cause for that. :)
Hey, is that (tm) meant as some kind of a slam? ;P
Some of my intellectual training is in analytical philosophy, so I really like definitions. In my free time, I'd rather not have to ask, wait, do you mean Core1 or Core2? Does Core1 include Core2 and 3? etc.
Basically: "Core" at this point means "the rules you need to have and have to buy in order to understand and comprehend any Paizo product." That's LIKELY going to only include the PFRPG core Rulebook and the Bestiary, but maybe not. We don't know yet.
Does this imply that there will not be a free SRD style rules reference?
Hey, is that (tm) meant as some kind of a slam? ;P
Until you said that (and I re-read your name twice), I'd never seen the {tm} in your name.
Spot (err, sorry...Perception) check failure!
Shoot! I gave it away.
In my free time, I'd rather not have to ask, wait, do you mean Core1 or Core2? Does Core1 include Core2 and 3? etc.
Selecting RPG products should not require Venn diagrams. :)
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Chief Technical Officer
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Does this imply that there will not be a free SRD style rules reference?
Basically: "Core" at this point means "the rules you need to have and have to buy in order to understand and comprehend any Paizo product." That's LIKELY going to only include the PFRPG core Rulebook and the Bestiary, but maybe not. We don't know yet.
It doesn't imply that at all.
Does this imply that there will not be a free SRD style rules reference?
Basically: "Core" at this point means "the rules you need to have and have to buy in order to understand and comprehend any Paizo product." That's LIKELY going to only include the PFRPG core Rulebook and the Bestiary, but maybe not. We don't know yet.
To me it implied it will only count as 'core" for books you must have to be able to play. Not ones ya just want to use but "core" should only be the ones you HAVE to have. IMHO
Obviously not one run but AI androids, i am so disappointed. :D
Yeah i am being a smart ass.
Hey, I've known lots of people in my line who were artificially intelligent, and as far as I know, not a one was an android.
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Creative Director
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So is the Gamemastery Guide going to count as a core rulebook?
(The chase rules, new traps, and 100+ NPC stat blocks sound like things that'll get referenced in APs all the time.)
Again... we don't know yet.
At this point, the only core products are the PFRPG and the Bestiary. Stay tuned to paizo.com for developments as we figure them out.
So is the Gamemastery Guide going to count as a core rulebook?
(The chase rules, new traps, and 100+ NPC stat blocks sound like things that'll get referenced in APs all the time.)
I think it won't be counted as a core rulebook.
I'm saying that they will use those rules in other books. They're doing it all the time already, with their own stuff and with decent stuff from other sources.
I'm also saying that since it is open content, you can reference it yourself in other products or web pages.
There's already pages out there that have a lot of pathfinder stuff, maybe all of it.
No need to expand the "core" beyond the "core".
In fact, I wouldn't mind if only the PFRPG Core rulebook would be defined as core.
Does this imply that there will not be a free SRD style rules reference?
Basically: "Core" at this point means "the rules you need to have and have to buy in order to understand and comprehend any Paizo product." That's LIKELY going to only include the PFRPG core Rulebook and the Bestiary, but maybe not. We don't know yet.
Ah toyrobots, you should know there is and will be a free srd style rules reference!